Is morality an invention or do we all have somewhat of a built in compass?

Started by 374621, November 10, 2016, 06:02:19 PM

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374621

I was wondering if all or most humans throughout history have had a conscience, this inner feeling that makes them feel bad when they murder for no reason or makes them feel good if they feed a homeless man for example. Or is morality a man made thing, maybe with religion the religious authorities started telling everyone what is good and what is bad and told the masses what rules to follow because this is what God wants maybe his is how morality was originated?. I wonder if the people that owned slaves ever felt bad/guity about owning them or if they never experienced a discomfort in owning another human being or maybe they thought their slaves were animals or something. I wonder if in the distant past when humans were hunters if they didnt feel bad going into a village and killing the men and taking the women for themselves or maybe they did feel bad but they ignored that feeling.

Unbeliever

I think we get our morality from those who care for us as infants/toddlers. As Lenin once said, "Give me a child for the first 5 years of his life and he will be mine forever."
God Not Found
"There is a sucker born-again every minute." - C. Spellman

Mermaid

A cynical habit of thought and speech, a readiness to criticise work which the critic himself never tries to perform, an intellectual aloofness which will not accept contact with life’s realities â€" all these are marks, not as the possessor would fain to think, of superiority but of weakness. -TR

Mr.Obvious

Quote from: 374621 on November 10, 2016, 06:02:19 PM
I was wondering if all or most humans throughout history have had a conscience, this inner feeling that makes them feel bad when they murder for no reason or makes them feel good if they feed a homeless man for example. Or is morality a man made thing, maybe with religion the religious authorities started telling everyone what is good and what is bad and told the masses what rules to follow because this is what God wants maybe his is how morality was originated?. I wonder if the people that owned slaves ever felt bad/guity about owning them or if they never experienced a discomfort in owning another human being or maybe they thought their slaves were animals or something. I wonder if in the distant past when humans were hunters if they didnt feel bad going into a village and killing the men and taking the women for themselves or maybe they did feel bad but they ignored that feeling.
Depends by what you mean by 'invention' and 'built in'.
Empathy and THE potential to social cognition seem Like traits passed on and develloped by biological evolution.
Morality and specific social cognition in a society are taught, and socially evolved. They are not 'invented' in The way one says: Hey we need a new X, let's make it Y.
That's my to cents in a nutshell. Not sure I'm explaining it well.
"If we have to go down, we go down together!"
- Your mum, last night, requesting 69.

Atheist Mantis does not pray.

Gawdzilla Sama

Quote from: Mermaid on November 10, 2016, 06:29:21 PM
It's part nature, (biological), part nurture.
Animals other than humans show morality. "Groom and be groomed", for example.
We 'new atheists' have a reputation for being militant, but make no mistake  we didn't start this war. If you want to place blame put it on the the religious zealots who have been poisoning the minds of the  young for a long long time."
PZ Myers

374621

Quote from: Unbeliever on November 10, 2016, 06:19:07 PM
I think we get our morality from those who care for us as infants/toddlers. As Lenin once said, "Give me a child for the first 5 years of his life and he will be mine forever."

If kids are taught at an early age that its ok to murder steal lie etc if its for your benefit will they ever "feel bad" for doing what they do

374621

I wonder if in the distant past humans didnt have any morals or a conscience and when religion/philosophies or more established religion like Christianity came along  all of a sudden morals were introduced and people started having morals/ethics and fast forward to now i think most humans have what is known as a conscience that makes them feel bad if they steal or murder.

Was thinking if some humans live all their lives in a cave or are raised by animals/feral children I wonder if their introduced to the real/outside world if they would have any morals

Gawdzilla Sama

Quote from: 374621 on November 10, 2016, 06:41:20 PM
If kids are taught at an early age that its ok to murder steal lie etc if its for your benefit will they ever "feel bad" for doing what they do
It may happen. People can change what they "feel is right".
We 'new atheists' have a reputation for being militant, but make no mistake  we didn't start this war. If you want to place blame put it on the the religious zealots who have been poisoning the minds of the  young for a long long time."
PZ Myers

Gawdzilla Sama

Quote from: 374621 on November 10, 2016, 06:50:47 PM
I wonder if in the distant past humans didnt have any morals or a conscience and when religion/philosophies or more established religion like Christianity came along  all of a sudden morals were introduced and people started having morals/ethics and fast forward to now i think most humans have what is known as a conscience that makes them feel bad if they steal or murder.

