Don't Crucify the Messenger

[WanderingWonderer]

Well, then, maybe you should go back to the way you were in your twenties.

No, I'm only going one direction.

[Mike Cl]

What if our will is God's will?

Interesting.  How would that work?  I think I kind of understand what you mean--but not clearly. 

[WanderingWonderer]

Most interesting.  Would you mind sharing why or what moved you to change?

That is a very long story.

[Mike Cl]

That is a very long story.

Okay.

[WanderingWonderer]

Interesting.  How would that work?  I think I kind of understand what you mean--but not clearly.

We are creators and we have a gift for creating whatever we care to dream up. The trick is to turn an idea into a belief, and for every believer, the possibility increases. This is an observable phenomenon that threatens to call propaganda and prophecy one in the same. What if there was a way to let everyone have their cake and eat it too? All you have to do is respect the path, but judge the behavior. Even Christ called for fair judgment. Ghandi was a successful judge for his people as well. These pathways people choose for their ascension are not the point. We're all hoping to move up in one way or another. That's what matters, and so I believe anyone can get behind the idea of continuing the course but trying to go about it better. All you have to do is know how to plant that seed, and I assure you it won't be by calling people insane.

[jonb]

Her wings would scarcely carry her now, but in reply she alighted on his shoulder and gave his nose a loving bite. She whispered in his ear "You silly ass," and then, tottering to her chamber, lay down on the bed.
His head almost filled the fourth wall of her little room as he knelt near her in distress. Every moment her light was growing fainter; and he knew that if it went out she would be no more. She liked his tears so much that she put out her beautiful finger and let them run over it.
Her voice was so low that at first he could not make out what she said. Then he made it out. She was saying that she thought she could get well again if children believed in fairies.

https://youtu.be/OFX7bA5jc58

[Baruch]

I would argue that the Roman state was in a tight spot because of Christ. They had to find a way to incorporate him in or they risked a declination of control. Pilate was merciless, but we're led to believe that he gave Christ a way out and it was ultimately the fault of the Jews that he died rather than the governmental body he threatened. This is clearly propaganda.

The Pauline message, more so than that of James ... was profoundly subversive of Roman political-economics.  It still is, that is why it had to be destroyed or co-opted.  Similarly for other great religions like Buddhism, Hinduism and Islam.  All religions are political accommodations to realities that are too painful or disruptive to be dealt with directly.  An oyster generates a pearl to avoid the irritation of a grain of sand.  Hence the appropriateness of the Hellenistic gnostic parable of The Pearl .. which is probably what is elliptically referred to in the Gospels.  The generations after any religious founding, have to accommodate political reality.

[josephpalazzo]

How did Moses' detailed instructions on how to sacrifice animals better humanity?

They were sacrificing humans, in most cases, young virgins.

[josephpalazzo]

So because I was passionate about the subject, I did my homework.

Apparently, not very well.

[Baruch]

Sacrificing young people is still popular, but it goes by another name ... perpetual war of the NWO.

I agree that people like the Aztecs were practicing particularly vile acts of human sacrifice ... but if one gets into their mentality, one eventually sees oneself looking back, only not speaking Nahuatl.  It is easier for a Spaniard to relate to a Portuguese of course, but it is still possible to relate to far stranger cultural differences.

[josephpalazzo]

Sacrificing young people is still popular, but it goes by another name ...

Well, they're paid a salary. Wouldn't you agree that's an improvement...

[Mike Cl]

We are creators and we have a gift for creating whatever we care to dream up. The trick is to turn an idea into a belief, and for every believer, the possibility increases. This is an observable phenomenon that threatens to call propaganda and prophecy one in the same. What if there was a way to let everyone have their cake and eat it too? All you have to do is respect the path, but judge the behavior. Even Christ called for fair judgment. Ghandi was a successful judge for his people as well. These pathways people choose for their ascension are not the point. We're all hoping to move up in one way or another. That's what matters, and so I believe anyone can get behind the idea of continuing the course but trying to go about it better. All you have to do is know how to plant that seed, and I assure you it won't be by calling people insane.

