Why is the word "gay" sacred?

[josephpalazzo]

I do historical documents for the Naval History and Heritage Command. One such was a four volume set of documents from the War of 1812. I got a good chuckle out of one USN captain ended his letter to the family. "I am glad to hear you are all still gay and hope you remain so."

Nietzsche wrote "The Gay Science" in 1882. It had nothing to do with being "gay". However in German, it is titled "Die fröhliche Wissenschaft", literally meaning "The Joyful Science". Go figure.

[SGOS]

Gay isn't the only word like that.  It reminds me of the movement to refer to atheists as brights, although I'm grateful that one didn't stick.  The first time I heard that blacks wanted to be referred to as blacks, I was stunned because prior to that, the word black was often used in a derogatory manner, although not always.  I grew up learning that the proper designation was negro.  Perhaps I learned it wrong.  Whether or not that's true, I would consider it wrong today, and I wouldn't use it.  Actually, I didn't think gay was particularly useful when it first arrived on the scene.  I would have chosen a word that sounded a bit less fluffy.  But I have no idea what that word would be.   Some of these widely used descriptions exist because they were adopted by the very groups they describe, and that's hard to argue with.

Obviously we need the words, because we categorize people whether we like it or not.  As long as they are not used to be offensive, then I don't think it makes much difference what society adopts.  Words appear and are adopted at a fast rate, some are clever.  "My computer crashed," is clever because it's so overly dramatic.  Every time I hear it I chuckle.

[Munch]

The way I see it, if you have a gay friend and make general pokes at them for being gay, as long as they don't mind it, then its not an issue. However, much like how if you had black friends and said nigger to them and they were okay with it, but then said it in public and you offended someone of colour, then in the same context you shouldn't use words like that out in public without knowing its gonna offend someone.

Unless thats the aim anyway, in which case the goals meet.

[Baruch]

Some words in the US are in-group, and if out-group people use them, it is considered wrong.  The N word is like that ... and since I know that, I respect it.  An in-group word is empowering, like a secret handshake.  And some words fall into the more general taboo category.  Our pagan inner selves are fearful of verbal black cats.

[Atheon]

There's a prevailing underlying social assumption that one cannot be bigoted against a group one belongs to. Therefore Jews can get away with telling Jewish jokes, gays can call each other "faggot" in a jocular manner, and black people can use the N-word with impunity. For instance, if a black person calls another black person "n*****", the recipient can be sure that the word wasn't meant in a racist way, but if you're not black and you use the word, there's doubt about intention.

So if you belong to a certain group, you have the "immunity idol" for slurs against that group. Also, comedians have a certain degree of immunity, and if you're good at it and have a history of being trusted by the targeted group, you have immunity too. (Lenny Bruce is a good example).

[GSOgymrat]

https://youtu.be/TgkwYSKQTQ8

[doorknob]

I've never used the two usages in the same way. It's about context if you ask me. Gay can have three meanings. Just as gay originally meant happy but I don't think any one uses it that way any more.

[Munch]

I've never used the two usages in the same way. It's about context if you ask me. Gay can have three meanings. Just as gay originally meant happy but I don't think any one uses it that way any more.

Theres also positives and negatives to take into account. Gay did once mean happy, a positive, and homosexuals then being associated with the word. The only reason the word today is used in a negative way is when someone refers to something as being gay as a derogatory because they associate something bad as being gay, and so the thing itself is bad thus gay.

Today I found out how ‘gay’ came to mean ‘homosexual’.

The word “gay” seems to have its origins around the 12th century in England, derived from the Old French word ‘gai’, which in turn was probably derived from a Germanic word, though that isn’t completely known.  The word’s original meaning meant something to the effect of “joyful”, “carefree”, “full of mirth”, or “bright and showy”.

However, around the early parts of the 17th century, the word began to be associated with immorality.  By the mid 17th century, according to an Oxford dictionary definition at the time, the meaning of the word had changed to mean  “addicted to pleasures and dissipations.  Often euphemistically: Of loose and immoral life”.  This is an extension of one of the original meanings of “carefree”, meaning more or less uninhibited.

Fast-forward to the 19th century and the word gay referred to a woman who was a prostitute and a gay man was someone who slept with a lot of women (ironically enough), often prostitutes. Also at this time, the phrase “gay it” meant to have sex.

