News:

Welcome to our site!

Main Menu

Another Day, Another Shooting

Started by Shiranu, October 31, 2015, 06:12:37 PM

Previous topic - Next topic

Shiranu

amsn.com/en-us/news/us/4-dead-in-colorado-springs-shooting-spree/ar-BBmFwlz?ocid=spartanntp

You know what, at this point... I'll give the anti-regulation crowd a break, and go one further... you are right.

It's not guns. It's really not.

We are just a fundamentally broken, dysfunctional society... or at least, have a large percentage of the population who fit this mold, far larger than any other civilized nation.

Sure, giving everyone and their hamster access to a device intended to launch a 7.5 gram hunk of metal at 1,300 feet per second at another person probably doesn't help, but a society that refuses to acknowledge that clearly has some issues...
"A little science distances you from God, but a lot of science brings you nearer to Him." - Louis Pasteur

Gawdzilla Sama

Kind of lumping the entire population of the US into one bucket there.
We 'new atheists' have a reputation for being militant, but make no mistake  we didn't start this war. If you want to place blame put it on the the religious zealots who have been poisoning the minds of the  young for a long long time."
PZ Myers

mauricio

#2
Quote from: Shiranu on October 31, 2015, 06:12:37 PM
amsn.com/en-us/news/us/4-dead-in-colorado-springs-shooting-spree/ar-BBmFwlz?ocid=spartanntp

We are just a fundamentally broken, dysfunctional society... or at least, have a large percentage of the population who fit this mold, far larger than any other civilized nation.

I cannot really take this rhetoric seriously, I know (hope) you are being hyperbolic but seriously get some perspective, this mass shootings that the media loves to make a frenzy about are rather meaningless on the big picture of violent crime and they most definitely do not warrant that kind of assessment. It's all just media induced fear. The homicide rate on the USA on the other hand is a more meaningful fact, but even then it does not support your rhetoric, the cause i would wager are much more likely related to gang culture and a strong black market, rather than a " fundamentally broken, dysfunctional society... or at least, have a large percentage of the population who fit this mold"

That last part specially what are trying to say? I think you used "large percentage of the population'' wrong or ambiguously, because it is patently false unless you consider less than 0.1% to be a large percentage.

If you just wanted to say there's a larger percent of mass shooters on the USA in relation to other nations you probably should have just written:
"have a percentage of the population who fit this mold, far larger than any other civilized nation."

Shiranu

That was resigned hyperbole and cynicism in response to anytime something like this happens, inevitably it is declared that guns could have anything more than zero to do with it.

"A little science distances you from God, but a lot of science brings you nearer to Him." - Louis Pasteur

AllPurposeAtheist

Guns by themselves are pretty benign as they don't generally fire themselves. It's people who have no training with them who scare me more than the guns.
It's pretty simple. In order to open a shop to cut hair you have to be trained and licensed. To operate a motor vehicle you have to have some training though not enough, but you do have to be licensed. To own and use a gun?  Nothing.  You need fingers.  That's where the biggest division comes from I think.
Training should be mandatory and until it is we'll keep hearing the same tired news and arguments.
All hail my new signature!

Admit it. You're secretly green with envy.

Sargon The Grape

Oh hey, it's another gun debate thread that will ultimate go nowhere.

Speak when you have something to say, not when you have to say something.

My Youtube Channel

stromboli

Colorado springs is the home of the American Family Association and all the right wing Christard evangelicals like Ted Haggard. We'll see what they have to say, if anything. No doubt because gays, or something.

Baruch

#7
Quote from: AllPurposeAtheist on October 31, 2015, 08:23:34 PM
Guns by themselves are pretty benign as they don't generally fire themselves. It's people who have no training with them who scare me more than the guns.
It's pretty simple. In order to open a shop to cut hair you have to be trained and licensed. To operate a motor vehicle you have to have some training though not enough, but you do have to be licensed. To own and use a gun?  Nothing.  You need fingers.  That's where the biggest division comes from I think.
Training should be mandatory and until it is we'll keep hearing the same tired news and arguments.