I see a little better where you are coming from.  But from my point of view, while I agree that we, as a species, are 'creators' and we do dream.  The trick is to take that dreamed up or imagined idea and turn it into something material.  Everything that is man-made in this universe started out as an idea.  And then was made manifest by somebody.  The Trick, as I see it is to turn every idea into a thing--not a belief.  I see a belief as simply thinking something is without any proof.  So, I agree, that for a belief to grow, every new believer increases the possibility that that belief will grow.  And yes, that is an observable phenomenon, for we have seen it time and time again.  Christianity grew in that fashion.  When you bring Christ into the picture, I must disagree.  When you say 'Christ' I must assume you mean Jesus.  Okay--Christ was not Jesus' last name.  It is the name of an office and there were many Christ's prior to this Jesus and after, as well.  The name Jesus means savior (as does Joshua), and that alone should give a thinking person pause. 

You say "These pathways people choose for their ascension are not the point."  Pathways up to what?  I did not say the pathway isn't important--the journey and what you make of it, is all important to you--the destination, not so much, since everybody's destination is death.  You refer to 'moving up'--what does that mean to you?

This sentence "All you have to do is know how to plant that seed, and I assure you it won't be by calling people insane.", puzzles me.  When I plant a seed in the garden, I know what it is I'm planting.  What seed is it that you want to plant--from where does the seed come and for what is it supposed to grow into? 

[josephpalazzo]

What if our will is God's will?

What if it's not!

[WanderingWonderer]

I see a little better where you are coming from.  But from my point of view, while I agree that we, as a species, are 'creators' and we do dream.  The trick is to take that dreamed up or imagined idea and turn it into something material.  Everything that is man-made in this universe started out as an idea.  And then was made manifest by somebody.  The Trick, as I see it is to turn every idea into a thing--not a belief.  I see a belief as simply thinking something is without any proof.  So, I agree, that for a belief to grow, every new believer increases the possibility that that belief will grow.  And yes, that is an observable phenomenon, for we have seen it time and time again.  Christianity grew in that fashion.  When you bring Christ into the picture, I must disagree.  When you say 'Christ' I must assume you mean Jesus.  Okay--Christ was not Jesus' last name.  It is the name of an office and there were many Christ's prior to this Jesus and after, as well.  The name Jesus means savior (as does Joshua), and that alone should give a thinking person pause. 

You say "These pathways people choose for their ascension are not the point."  Pathways up to what?  I did not say the pathway isn't important--the journey and what you make of it, is all important to you--the destination, not so much, since everybody's destination is death.  You refer to 'moving up'--what does that mean to you?

This sentence "All you have to do is know how to plant that seed, and I assure you it won't be by calling people insane.", puzzles me.  When I plant a seed in the garden, I know what it is I'm planting.  What seed is it that you want to plant--from where does the seed come and for what is it supposed to grow into?

You miss the point because of, I suppose, your issue with belief. Before an idea can become material, you have to believe it a possibility.

[WanderingWonderer]

I see a little better where you are coming from.  But from my point of view, while I agree that we, as a species, are 'creators' and we do dream.  The trick is to take that dreamed up or imagined idea and turn it into something material.  Everything that is man-made in this universe started out as an idea.  And then was made manifest by somebody.  The Trick, as I see it is to turn every idea into a thing--not a belief.  I see a belief as simply thinking something is without any proof.  So, I agree, that for a belief to grow, every new believer increases the possibility that that belief will grow.  And yes, that is an observable phenomenon, for we have seen it time and time again.  Christianity grew in that fashion.  When you bring Christ into the picture, I must disagree.  When you say 'Christ' I must assume you mean Jesus.  Okay--Christ was not Jesus' last name.  It is the name of an office and there were many Christ's prior to this Jesus and after, as well.  The name Jesus means savior (as does Joshua), and that alone should give a thinking person pause. 

You say "These pathways people choose for their ascension are not the point."  Pathways up to what?  I did not say the pathway isn't important--the journey and what you make of it, is all important to you--the destination, not so much, since everybody's destination is death.  You refer to 'moving up'--what does that mean to you?

This sentence "All you have to do is know how to plant that seed, and I assure you it won't be by calling people insane.", puzzles me.  When I plant a seed in the garden, I know what it is I'm planting.  What seed is it that you want to plant--from where does the seed come and for what is it supposed to grow into?

I grow very tired of this game, always trying to explain the minor points to someone who is a cocoon of bias and self-righteousness. You gotta know when to hold'em and know when to fold'em. As predicted, I fold. Again, congratulations.