A more complete view on my religious views

[Deidre32]

why is this in the intro section? lol

[dtq123]

Maybe you skipped the part where I thought this would be a fun opportunity to discuss what we think humanity would look like without religion.

Some RL stuff happened and I got upset, but I'm better now, sorry for not explaining X3

I'd love to hear how you think man would have developed without religion.

I was acting immature and selfish earlier, my apologies

Edit: I was late, wasn't I?

why is this in the intro section? lol

To get to know me better silly~

[AllPurposeAtheist]

Religion was and is just a mere power play for control of people used along with the many lies and deceptions. I suspect that had religion never existed we might have been a much better world with much less fighting and killing.  After all,  what was ever moral about killing others all because someone else didn't believe in the correct god? What's so moral about giving money,  often by force and threats of violence under the guise of morality? No,  the world would have been just fine without religion because our species is the only one with religion and the only one that engages in industrial killing for the sake of morality. .

[dtq123]

Religion was and is just a mere power play for control of people used along with the many lies and deceptions.

Religion also gives (false) hope, and some people need it. The world is often too much for people if they can't surrender to an all-loving daddy.

My point was that we are where we are because of religion, and there are reasons why some religions stayed while others didn't (Other than the fact that you do kill infidels)

[AllPurposeAtheist]

Religion also gives (false) hope, and some people need it. The world is often too much for people if they can't surrender to an all-loving daddy.

My point was that we are where we are because of religion, and there are reasons why some religions stayed while others didn't (Other than the fact that you do kill infidels)

Wait,  people need to be lied to and need false hope?  I seriously doubt that is the case. In fact people who cling to religion would be much better off if they had never been exposed to such lies and bullshit from the get go.. No, they don't need it at all,  but thinking they need it is an entirely different proposition. 

[dtq123]

Wait,  people need to be lied to and need false hope?  I seriously doubt that is the case. In fact people who cling to religion would be much better off if they had never been exposed to such lies and bullshit from the get go.. No, they don't need it at all,  but thinking they need it is an entirely different proposition.

False hope is a coping mechanism, a shitty one at that, but is still one. We just need to teach people better methods of coping.

[AllPurposeAtheist]

All jokes aside I prefer to be honest with people instead of filling their heads with the notion of some magical man in the sky who doesn't even exist to begin with.
I sometimes struggle to keep my yap shut dealing with my gf over this stuff as she believes that some 2000 year old dead zombie somehow does one fucking thing in relationship to the modern world.  She's normally a very intelligent woman, but the nonsense crops up from time to time that all she has to do is talk to the wall to fix things.
One example is the previous owners of this home had tried to have a baby  with no success,  but Sylvia claims to have prayed for them and whallah! The bitch* got knocked up and had a baby.
Obviously I have absolutely no way to disprove that prayer had a damned thing to do with anything, but I really suspect that they just had sex..
*From all accounts the woman was a real bitch,but that's another story for another time. .

[Munch]

Religion also gives (false) hope, and some people need it. The world is often too much for people if they can't surrender to an all-loving daddy.

My point was that we are where we are because of religion, and there are reasons why some religions stayed while others didn't (Other than the fact that you do kill infidels)

The problem with false hope though, is that is the easiest cord to loop round someone's neck and control them with. Be it religion, war propaganda, selling overpriced products telling you it will solve a problem you didn't know you had, it's all the same.

The reason why certain religions have become as popular as it has is based on how easily the lie has been moulded around the society it is represented in, as well as Argumentum ad populum, the appeal that because more people believe it, it must thus be true.

Even I use to believe "well there are so many religions, so aspects in them must be true", until I accepted the fact it's no different then the happily ever after in storybooks read to children.

Now this isn't me trying to step on your own beliefs, everyone has their own, I'm just merely saying what mine are.

[dtq123]

All jokes aside I prefer to be honest with people instead of filling their heads with the notion of some magical man in the sky who doesn't even exist to begin with.

The thing is, is that people fell into the trap because people don't want the truth... People want to be happy, not knowledgeable. For most people, their upbringing shows them that knowledge is dull and pretentious when it isn't. Thus we need to make knowledge exciting.

The problem with false hope though, is that is the easiest cord to loop round someone's neck and control them with. Be it religion, war propaganda, selling overpriced products telling you it will solve a problem you didn't know you had, it's all the same.

The reason why certain religions have become as popular as it has is based on how easily the lie has been moulded around the society it is represented in, as well as Argumentum ad populum, the appeal that because more people believe it, it must thus be true.

Even I use to believe "well there are so many religions, so aspects in them must be true", until I accepted the fact it's no different then the happily ever after in storybooks read to children.

Now this isn't me trying to step on your own beliefs, everyone has their own, I'm just merely saying what mine are.

Wow... Never thought about it that way... Look at me, I make things so complex

Seriously though, thanks for the insight. I just woke up so this will definitely spice up my day a bit.