There is gun training available.  The NRA would love to have the whole population go thru their gun training program ... no doubt hoping that many of them will become NRA members afterward ... and maybe even loony Republicans too ;-)  I would love to hear the screams of indignation if this was mandated by law ... and as typical today, it was privatized ... by giving the NRA the responsibility for the program, and billions of dollars to supply it.  Then as Admiral Yamamoto used to say ... "if you invade America there will be a gun behind every blade of grass".  I am good with that!
Ha’át’íísh baa naniná?
Azee’ Å,a’ish nanídį́į́h?
Táadoo ánít’iní.
What are you doing?
Are you taking any medications?
Don't do that.

AllPurposeAtheist

Quote from: Baruch on October 31, 2015, 08:47:22 PM
There is gun training available.  The NRA would love to have the whole population go thru their gun training program ... no doubt hoping that many of them will become NRA members afterward ... and maybe even loony Republicans too ;-)  I would love to hear the screams of indignation if this was mandated by law ... and as typical today, it was privatized ... by giving the NRA the responsibility for the program, and billions of dollars to supply it.
And I suggested that the NRA be the entity to do the training?  I don't recall that, but feel free to jump to whatever conclusions you want to jump to.   
All hail my new signature!

Admit it. You're secretly green with envy.

PopeyesPappy

The NRA is the main organizations that provides training and certifications for trainers and range safety personnel.
Save a life. Adopt a Greyhound.

stromboli

Utah has a hunter safety program that anyone under the age of 18 has to pass to get a license. Good Idea. To get a concealed carry permit you have to take a course, get a certificate and then pass an exam and a background check. Also a good idea. There are some good ideas out there.

And if the NRA wants to train people to use guns properly, I don't have a problem with it. Everyone purchasing a gun should have to pass a background check, pass a gun safety course and trigger locks should be sold with every weapon.

Gawdzilla Sama

Trigger locks intrigue me. To be effective they have to be in place and functioning as a lock. But if guns are for self-defense, locks defeat that purpose.

Full disclosure: I've been an owner and shooter for just over fifty years now. I own a legal Browning .50 cal. MG.
We 'new atheists' have a reputation for being militant, but make no mistake  we didn't start this war. If you want to place blame put it on the the religious zealots who have been poisoning the minds of the  young for a long long time."
PZ Myers

stromboli

Quote from: Gawdzilla Sama on October 31, 2015, 09:20:37 PM
Trigger locks intrigue me. To be effective they have to be in place and functioning as a lock. But if guns are for self-defense, locks defeat that purpose.

Full disclosure: I've been an owner and shooter for just over fifty years now. I own a legal Browning .50 cal. MG.

Never fired one, but my son as a reservist let me shoot an M249 SAW a few years ago. That was fun. Had my hands on some guns like Thompsons in the Navy, also fired a BAR. Probably the most accurate gun I fired was a Springfield M1A1 .308 with match ammo. Could put rounds into a 2 inch group all day at 100 yards.

SGOS

Another shooter bags himself a "three fer."

Mike Cl

Quote from: stromboli on October 31, 2015, 09:26:15 PM
Never fired one, but my son as a reservist let me shoot an M249 SAW a few years ago. That was fun. Had my hands on some guns like Thompsons in the Navy, also fired a BAR. Probably the most accurate gun I fired was a Springfield M1A1 .308 with match ammo. Could put rounds into a 2 inch group all day at 100 yards.
The M14A1, which also fired .308 ammo with a three round clip was the most accurate I fired while in the Army. In fact, that is the weapon I used in basic training.  Loved that rifle.
Is God willing to prevent evil, but not able?<br />Then he is not omnipotent,<br />Is he able but not willing?<br />Then whence cometh evil?<br />Is he neither able or willing?<br />Then why call him god?