Was thinking if some humans live all their lives in a cave or are raised by animals/feral children I wonder if their introduced to the real/outside world if they would have any morals
Morals didn't come from religion, religion coopted morals to have something to "sell." My opinion, based on long term observation.
We 'new atheists' have a reputation for being militant, but make no mistake  we didn't start this war. If you want to place blame put it on the the religious zealots who have been poisoning the minds of the  young for a long long time."
PZ Myers

374621

Quote from: Mr.Obvious on November 10, 2016, 06:30:20 PM
Depends by what you mean by 'invention' and 'built in'.
Empathy and THE potential to social cognition seem Like traits passed on and develloped by biological evolution.
Morality and specific social cognition in a society are taught, and socially evolved. They are not 'invented' in The way one says: Hey we need a new X, let's make it Y.
That's my to cents in a nutshell. Not sure I'm explaining it well.

Did empathy evolve over time, meaning early humans didnt have any

By morality being invented I mean that maybe when religions started becoming known and getting popular people were told that God wants us to follow certain rules and so this was the first time in human history where alot of humans were having thoughts like i cant just murder someone simply because they made me angry or i cant just take for myself any woman i desire, etc.

374621

Quote from: Gawdzilla Sama on November 10, 2016, 06:51:09 PM
It may happen. People can change what they "feel is right".

I doubt their mindset can be changed, for example sociopaths/psychopaths, how can you tell them to have empathy or not do bad things, or to be nice, if it were legal they could get away with it alot of them would murder simply to steal a 100$ and they would not feel remorse at all, if they were to volunteer or feed someone whos hungry they would not get this feel good feeling that most humans would get.

The Skeletal Atheist

Humans are social animals. That necessitates a primitive sense of "morality". The rest is cultural.
Some people need to be beaten with a smart stick.

Kein Mehrheit Fur Die Mitleid!

Kein Mitlied F�r Die Mehrheit!

aitm

Quote from: 374621 on November 10, 2016, 06:58:04 PM

maybe when religions started becoming known and getting popular people were told that God wants us to follow certain rules...

When you decide to start studying religions around the world and in history, you will find an odd commonality, that the "god" of that area seems to share the same rules that the society that claims to follow that god….how odd eh? Think about it, it's not a trick question.
A humans desire to live is exceeded only by their willingness to die for another. Even god cannot equal this magnificent sacrifice. No god has the right to judge them.-first tenant of the Panotheust

aitm

A humans desire to live is exceeded only by their willingness to die for another. Even god cannot equal this magnificent sacrifice. No god has the right to judge them.-first tenant of the Panotheust

Mr.Obvious

Quote from: 374621 on November 10, 2016, 06:58:04 PM
Did empathy evolve over time, meaning early humans didnt have any

By morality being invented I mean that maybe when religions started becoming known and getting popular people were told that God wants us to follow certain rules and so this was the first time in human history where alot of humans were having thoughts like i cant just murder someone simply because they made me angry or i cant just take for myself any woman i desire, etc.

If empathy evolved, and we can see it in other group-animals, Why would it not be present in our ancesters before humans could first be called humans?

Religions and THE belief in forces greater than ourselves develloped, evolved and changed through social evolution and social interaction. Just as laws and morality. Or so it seems. To claim one "fully develloped" as THE instigator of THE other seems Like a stretch to me.

If you need religion for morality, what would THE world look Like without religion, to you? What would people without religion be Like, according to you?
"If we have to go down, we go down together!"
- Your mum, last night, requesting 69.

Atheist Mantis does not pray.