Liberals loooooovvvee Islam

[Jorjor]

You're right, they don't pick it out of the blue... they cherry pick it from their cultures dominant holy book to justify their actions. Just like the Inquisition used the Bible to justify murdering and exile Jews (who were perceived as being economically better-off, mostly due to the fact that Europeans didn't let them do anything BUT economically good jobs), the Christian terrorists of Ireland and Uganda use religious doctrine to justify their terrorism or slave owners saying that the one dude's skin was turned black for being disobedient, therefor god WANTED blacks to be slaves.

I think you must have missed my entire post; humans are not as simple as you want to make them out to be. These conflicts are rooted in all sorts of cultural, political and socioeconomic issues and by blaming it all on Islam you only give ammo to the oppressors and ignore the root problems.

Now if you want to some how twist that into, "Liberals say Islam is a religion of peace."... good luck with that.

I'm not saying there aren't other factors involved. I'm well aware that control and oppression was one of the key reasons man created religion to begin with. I'm not sure I agree that criticizing Islam would give ammo to the opressors. If anything, dismantling their religion give them nothing to hide behind.

  I'm sure we could make a whole nother thread discussing the underlying socioecomic, political issues. All I'm really trying to get at with this thread is this touchiness people have when it comes to Islam that I find they don't seem to have with Christianity. That's all    *shrug*

[lumpymunk]

I can't be the only one annoyed by this. As a liberal myself, I'm of at a loss as to why liberals(particularly liberal theists) are so quick to jump to the defense of islam. Especially considering islam is the farthest thing from "liberal"(anti-women, anti-gay, anti-free speech, anti-tolerance for non-muslims)

Pretty easy question to answer.  Liberalism is one of the main champions of multiculturalism, and critics of ethnocentrism.  It's hard to reconcile multiculturalism and criticism of another culture/religion, you know... since they're exact opposites.  Liberals look at criticism for Islam as ethnocentrism by default, regardless of the truth-value of the criticism.

For most people that don't know enough about Islam to criticize it, the charge of ethnocentrism holds true... so it's become convention.  Look at the reaction of the left after 9/11... immediately begin apologizing for "non-extremist" Muslims.  I don't spend any energy defending the rest of Christianity when Westboro protests a funeral.

Thus, liberalism is philosophically incapable of defending itself (or our nation) from Islam.  Have a look at the UK, and listen to some of Pat Condell's videos and you'll see exactly where the United States is headed as long as we continue to handle Muslims with kid gloves.

http://www.youtube.com/user/patcondell

I think his videos are a great first hand source, and a valuable perspective from a rational atheist Brit.

[Plu]

I don't spend any energy defending the rest of Christianity when Westboro protests a funeral.

That's because when Westboro protests a funeral, angry rednecks don't hang any random innocent christians they can get their hands on.
If I lived in the middle east, I'd defend non-extremist christians as well, because they're a minority and thus at a great danger of being killed by dumbfucks.

But I already explained that.

[Shiranu]

I don't spend any energy defending the rest of Christianity when Westboro protests a funeral.

That's because when Westboro protests a funeral, angry rednecks don't hang any random innocent christians they can get their hands on.
If I lived in the middle east, I'd defend non-extremist christians as well, because they're a minority and thus at a great danger of being killed by dumbfucks.

But I already explained that.

This. And it touches on this...

Thus, liberalism is philosophically incapable of defending itself (or our nation) from Islam. Have a look at the UK, and listen to some of Pat Condell's videos and you'll see exactly where the United States is headed as long as we continue to handle Muslims with kid gloves.

What, a first world nation that provides its people with medical care and doesn't shut down because a minority side didn't get its way? Britain sounds terrible...

4.8% of the total population is not threatening the English way of life as they know it. They shut down parts of town and keep the law from working and enforce their own law. You know who else does that? Blacks, Latinos and Whites (at least in the U.S.). You have ghettos in inner-cities where the police don't like to go because there is a good chance they will get shot. You have barrios where, if you insult the wrong person, they will find your body in the park with multiple stab wounds, pieces of your body cut off and blunt trauma all over. And you have areas where if you aren't a W.A.S.P. or straight or Christian you will have your property vandalized, your business boycotted and occasionally an idiot walk into your temple and open fire because, "You look Muslim." (even though you were Sikh).

