Choose to Believe

[SGOS]

We all frequently hear Christians talking about choosing to believe as if belief is a switch we could turn on somehow.  The general consensus among atheists is that while it's possible to change a belief, it is not a matter of choice.  But many, maybe most Christians insist that belief is a choice.  So I got to wondering about this. 

Have Christians actually made a conscious choice to believe, or do they just assume they have.  Sometimes I think they never really thought about it.  Could they choose not to believe?  Does this aspect of reasoning and understanding actually change if a person is a theist?  How can we account for this to be true for a theist, but not an atheist?

[AllPurposeAtheist]

We all frequently hear Christians talking about choosing to believe as if belief is a switch we could turn on somehow.  The general consensus among atheists is that while it's possible to change a belief, it is not a matter of choice.  But many, maybe most Christians insist that belief is a choice.  So I got to wondering about this. 

Have Christians actually made a conscious choice to believe, or do they just assume they have.  Sometimes I think they never really thought about it.  Could they choose not to believe?  Does this aspect of reasoning and understanding actually change if a person is a theist?  How can we account for this to be true for a theist, but not an atheist?

The key is forced belief. You just weren't beaten enough as a child to choose right..  But you say your parents did nothing but beat Christianity into you as a small innocent child? Well obviously not enough. Those who believe they get to chose weren't beaten enough either. You must be beaten to sufficiently cripple and maim you for life to actually not choose, but choose anyway..
I didn't say that there was logic here, just remember god loves those who are beaten sufficiently.. God hates logic.

I'm not a biblical scholar, but does the word LOGIC actually appear anywhere in the bible?

[Munch]

Belief is an ingrained mentality based on environment and people around us. Kind of like how someone who is raised by abusive parents can go on to be abusive to others themselves, or worse, christianity is a set of rules and beliefs forced on us from a young age.

The thing I admire the most in my fellow atheists is how they overcame this mentality, how they thought for themselves and not just doing whatever their parents or piers wanted them to think or feel. We atheists don't have organisations around every town, city, state, county or country that forces the message that faith is fantasy and fiction, its simply something a lot of us have discovered ourselves by being in the right frame of mind to do so.

Belief in something is a choice, the same as someone can believe that being a decent human being is the right thing, or that killing children is what they want to do, its all down to how the persons brain developers. And faith is an organisation of belief held by many with a set of rules for them to follow, because for these people the world is to scary a place not to have these rules in place.

[AllPurposeAtheist]

See? Now you're using logic and god hates logic.. Burn in hell heathen.

[SGOS]

I'm not a biblical scholar, but does the word LOGIC actually appear anywhere in the bible?

I don't know if the word actually appears in the Bible, and I'm not sure when it was coined.  However, the Bible does make several admonitions to avoid reason, but then there are probably a few places where it says you should use reason (as long as you arrive at the desired conclusion, I suppose).  It's probably one of those "find whatever you want" things in the Bible.

I've talked to a theist or two that insists their belief in God is logical, although none have demonstrated the actual logic they use to arrive at their conclusions.  I think they say it's logical, because they wouldn't consider themselves to be illogical.

[Hydra009]

We all frequently hear Christians talking about choosing to believe as if belief is a switch we could turn on somehow.  The general consensus among atheists is that while it's possible to change a belief, it is not a matter of choice.  But many, maybe most Christians insist that belief is a choice.

If it is a choice, it's strange how often people choose the deity of their hometown, usually for life.

People who think that this stuff can be switched on and off light a faucet should really try being an atheist for a day and personally demonstrate the truth of their proposition.

[Mermaid]

There is some comfort in giving over to it. Choosing to give up control to God and have him take care of you, and control your fate. It takes a lot of mental energy to do it all yourself.

I understand this, I think, this choosing to believe. That's what faith is, I spose. I envy people who can do that to a degree.