[Munch]

No probs, I like all you guys here, this site feels like a little haven from the insanity, cruelty and Bullshit of day to day life, so I enjoy seeing what everyone has to say (minus the occasional troll the comes in to piss in the fountain )

[aitm]

Control and manipulation aside, religion has worked very hard to stymy serious science. Every time a new idea was presented it had to first be checked to see how it would agree with dogma. Doctors in the -300 had a better understanding of the human body that the doctors of the 17th century who had to secretly buy cadavers so they could get a better understanding of what was inside us. This was because the spread of christianity, people believed the whole body was needed in order to get to heaven so doctors and student could only use criminals or buy blackmarket cadavers. This certainly set back medicine hundreds of years.

I mean look no further than Copernicus, hell again the greeks had a better understanding of astronomy than we did in the 1400 due to the "dark ages". Christianity itself set us back a thousand years.

[dtq123]

Control and manipulation aside, religion has worked very hard to stigmatize serious science. Every time a new idea was presented it had to first be checked to see how it would agree with dogma. Doctors in the -300 had a better understanding of the human body that the doctors of the 17th century who had to secretly buy cadavers so they could get a better understanding of what was inside us. This was because the spread of Christianity, people believed the whole body was needed in order to get to heaven so doctors and student could only use criminals or buy black market cadavers. This certainly set back medicine hundreds of years.

I mean look no further than Copernicus, hell again the Greeks had a better understanding of astronomy than we did in the 1400 due to the "dark ages". Christianity itself set us back a thousand years.

A-...Nope not even going to argue... I should go an reflect upon my position a bit. Foucault might not be the best idol for me.

I went a bit too enthusiastic over his concept of salvaging the past for lessons. It's like mining for fool's gold, my bad.

Still you must admit, learning why one religion is successful can help prevent others from growing.

[Solitary]

Before we go any further---what is the agreed upon definition of religion and philosophy. Life signifies nothing accept we are part of it. Why is it so important to think it has to have meaning? We live and love, we die alone, in our thoughts of loved ones. Isn't one life enough if you have lived it fully? A lot of people dream of a second life, who have never really lived this one by burying their head in delusional beliefs that restrict their ability to live life to the fullest because of the guilt they feel because they're taught what is natural is a sin. The Christian religion is a perversion of being an authentic human being by the authority of Church, and church leaders that don't know that what they think is knowledge from Scriptures is really ignorance.

[dtq123]

Before we go any further---what is the agreed upon definition of religion and philosophy.

(Added Ethics and Nihilism because we might need it later...This was Google's definitions, feel free to play with semantics here)

Religion
Noun
The belief in and worship of a superhuman controlling power, especially a personal God or gods.

Philosophy
Noun
The study of the fundamental nature of knowledge, reality, and existence, especially when considered as an academic discipline.
+ A particular system of philosophical thought

Ethics
Noun
Moral principles that govern a person's or group's behavior.

Nihilism
Noun
The rejection of all religious and moral principles, often in the belief that life is meaningless.

Life signifies nothing accept except we are part of it. Why is it so important to think it has to have meaning? We live and love, we die alone, in our thoughts of loved ones.

It is important to have meaning in life to prevent a higher rate of suicide. Suicide often means that there is an underlying problem that can not be resolved. Some suicides are justified because we cannot change the situation or the perspective, but some are not when we can. One of the perspective changes we need is after a person becomes nihilistic.

Nihilism is not good for society because it reverts us back into primitive apes where we have not moral consideration, or perhaps worse; forward into extinction due to mass suicide.

After finding meaning in life, many atheists say that life is inherently better than death (under most circumstances). Thus it can be said that this judgement is fairly sound, since many atheist have also put a lot of time and effort into their current philosophy.

However, people in a nihilistic state often are traumatized by this cold realization, and are unable to make proper judgement calls, thus making it difficult for them to make rational decisions.

This is a problem many Christians accuse us of, and should find out a way to fix.

Isn't one life enough if you have lived it fully?

Not if you don't know how to live it fully, hence we need to educate people on how to work with us and prepare a life worth living after religion, because often an abrupt change in how one lives life causes frustration or depression, and adding nihilism to that does not help.

And so this happens because people are too scared to drop out of religion:

A lot of people dream of a second life, who have never really lived this one by burying their head in delusional beliefs that restrict their ability to live life to the fullest because of the guilt they feel because they're taught what is natural is a sin. The Christian religion is a perversion of being an authentic human being by the authority of Church, and church leaders that don't know that what they think is knowledge from Scriptures is really ignorance.

By the way, do you know of Heidegger or Sartre? "Perversion or being an authentic person" made me think of them

[aitm]

Still you must admit, learning why one religion is successful can help prevent others from growing.

well I guess I misunderstood your OP. Is it your position that we "feel" better because of religion or that we "are" better? Is this about the psyche or our actual conditions of life? Spiritual or being able to feed oneself? You are going to have to clarify as I think points can be made in either case that religion has not done a better job even though it is by historical account the default position. We can only speculate using other smaller cultures that do not or never had the concepts of a god.


And we do know how religion became successful. They killed whomever disagreed. It really is that simple. Once you kill all those opposed it becomes simple cultural dogma enforced by fear which over time becomes not so fearful as the laws are now known and followed thus less puishment thus more acceptance.