Why I Hate America

[Gilgamesh]

1. Despite the fact that African Americans make up 13% of the population and an estimated 15% of American drug users, 37% of all drug arrests are against African Americans.

Argument from ignorance, or 'God of the gaps' fallacy. You don't get to just insert whatever cause you want. There are a plethora of reasons other than institutionalised racism that could explain why 37% of drug arrests are happening to blacks. For one, and the most obvious, they have interactions with the police at a higher rate.

Anyway, if you want to claim institutionalised racism, you must provide proof.

2. Blacks and Latinos in NYC were facing an 85% rate of stop and frisk, while white people were stopped and frisked 8%.

See above.

3. Human Rights Watch estimates that African Americans, depending on where they are, are two to eleven times more likely to be arrested for drug possession than whites.

See above.

4. The U.S. Sentencing Commission found that African Americans receive on average 10% longer sentences for whites than the same crimes and 21% more like to receive a mandatory minimum sentence.

You receive longer sentences when you're a repeat offender. Blacks are more often repeat offenders. Not only that, but again, there are many factors that go into determining a sentence. It's up to you to provide proof that indicates it's the factor you want it to be. You don't get to just insert whatever cause (racism) that you want.

5. On average 17% of white criminals receive a call back on job applications after release from jail; for African Americans, only 5%.

Same as usual. Argument from ignorance. Prove that it's racism, and not one of a million other factors that it could be.

6. Black students are three times more likely than white students to be expelled from school, even when the infractions are the same. Additionally they are 16% of the total enrollment but 27% of the students referenced to law enforcement.

See above.

I wanted you to prove that it was racism, and instead of that, you, like any other plebian who I get into this with, just list off a bunch of instances of which you assume the cause is racism. Nah, not gonna' fly. Provide evidence that it's racism.

If by, "you don't", you mean, "We have a president who said the Nazis were full of good people and both sides were to blame" (Literally victim blaming a woman who was killed for being part of a counter protest to Nazis), then you are right, "we don't".

He didn't say nazis were full of good people. You are lying out your ass. Not out of character for you, though.

[pr126]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=phPXTWJhnYM&t=38s

[Hakurei Reimu]

Unfortunately, Shir, Gilgamesh has a point here. A statistical figure is just a number without some sort of context to put it in. You can't say what the source of that disparity without research. You also can't say 'the cause is racism' unless you can show that racism is at least a contributor to these figures.

That said, Gil, the disparities outlined by Shiranu are facts that do require an explanation. And not just proximal causes like, "blacks tend to offend more." Why do they tend to offend more? Well, one of the correlates to criminality is whether or not you're poor, and blacks (and latinos) do tend to be poor in this country more than whites. And why do blacks tend to be poorer than whites? Well, an obvious contributor is that a good chunk of them are here because of the African slave trade. Unlike other immigrant groups to the US, blacks were the only ones forced to come here, and would be of a different mindset than peoples here because they wanted to be here badly enough to cross an ocean to build a better life. I can see that poisoning racial relations in the US, with blacks as a group having a feeling (not completely unjustified) that whites owe them something for that.

Of course, full caveats attach in the speculation above, but I wouldn't be at all surprised if something like that were the case.

[Gilgamesh]

Unfortunately, Shir, Gilgamesh has a point here. A statistical figure is just a number without some sort of context to put it in. You can't say what the source of that disparity without research. You also can't say 'the cause is racism' unless you can show that racism is at least a contributor to these figures.

That said, Gil, the disparities outlined by Shiranu are facts that do require an explanation. And not just proximal causes like, "blacks tend to offend more." Why do they tend to offend more? Well, one of the correlates to criminality is whether or not you're poor, and blacks (and latinos) do tend to be poor in this country more than whites. And why do blacks tend to be poorer than whites? Well, an obvious contributor is that a good chunk of them are here because of the African slave trade. Unlike other immigrant groups to the US, blacks were the only ones forced to come here, and would be of a different mindset than peoples here because they wanted to be here badly enough to cross an ocean to build a better life. I can see that poisoning racial relations in the US, with blacks as a group having a feeling (not completely unjustified) that whites owe them something for that.

Of course, full caveats attach in the speculation above, but I wouldn't be at all surprised if something like that were the case.

My personal observation tells me that the reason for most of these instances is because blacks are poor. Why do I think that? Because you can observe poor people of any racial background and see similar instances. So, it's not a race thing; it's a poor thing. Why are blacks poor? They make bad decisions. Why do they make bad decisions? Because they're poor and because of gang culture. It's a negative feedback loop

[fencerider]

My personal observation tells me that the reason for most of these instances is because blacks are poor. Why do I think that? Because you can observe poor people of any racial background and see similar instances. So, it's not a race thing; it's a poor thing. Why are blacks poor? They make bad decisions. Why do they make bad decisions? Because they're poor and because of gang culture. It's a negative feedback loop

That is an extremely bigotted thing to say. People do not become poor because of bad decisions. They become poor because the wealthy are legally stealing from them every day.

