Will Putin Invade Ukraine?

[Shiranu]

One of about 6 Slavic youtubers/Twitch...ers?... I watch, really painful to hear how just how ashamed he is to be Russian when it is not his, or his people's, fault. The Russian people are perhaps one of the most historically oppressed (mostly by their own) peoples throughout history, so as much as I despise Russia the political entity... the only strong feeling I have for them is sorrow.

[Hydra009]

As an American, I can certainly sympathize with him.

It's been strange watching protests against the illegal occupation of Ukraine in Israel of all places.  There was a little blurb about George W Bush talking about the "unprovoked and unjustified invasion" of Ukraine.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CBA6ev5HMe4

[Cassia]

https://youtu.be/TgrsxinwUeA

[Hydra009]

Now that it's clear that the Ukrainians are holding their own, they're up for a fresh round of arms shipments.

Germany: 1000 anti-tank weapons (panzerabwehrwaffen) and 500 Stinger-class surface-to-air missiles
Netherlands:  200 Stinger anti-aircraft missiles
Czech Republic:  machine guns, assault rifles, small arms (worth $8.6 million)
Belgium: 3800 tonnes of fuel, 2000 machine guns
Slovakia:  artillery ammunition and fuel (worth $12.39 million)
US: third round of arms shipments, this one including anti-aircraft, anti-armor, small arms, body armor, various munitions (worth $350 million)
EU: seeking to coordinate new arms shipments on behalf of 27 nations

[Shiranu]

I don't pray, but tonight I just might.

[Hydra009]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ef4YeB_Zbz0

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8Exjv_VMkNw

lol, I'm actually kinda starting to feel bad for the Russians.

[Shiranu]

lol, I'm actually kinda starting to feel bad for the Russians.

The sense of humor of the Ukrainians has been inspiring... well, the Ukrainians in general. I truly believe the world would be a better place if it had a lot more of them in it.

Before tonight, I did too; the kids who are there now are just that... kids. Putin seems to be sending all the old Soviet junk with the youngest, most ignorant soldiers to soak up fire and get rid of the trash before moving in with the real human rights and war crime shit. Any Russians who come in after that first wave though, I have no more sympathy for. They have had time to defect or surrender, as many have already. If they want to keep going, then they have made their own bed.

https://www.pravda.com.ua/eng/news/2022/02/26/7326201/

In Kharkiv region, Ukrainian defenders found internationally banned cluster bombs with butterfly mines (the so-called "Lepestok" mines).

"They are dropping cluster bombs with ‘Lepestok’ mines. Their colour may vary. They are about the size of a finger. If you step on one, it will blow your leg off."

Venedyktova explained that ‘Lepestok’ mines are a type of explosives banned by the Geneva Convention.

According to her, this kind of weaponry had devastating effects when used in various armed conflicts of the 20th century.

Then these things have been spotted moving in Ukraine... if they fire these into a city, the collateral damage is going to be fucking horrific.

[Hydra009]

Geneva Convention violations.  I feel significantly less bad.

Imho, any Russian soldier who sets foot in Ukraine deserves whatever happens to them.  They were warned plenty.  And any Russian politician who supported this deserves much, much worse.  Everything that has happened is on their heads, bereaved Ukrainians and Russians alike know this.  They better sleep lightly for the remainder of their lives.

[drunkenshoe]

Guys, come on. Soldiers do not make a decision to join any army training in most of the world, let alone on setting foot on a country to invade it when drafted. It's not the USA. Who knows how many soldiers in Russian army who don't want to be involved with this. Mandatory draft. Telegraph had a piece on thousands of Russian young men running away abroad for asylum to escape from it. And it is a very serious felony. Two years in military prison in Russia. Any takers? We have the same problem, and let me tell you, you don't want that for your worst enemy.

These people have families. It's not some case of "oh young men could run away". No, they can't. A little empathy please. And right now, countries should open borders and help those people to take asylum.

[Shiranu]

Eh, was going to explain my reasoning but it doesn't really matter since there is no objective reality on this... so in short...

A little empathy please.

I'm showing far more than they deserve; a quick and clean death is probably far nicer than what your average Russian grunt deserves, but I do sympathize that they don't want to be there. As for those who are intentionally butchering civilians and committing war crimes... it's not too late to bring back crucifixion I don't think.


