Started by Absurd Atheist, November 04, 2016, 12:54:59 AM
Quote from: Absurd Atheist on November 12, 2016, 07:59:05 PMMarx dreamed of utopia but horrendously missed the mark, but he certainly did change the world. Imagine if a figure could harness said power for a positive end? Also, I don't know how Socrates like methods would apply to a written political philosophy. I feel like that would almost contradict everything he purportedly stood for.
Quote from: Baruch on November 13, 2016, 10:17:28 AMSocrates was in your face, not in your scroll. Plato was his greatest pupil, and his greatest sell-out.
Quote from: Absurd Atheist on November 13, 2016, 01:15:51 PMExactly, I can only imagine what would happen if Marx got in the face of the political and public sphere. The question however, is whether the idea of a Socratic figure has evolved over time.
Quote from: Absurd Atheist on November 13, 2016, 03:45:11 PMSo perhaps Socrates as we know him would've never existed if there wasn't someone taking advantage. So what is the value of selfish individuals?
Quote from: Baruch on November 13, 2016, 04:14:26 PMAdam Smith says, selfish individuals, acting in competition not group think or conspiracy ... gives the best results. Ideas, people and organizations are allowed to fail under competition. That way you don't have a Plato up on top in the ivory tower, deciding who should win and who should lose (see failure of Japanese 5th generation computing) ... it is based on facts on the ground (Silicon Valley before political corruption kicked in). Like a McDonalds franchise ... you either have a good restaurant, that gets enough traffic or you do not. That is pro bono. The opposite is to force people buy McDonalds products, or at least to distort the free market by encouraging people to buy McDonalds products due to falsification or subsidy ... in that case, even if you run a bad restaurant, you don't get Darwin-ed, but you survive while thinking you are a genius. In a win at all costs society, the temptation to corrupt (subsidies, fraud, coercion) is great. Also larger organizations (Fortune 500) are more likely to be political and bureaucratic like the government. Generally, unsubsidized and unregulated small business, if competitive, is the ideal (Chamber of Commerce before it was corrupted by politics). Modern society however tends toward totalitarianism ... giant governments and giant business combines ... often acting in collusion, consciously or unconsciously, against the common good (as Adam Smith also noticed).But humanity is a social animal, no man is an island, not even the English ;-) So balance is smart.
Quote from: Eugeny Anatolievich on November 20, 2016, 04:18:08 PMMarx included some of Adam Smith's ideas in his economical theory, but he didn't believe in 'invisible hand of market'.
Quote from: Cavebear on November 17, 2016, 06:24:54 AMAdam Smith gives us Trump. Unfettered desires and successes do not make things "right" either. Rationality lies between Smith and Marx.
Quote from: Baruch on November 17, 2016, 07:14:58 AMIf one knows personal details about Smith and Marx ... they are seen to be gods with clay feet.