Black people are poor because when white folk were forced to accept them as a part of society they refused to give them any good jobs.

[fencerider]

The US was extensively propagandized, and still is.

I agree that gvment has trained us with their propaganda to suite their desires. but I am curious which propaganda are you refering to?

That if we give tax cuts to corporations they will share it with their employees?

That Russia was a dire threat because they had more nuclear missiles than us?(they never had more than 1/5 the number of U.S. during the entire cold war)

That they had to drop a bomb on Hiroshima? (Japan was trying to surrender 6months before the bomb was finished. and was already close to a total collapse when it was used)

That Mexicans are more dangerous to the U.S. than Trump?

That there is no such thing as a dirty cop?

[Error]

That is an extremely bigotted thing to say. People do not become poor because of bad decisions. They become poor because the wealthy are legally stealing from them every day.

Black people are poor because when white folk were forced to accept them as a part of society they refused to give them any good jobs.

Oh no, another nigger defender.

[Mr.Obvious]

That is an extremely bigotted thing to say. People do not become poor because of bad decisions. They become poor because the wealthy are legally stealing from them every day.

Black people are poor because when white folk were forced to accept them as a part of society they refused to give them any good jobs.

While i think gilgamesh didn't formulate his point in The most optimum way, i somewhere agree to it.
Poverty begets poverty. From one generation to another. Not just because of 'poor decisions' but because of lack of opportunity. And if you come frome a 'white trash' family, you are about as likely to continue that line of poverty as someone from a poor black family in The ghetto is.
The disproportionate amount of poor african-americans has historical roots that, in my opinion, are bound to racism. But continued trend to this day is not proof of continued institutionalized racism to this day. It might very Well still have a part, but i doubt it's The most important influence.

[Gilgamesh]

That is an extremely bigotted thing to say. People do not become poor because of bad decisions. They become poor because the wealthy are legally stealing from them every day.

Black people are poor because when white folk were forced to accept them as a part of society they refused to give them any good jobs.

That's an extremely bigoted thing to say on account of it being commie propaganda >=[

[Baruch]

My personal observation tells me that the reason for most of these instances is because blacks are poor. Why do I think that? Because you can observe poor people of any racial background and see similar instances. So, it's not a race thing; it's a poor thing. Why are blacks poor? They make bad decisions. Why do they make bad decisions? Because they're poor and because of gang culture. It's a negative feedback loop

But it can all be fixed, if we just go back in time and nuke Jamestown in 1607.  They had no slaves in the world, or even in Africa, before the American colonists did what everyone else was doing.

[Baruch]

That is an extremely bigotted thing to say. People do not become poor because of bad decisions. They become poor because the wealthy are legally stealing from them every day.

Black people are poor because when white folk were forced to accept them as a part of society they refused to give them any good jobs.

So set up your Soviet (committee of socialists) and go kill the rich people, right?  Don't forget to kill rich Blacks like Oprah.  They are just Uncle Toms.  Like General Colin Powell and Justice Thomas too.

We all make bad decisions, in a bad society.  It isn't just Black folk, but White folk too.  And some say, contrary to Frederick Douglas (Lincoln for example) that Black folk will never be accepted in America.  Frederick Douglas chose the future of the Black community, for better or worse.  In fact, the option of shipping all the freed slaves to Liberia (American colony founded by abolitionists) would have been pretty bad for African-Americans too.

The Europeans sent their psychopaths here, and it shows.

[Baruch]

I agree that gvment has trained us with their propaganda to suite their desires. but I am curious which propaganda are you refering to?

That if we give tax cuts to corporations they will share it with their employees?

That Russia was a dire threat because they had more nuclear missiles than us?(they never had more than 1/5 the number of U.S. during the entire cold war)

That they had to drop a bomb on Hiroshima? (Japan was trying to surrender 6months before the bomb was finished. and was already close to a total collapse when it was used)

That Mexicans are more dangerous to the U.S. than Trump?

That there is no such thing as a dirty cop?

Typical Leftist agit-prop.  Initially the Soviets had fewer nuclear weapons, but they caught up, and currently have more (we choose to have fewer than we could, but there is a plan for new micro-nukes (see 9/11).

I know some people here are refugees from the 60s, and some even were part of the Protests.  But you gotta stop smoking Weed.

[Cavebear]

1. Despite the fact that African Americans make up 13% of the population and an estimated 15% of American drug users, 37% of all drug arrests are against African Americans.

That's a weird way of saying that, but maybe something is lost in translation.

If your point is that the system is unfair, you won't get an argument here.    I would like all law enforcement to be equal and based on facts.

[Unbeliever]

I would like all law enforcement to be equal and based on facts.

Best not to hold your breath waiting for that, I'd say.

[Cavebear]

Best not to hold your breath waiting for that, I'd say.

I'm not holding my breath.  I am, however, waiting in hope and expectation...