God Put Contradictions In Bible To Weed Out Atheists

[Solomon Zorn]

No, I was thinking something different. And the article strom posted has nothing to with getting into apologetics. That man is an avengelist, he is making a right out claim from his holy schmoly text.

This is what I was referring to as apologetics:

“If I was God,” Hovind explains, “I would write the book in such a way that those who don’t want to believe in me anyway would think they found something. ‘Aha, here’s why I don’t believe.'”
“And then they could go on with their own life because they don’t want to believe God anyways,” he continues. “I would put things in there that would appear without digging to be contradictions. I don’t think that’s deceptive, I think that’s wise for the Heavenly Father to weed out those who are really serious.”

It's retarded apologetics, to be sure, but I think it still qualifies.

Or if that was one of your usual passive agressive snarky remarks aimed at me, it once again fell short at understanding what was offered. 

Actually, Shoe, I was trying to agree with you.

[Solomon Zorn]

Is apologetics taught in seminaries?

I would imagine so. It's pretty necessary for anyone who wants to preach/defend the Bible.

[gentle_dissident]

Basically you become your own audio Ouija board.

Thank you for the term.

[Baruch]

Thank you for the term.

Some oracles (people) have automatic writing rather than automatic speech.  Supposedly Pentecostal automatic speech ... is unintelligible ... and requires an "interpreter" ... this is clear in The Didache from the 1st century CE.  The automatic speech I am referring to ... is intelligible ... as we are told regarding Muhammad.

[widdershins]

I was told in a conversation just yesterday that he basically designed "his word" so that the wise would be confused.  It's kind of a running theme that God hates smart people, though they'll never say it out loud and chastise you for saying it yourself.  After all, in all the Garden of Eden, just one thing was denied man; just one thing was forbidden; just one thing would condemn us all for all eternity.  Knowing too much.

[Unbeliever]

a classic exercise in theology aka nonsense.

As has been pointed out, "a theologian is like a blind man in a dark room, searching for a black cat that isn't there--and finding it!"

[Baruch]

I was told in a conversation just yesterday that he basically designed "his word" so that the wise would be confused.  It's kind of a running theme that God hates smart people, though they'll never say it out loud and chastise you for saying it yourself.  After all, in all the Garden of Eden, just one thing was denied man; just one thing was forbidden; just one thing would condemn us all for all eternity.  Knowing too much.

Knowledge vs understanding.  Knowing without understanding is dangerous.  A child with matches and no supervision.  Adam and Eve were the typical willful children, teenagers actually, like in the movie Blue Lagoon, with one absentee parental unit.  Bound to end bad, once the kids "know" each other, as in play doctor.

[widdershins]

Knowledge vs understanding.  Knowing without understanding is dangerous.  A child with matches and no supervision.  Adam and Eve were the typical willful children, teenagers actually, like in the movie Blue Lagoon, with one absentee parental unit.  Bound to end bad, once the kids "know" each other, as in play doctor.

You put it so...gently.  But the story is actually much darker than that.  Not only was there an absentee parent, he also left them alone with the equivalent of the creepy, alcoholic uncle who had just gotten out of prison on a horse rape charge.

[GSOgymrat]

Young Earth creationism evangelist Kent Hovind asserted this week that God had purposefully put contradictions in the Bible to “weed out” non-believers.

In a YouTube video posted on Monday, the Christian fundamentalist responds to a follower who is troubled by a contradiction in the book of Acts.

“If I was God,” Hovind explains, “I would write the book in such a way that those who don’t want to believe in me anyway would think they found something. ‘Aha, here’s why I don’t believe.'”

“And then they could go on with their own life because they don’t want to believe God anyways,” he continues. “I would put things in there that would appear without digging to be contradictions. I don’t think that’s deceptive, I think that’s wise for the Heavenly Father to weed out those who are really serious.”

Hovind says that he made a choice to “believe the Bible until it’s proven wrong.”

“I know others who have decided, ‘I’m not going to believe it until you prove everything is right,'” he notes. “Okay, you do whatever you want to do, but I made the opposite decision.”