[stromboli]

In my case, leaving Mormonism to become a Christian, it thought of it as a conscious act. But thinking back, I realize it was more a need to provide a peer group for my peer group hungry wife and something for my kids to do on Sunday. My children rebelled against religion before I did. All 3 of them became atheists before I did.

I think anyone who joins a religion because they are proselyted by missionaries or JW's or whoever is probably looking for a peer group or wanting a change, and the inducement of a new beginning entices them in. There is a high percentage of dropouts among new converts when they figure out the reality versus the initial perception. Like happy to have the meal, but not so fun when they get the bill.

[Mermaid]

In my case, leaving Mormonism to become a Christian, it thought of it as a conscious act. But thinking back, I realize it was more a need to provide a peer group for my peer group hungry wife and something for my kids to do on Sunday. My children rebelled against religion before I did. All 3 of them became atheists before I did.

I think anyone who joins a religion because they are proselyted by missionaries or JW's or whoever is probably looking for a peer group or wanting a change, and the inducement of a new beginning entices them in. There is a high percentage of dropouts among new converts when they figure out the reality versus the initial perception. Like happy to have the meal, but not so fun when they get the bill.

I think this same psychology applies to street gangs. Maybe not the droupout rate, but the peer group thing.

[stromboli]

I think this same psychology applies to street gangs. Maybe not the droupout rate, but the peer group thing.

I believe you just made a very accurate comparison between religion and street gangs. 

[Johan]

Could they choose not to believe?  Does this aspect of reasoning and understanding actually change if a person is a theist?  How can we account for this to be true for a theist, but not an atheist?

How could it be true for one and not the other? I couldn't and it isn't. We're all people, we're all the same. Being a theist requires faith. Faith is believing something despite a complete lack of evidence and/or the presence of contradictory evidence. Faith is a choice.

Faith is something you make yourself do or will yourself to do. I suppose its possible indoctrinate some at a young enough age so that having faith no longer seems like a choice but faith at its core is always a choice because no one is born with it. Its a learned behavior.

Zero faith is required to be an atheist. The facts are the facts and the evidence or lack of it is very clear. But being an atheist still requires one to make a choice. None of us are born with faith so those that have it do so because they choose to have it. But those of us who don't have it are doing so because we have all made a choice to reject it. You do not label yourself as an atheist without having acknowledged that being a theist is a choice you could have made but instead choose against it. You simply cannot get to one without having dealt with the other.

[SGOS]

There is some comfort in giving over to it. Choosing to give up control to God and have him take care of you, and control your fate.

What you describe isn't choosing to believe.  You are choosing to turn your life over to God, but you are not choosing to believe in God.  You must already believe in God to do this.

[AllPurposeAtheist]

I choose to give my life over to the big, giant flying tricycle in the sky we all see every day.. Or is it just a Big Wheelâ,,¢..?

[Mike Cl]

Have Christians actually made a conscious choice to believe, or do they just assume they have.  Sometimes I think they never really thought about it.  Could they choose not to believe?  Does this aspect of reasoning and understanding actually change if a person is a theist?  How can we account for this to be true for a theist, but not an atheist?

I think every christian has made a more or less conscious choice to believe or to believe that faith is what is important.  They understand that reason, in religion, is of the devil.  It is created by the devil to lead them astray.  What is amazing to me is that they seem so easily capable to apply 'reason' in a useful manner in some aspects of life, but not in the area of religion.  So they strive to make their faith rock solid with no holes for reason to get through.  It does not matter that Jesus did not exist, that the bible was not dropped from heaven already complete and error free, that the history of religion is replete with error and downright lies.  Reason cannot successfully assault that granite wall of faith.  Is that a choice--yes it is.  An atheist is not swayed by the argument that one has to have faith.  For them, reason is the most important element--for the religious, belief and faith is the most important.

[Mermaid]

What you describe isn't choosing to believe.  You are choosing to turn your life over to God, but you are not choosing to believe in God.  You must already believe in God to do this.

Mmm.  I am not so sure this is always true.