Those that lay down arms and surrender should be treated with dignity and shipped West, to get them as far from Putin as possible... and so far, that seems to be how the Ukrainians are treating them. Can you imagine the Russians and the Belarusians doing the same?

[Shiranu]

Description of how the thermobaric weapons operate...

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/europe/ukraine-russia-war-putin-thermobaric-rockets-b2023880.html

“Imagine taking a deep breath then submerging yourself in water. Then imagine having all of the oxygen forced instantaneously from your body. Try to inhale again. But instead of cold water filling your lungs, toxic, flammable particles start killing you from the inside out,” he wrote.Only blasts caused by nuclear attacks are worse.


Russia has allegedly used these missiles in Chechnya and Syria.

Again... a clean death is far nicer than what these people deserve; it was used in Grozny, Chechnya and apparently is as horrifying as it's made out to be.

[drunkenshoe]

I wasn't specifically reacting to you. But we don't need some objective reality. Under the presented circumstances, we can be sure there would be many soldiers who would not be there given a choice. There are everywhere. It seems to me that you are confusing people who see it legitimate, more, honourable to slaughter, torture, annihilate people in the name of nationalism, and people who has to be there without any choice. And I'm talking about the soldiers who has to obey, NOT the ones who decide to fire which weapon. That makes all the difference if you want some objective point. Without any choice part is very real and often ignored by the people who were raised in western cultures because it is hard to put your mind in. I'm not trying to provoke or ire, this is a fact. It's as impossible for you to imagine to be in their situation, as it is for me because you are lucky, and I was a born as a woman. Well, this is not gender studies, but again, a fact. As far as I'm concerned, it goes for everyone but drafted combat soldiers.

With that former group, I agree with you wholeheartedly and could offer much worse as punishment.

The human culture is overly militarised even in the most 'civilised' countries, and this is a huge bleeding issue with young men of ages between 18-25. Kids. Doesn't matter what age, it's a crime against humanity. The military concepts, traditions, nationalism -obey or die- is so deeply carved into human culture, it's almost seen as those young men do not have a right to step out of this.

War. Once you step in it, it's always the worst that happens. There is no clean one. I just wish people would remember that these drafted national soldiers are not mercenaries. There are the worst kind of mercenaries in every army, but there is a ton of them nobody hears-sees-listens that aren't and don't want to be there. They can't talk, run away or do anything else. They do not have any means to raise their voice without fundamentally ruin or alter their lives, subject themselves to horrible circumstances. You can be sure that even another ton of soldiers who foolishly thinks this was legitimate, until immediately seeing what war really is, but cannot get out of it. They can demand to be dismissed in the US, right? Honourable or dishonourable? This right doesn't exist in the most national armies, until they are considered a real threat for their own.

And imagine what's going to happen when surviving ones go back home. Most will commit suicide, or shell shocked, live as a corpse and as generations will change, they will be blamed by young people who do not understand their situation. Exactly like drafted American kids who were called 'baby killers' when the government has continued for years and years, knowing they are sending them to be slaughtered, to a lost war.

Sorry, it became too long. Long story short, I'm just saying that demonising is never a good idea.

[SGOS]

At first, I thought the invasion of Ukraine would be a replay of Hitler walking into Poland and simply taking over.  Now I'm reading about massive Ukrainian resistance in the face of being out manned and out gunned, but this is all from the Western press.  Even if Ukraine makes a valiant effort, I don't see any positive outcome for them.  And I'm suspect of the the Western press, so I'm not getting my hopes up.

Putin is a first class schmuck. He may have gone nuts.  But sometimes an asshole is just an asshole, and not crazy.  Who knows?

[drunkenshoe]

Yeah, it looks odd to me too. The moment I want to get my hopes up, I keep thinking, 'over four thousand dead Russian soldiers at one side while just a few hundreds at the other'. It's just been 3 days and it feels like weeks, may be that's the reason. Then I also agree that it could be another strategy against the invasion to support Ukraine. I hope it is nothing sinister.

[SGOS]

https://lasvegassun.com/news/2022/feb/27/take-note-of-right-wing-leaders-who-stand-with-put/

Donald Trump calls Russia’s attack of Ukraine a stroke of genius by Vladimir Putin and says it offers a lesson to the U.S. about how to treat Mexico.

Big egos think alike.