With these new definitions, the original meanings of “carefree”, “joyful”, and “bright and showy” were still around; so the word was not exclusively used to refer to prostitutes or a promiscuous man.  Those were just accepted definitions, along with the other meanings of the word.

Around the 1920s and 1930s, however, the word started to have a new meaning.  In terms of the sexual meaning of the word, a “gay man” no longer just meant a man who had sex with a lot of women, but now started to refer to men who had sex with other men.  There was also another word “gey cat” at this time which meant a homosexual boy.

By 1955, the word gay now officially acquired the new added definition of meaning homosexual males.  Gay men themselves seem to have been behind the driving thrust for this new definition as they felt (and many still do), that “homosexual” is much too clinical, sounding like a disorder.  As such, it was common amongst the gay community to refer to one another as “gay” decades before this was a commonly known definition (reportedly homosexual men were calling one another gay as early as the 1920s).  At this time, homosexual women were referred to as lesbians, not gay.  Although women could still be called gay if they were prostitutes as that meaning had not yet 100% disappeared.

Since then, gay, meaning homosexual male, has steadily driven out all the other definitions that have floated about through time and of course also has gradually begun supplementing the word ‘lesbian’ as referring to women who are homosexual.

http://www.todayifoundout.com/index.php/2010/02/how-gay-came-to-mean-homosexual/

Interesting how once straight men were called gay.

[widdershins]

As someone that isn't offended easily at all... I tend to find it hard to relate... and when people can be offended by literally anything.... it makes it hard to keep up the energy and keep tabs on what we're supposed to/not supposed to say.

I know exactly what you mean there.  It's like someone is just randomly choosing which of these offenses are "real" offenses and which ones we can laugh off as unimportant and keeping up with which one is "important" today is quite a challenge.

The way I see it, if you have a gay friend and make general pokes at them for being gay, as long as they don't mind it, then its not an issue. However, much like how if you had black friends and said nigger to them and they were okay with it, but then said it in public and you offended someone of colour, then in the same context you shouldn't use words like that out in public without knowing its gonna offend someone.

Unless thats the aim anyway, in which case the goals meet.

See, that's just the way guys treat each other already.  I have a friend who is color blind and has severe nerve damage, making him shake extremely when attempting fine motor skills and I make so much shit out of him for that!  And I don't mean just, "Haha, you're shaking."  I say some truly offensive shit to him about it.  But the only reason I do that is because he's a close friend.  I would NEVER do that with a casual friend, acquaintance, stranger or even a mortal enemy.  It's cool because we're friends, comfortable enough with each other to understand the idiotic ridiculous ritual that is heterosexual platonic shows of affection.  We're really quite the stupid, fucked up lot, when you really think about it.

But yeah, anything is okay as long as nobody involved is offended by it, I guess is the point.  But people seem to think these days that we have a fundamental right not to be offended.  We do not.  In the past when I have said, "That is so gay", not once was I in any way referring to sexuality, so the term, as I used it, was not "offensive" even though some may have been offended by it because it is an alternate use of a word they use to describe themselves and this alternate use has negative connotations.  But no offense was intended, in no way was I referring to any other meaning of the word, it was not directed at them in any way and I was using a legitimate alternative definition for the word, so the use is not "offensive" even though it may "offend".  At least, that's how I see it.

[Sargon The Grape]

This thread is gay.


Fair and balanced (like Fox News).

[Baruch]

Only if everyone's avatar is snappily dressed ;-)

[Munch]

This thread is gay.

But it doesn't have enough sprinkles!!



AHH HAHAH, YEEEEESSSS!!

[widdershins]

This thread is gay.


Fair and balanced (like Fox News).

But is it too gay?  Or is it not too gay enough?

But it doesn't have enough sprinkles!!



AHH HAHAH, YEEEEESSSS!!

Sprinkles...More sprinkles!

[gentle_dissident]

I've known homosexuals, flamers, and divas. I've always figured that "gay" meant flaming or divaesque.

Sometimes I figured it meant "those lost in the opulence of their parents".  But that's pretty gay.

[PickelledEggs]

But it doesn't have enough sprinkles!!



AHH HAHAH, YEEEEESSSS!!

God damn that makes me hungry.