Did Jesus ever exist?

[Mike Cl]

There is a Roman record of crucifixion, and a burial record for a man named Jesus of Nazareth around the correct time. There was an excellent research study published last year. I'll have to dig around and find it again.

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Thank you--I'd be very interested to read it.

[Cavebear]

There is a Roman record of crucifixion, and a burial record for a man named Jesus of Nazareth around the correct time. There was an excellent research study published last year. I'll have to dig around and find it again.

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The evidence you suggest would be both fascinating and world-impacting.  And therefore, unlikely.

[trdsf]

There is a Roman record of crucifixion, and a burial record for a man named Jesus of Nazareth around the correct time. There was an excellent research study published last year. I'll have to dig around and find it again.

You would think that if they could record the burial, they might also chance to note an un-burial three days later.  Seems to me that would be a lot more newsworthy than the execution and burial of a colonial rebel.

Besides, even if Jeshua bar-Joseph is a historical figure, that doesn't make him divine.  You can't say "Ah!  Jesus existed!  Therefore he must be the son of god!"  Those are two different things entirely.  You can with just as much legitimacy (and with a lot more evidence of his physical existence) say "Ah!  Alexander the Great existed!  Therefore he's a god!"  Certainly he was proclaimed one, and there is a great deal more documentary evidence for his real and historical existence.

Hardly matters anyway.  Almost all "christians" are actually Paulists, not Jesuists.  His interpretation dominates most modern theology far more than the purported recorded words of Jesus.  So why isn't Paul venerated as divine?

[Unbeliever]

Thank you--I'd be very interested to read it.

Don't hold your breath, Mike - I doubt any such thing will be forthcoming.

[Sorginak]

I almost forgot.

Jesus does exist.

He exist in various forms today by the Spanish name; you might know him as the gardener that Trump wants to deport, leaving no one else to do your gardening because, after all, who wants to do the jobs that only Spanish people do?

[Mike Cl]

Don't hold your breath, Mike - I doubt any such thing will be forthcoming.

Yeah, I kind of figured that at the time.  But nothing ventured--nothing gained.

[Cavebear]

I've always thought most christians were Essenes...  But more hedonistic.

[Baruch]

I've always thought most christians were Essenes...  But more hedonistic.

Some scholars think there is an Essene connection to John the Baptist, and from that a connection to Jesus ... or if they weren't real, at least between the communities that the two men symbolically represent.  The Essenes criticized the Temple establishment, and so did those two groups.

[Cavebear]

Some scholars think there is an Essene connection to John the Baptist, and from that a connection to Jesus ... or if they weren't real, at least between the communities that the two men symbolically represent.  The Essenes criticized the Temple establishment, and so did those two groups.

I think the Romans did actually mention Essenes (as noisy pests) and there seems to have been ritual water-bathing (a good thing in unwashed times), but all other than that is unproven as to individuals.

I consider the entirety of the bible as copied stuff from older also false theisms of older theisms of older theisms back to the first idiot who came up with the deity idea after too much catnip equivalent.

[Baruch]

I think the Romans did actually mention Essenes (as noisy pests) and there seems to have been ritual water-bathing (a good thing in unwashed times), but all other than that is unproven as to individuals.

I consider the entirety of the bible as copied stuff from older also false theisms of older theisms of older theisms back to the first idiot who came up with the deity idea after too much catnip equivalent.

We are of course infinitely superior to early humans (who were anatomically identical to us) ... there has been a lot of social and cultural evolution since the Stone Age.  But as people ... we are not different from them.  Now I might have a higher social or cultural evolution that X, because I go to Shakespeare plays for example.  Is that the one-up-man-ship you are talking about.  Every song was stolen from every other song, every poem was copied from every other poem ... imitation is the greatest admiration.

[Cavebear]

I think the Romans did actually mention Essenes (as noisy pests) and there seems to have been ritual water-bathing (a good thing in unwashed times), but all other than that is unproven as to individuals.

I consider the entirety of the bible as copied stuff from older also false theisms of older theisms of older theisms back to the first idiot who came up with the deity idea after too much catnip equivalent.

And probably should have added that the some of the biblical actions make no sense at all.  But disproving religious texts is as pointless as arguing with earthworms about what to eat.

[Baruch]

And probably should have added that the some of the biblical actions make no sense at all.  But disproving religious texts is as pointless as arguing with earthworms about what to eat.

If you want sense, read a logic text book.  But that is a futile exercise.

[Unbeliever]

I consider the entirety of the bible as copied stuff from older also false theisms of older theisms of older theisms back to the first idiot who came up with the deity idea after too much catnip equivalent.

I think the first deities that came along were the result of people watching the sky and trying to remember when various stars and groups of stars would rise/set. This is called astro-theology.

Astrotheology is the study of the astronomical origins of religion; how gods, goddesses, and demons are personifications of astronomical phenomena such as lunar eclipses, planetary alignments, and apparent interactions of planetary bodies with stars.

[Baruch]

Yes, the procto-theologists weren't nearly as popular ;-) (pulling ideas out of their asses)

[popsthebuilder]

Freakin lofl!

faith in selfless unity for good