I didn't read about Greek gods and decide they were not real because of a detail or contradiction but because the entire concept is fantastical and doesn't reflect the world I experience. I get the impression from some Christians if enough evidence is presented that Biblical events are factual or some persuasive philosophical argument supporting Christianity explained that I will be convinced, but my atheism has nothing to do with that. People are atheists for different reasons, and some atheists can be converted to Christianity with enough evidence, but if Jesus Christ appeared before me my reaction would be the same as if Zeus appeared before me.

[stromboli]

I was told in a conversation just yesterday that he basically designed "his word" so that the wise would be confused.  It's kind of a running theme that God hates smart people, though they'll never say it out loud and chastise you for saying it yourself.  After all, in all the Garden of Eden, just one thing was denied man; just one thing was forbidden; just one thing would condemn us all for all eternity.  Knowing too much.

No question that the religious interpretations I am most familiar with (Mormonism, xtianity) are anti intellectual. The religious take on that is by over thinking you miss the point. The reality is by being knowledgeable beyond the confines of a belief you can invalidate the belief with greater understanding. Hovind's statement is akin to the Mormon general authority that said "doubt your doubts before you doubt your faith." In other words, don't overthink it.

[Mike Cl]

No question that the religious interpretations I am most familiar with (Mormonism, xtianity) are anti intellectual. The religious take on that is by over thinking you miss the point. The reality is by being knowledgeable beyond the confines of a belief you can invalidate the belief with greater understanding. Hovind's statement is akin to the Mormon general authority that said "doubt your doubts before you doubt your faith." In other words, don't overthink it.

No religion encourages thinking.  They always push belief--the stronger your belief, the closer you are to god.  Yeah--don't overthink it.

[widdershins]

No question that the religious interpretations I am most familiar with (Mormonism, xtianity) are anti intellectual. The religious take on that is by over thinking you miss the point. The reality is by being knowledgeable beyond the confines of a belief you can invalidate the belief with greater understanding. Hovind's statement is akin to the Mormon general authority that said "doubt your doubts before you doubt your faith." In other words, don't overthink it.

That is exactly right, and the mindset I was in back when I was a Pentecostal teen.  You think only in ways that confirm your beliefs.  Any idea or thought which had so much as the potential to contradict your faith was dangerous and jeopardized your very soul.  If reading the Bible made you think in ways which were contradictory to your beliefs you simple stopped thinking about it.  If talking to someone made you think in ways contradictory to your beliefs you got angry and started seeing them as the devil working on you, which helped you to not listen to reason.

[Baruch]

You put it so...gently.  But the story is actually much darker than that.  Not only was there an absentee parent, he also left them alone with the equivalent of the creepy, alcoholic uncle who had just gotten out of prison on a horse rape charge.

Yes.  Sometimes I have to believe that the "story" is based on "real life" ... that tribal life in the Bronze Age was like that.  And yes, some uncles are creepy ;-(

I am not so gentle, but I try to express myself that way.  My anger knows no words.  But idealism and realism somehow have to meet in the middle ... and primal scream therapy only gets you so far.

If Zeus appears to you ... run!  Zeus likes both little girls and little boys ;-(

A gnostic version of that story is different.  And it is told in Judaism that way too.  That G-d wanted Adam and Eve to fail, because that was the only way to get them out of the nursery and into the cold hard world.  A parenting story.

[SGOS]

but if Jesus Christ appeared before me my reaction would be the same as if Zeus appeared before me.

^Me too.  It would indeed be a moment of flummox.  I'm not sure what I would do first.  Probably go see a doctor.  Strangely, if I told my most devout Christian Friends about it, I doubt most of them would actually believe me (a known doubter and atheist).  A few might, but I would predict at least a slight wave of skepticism, perhaps mixed with mild nausea.  But then if I relayed such an experience, I would be describing a physical entity with mass, sentience, and an ability to communicate clearly without resorting to Biblical metaphor or poetry, which would probably piss them off and make them jealous, since the best they would ever hope for themselves would be meeting God through a dream, a premonition, or a warm fuzzy feeling of some sort.

[josephpalazzo]

Nothing better when it comes from the horse's mouth, Martin Luther said it best â€" "Reason is a whore, the greatest enemy that faith has."