Yet no one mainstream argues anymore that black gangsters are one of the biggest threats to America, even though their numbers are expanding as more and more African Americans are forced into poverty, because it is no longer the "in thing" to be against blacks.

Fewer people nowadays cry about the Latino immigration and of cartels coming across causing chaos, but the amount of violence is at least the same if not worse. Mostly it is just your crazy uncle or ultra-conservatives, because it is no longer the "in thing" to be afraid of Latinos.

And finally no one speaks a word of all the white crimes... the white crimes that make up the disgusting, overwhelming majority of racially, politically and religious violence in this country, because it is not the "in thing".

Wake up, it's all bullshit. They want you to hate the "other guys" so that they can continue to fuck everyone in the ass and have you turn a blind eye to it. Communists, blacks, Latinos, Muslims... it is all a load of fear mongering bullshit to keep people complacent to the REAL people fucking them over, the people who cry out how these threats are going to be the end of civilization "any day now".

Well, the Communists, the Latinos and the blacks all failed to destroy my way of life, and I think the Muslims will too. Sorry.

[lumpymunk]

A wild pack of libtards appear!

[Plu]

A wild pack of libtards appear!

Awww, what's the matter, run out of arguments for your pathetic position? :)

[lumpymunk]

Why argue?  Making points would be like throwing fastballs at a catcher with no mitt.

 :rollin:

[Plu]

Good to hear that you're conceding the discussion, then  

[Jmpty]

Anyone who uses the term "libtard," is, by default, a fucking idiot.

[lumpymunk]

Anyone that cites Daily Kos pundits as "scholarly articles" is intellectually bankrupt and can be dismissed without effort.

[Jmpty]

Anyone that cites Daily Kos pundits as "scholarly articles" is intellectually bankrupt and can be dismissed without effort.

Then why are you responding to my post? Grow the fuck up.

[Sargon The Grape]

Anyone that cites Daily Kos pundits as "scholarly articles" is intellectually bankrupt and can be dismissed without effort.

Please, use more big words and pseudo-intellectual prose. At all costs, do not try to make actual arguments, or you'll run the risk of looking intelligent. Wouldn't want that, now, would you?

[baronvonrort]

I'm not sure I agree that criticizing Islam would give ammo to the opressors. If anything, dismantling their religion give them nothing to hide behind.

  I'm sure we could make a whole nother thread discussing the underlying socioecomic, political issues. All I'm really trying to get at with this thread is this touchiness people have when it comes to Islam that I find they don't seem to have with Christianity. That's all    *shrug*

Islam does have blasphemy laws, the death of Salman Taseer shows it is considered blasphemy to even oppose these blasphemy laws,Islam does not tolerate critics and they chop your head off for that in Saudi Arabia and hang you in Iran, moderate Indonesia only throws people in jail and Fazil Say from Turkey got a suspended jail term.
Salman Rushdie had a fatwa calling for his death over a book,Theo Van Gogh was killed over a movie and we saw death and destruction from cartoons.
Why an atheist would defend a belief that persecutes people for thought crimes is beyond my comprehension.

Pretending there are no problems with Islam will not force muslims into resolving the numerous human rights problems resulting from the Islamic delusion, criticism along with ridicule is what is needed and long overdue.
There are 7 countries that have the death penalty for atheism, all 7 have Islam as the state religion, why leftist atheists defend a belief that executes people for the crime of atheism in 2013 is something i cannot explain.

The muslims who flee from the political,social,economic and moral failures of Islamic countries still come with Islam because they fail to recognise it is Islam that explains these political,social,economic and moral failures.

I dont know any non muslims who have read the Quran,hadith and biography of Muhammad who will defend Islam,only those who are ignorant about Islam seem keen to defend it.

[Plu]

Why an atheist would defend a belief that persecutes people for thought crimes is beyond my comprehension.

Me neither. I've yet to find any that would do that would, though. The only people I know who "defend Islam" only defend innocent moderate muslims from horrible things that people want to do to them even though they're not involved with them.

[Shiranu]

Why an atheist would defend a belief that persecutes people for thought crimes is beyond my comprehension.

We don't, we are able however to separate belief from believer amongst other things.