Recent stuff involving Islam on the forum

[josephpalazzo]

And that was a good post ... not Stormfront at all.  The problem with being rational, is that the real numbers and complex numbers are unavailable to you ;-)  The problem with being logical, is that it doesn't prevent one from being consistently wrong ;-)

One, you should know that numbers are human constructs, and so their names are whimsical. Two, pure logic is for machine.

[Mike Cl]

Love and hate are two sides of the same coin. They can be creative as well as destructive. In the long run though, cool rational thinking wins out over passion.

I too, see love and hate as being connected.  I see the opposite of hate to be indifference.  I used to hate my ex.  Now I have simple indifference.  I just don't care what happens to her--good, bad, or neutral.  I don't wish her ill............I don't wish her good.  I just ignore the fact that she exists.  She has no impact.  If I really hate something, I pay attention to it, monitor it; but if I'm indifferent to it I expend zero energy on it. 

[josephpalazzo]

I too, see love and hate as being connected.  I see the opposite of hate to be indifference.  I used to hate my ex.  Now I have simple indifference.  I just don't care what happens to her--good, bad, or neutral.  I don't wish her ill............I don't wish her good.  I just ignore the fact that she exists.  She has no impact.  If I really hate something, I pay attention to it, monitor it; but if I'm indifferent to it I expend zero energy on it. 

Indeed, you get out of the love/hate connection by getting  indifferent. Good for you that you did.

[Hakurei Reimu]

Tell that to the mad scientists, or who have committed terrible crimes against humanity without a shred of emotion, or politicans who fuck over millions for their own agendas. "Pure logic" is just as dangerous as blind emotion.

Do you really think we have a shortage of emotion in this world?

[Shiranu]

Do you really think we have a shortage of emotion in this world?

No, but I do think we have many people who think that means we shouldn't value emotions and always put logic and reason ahead of emotions; something I completely and utterly disagree with.

Logic and reason are no better than emotion and passion because they serve different purposes. Emotion is just as great of tool, if not better, than logic for enacting change for the better. It would be irrational and illogical to ignore the value.

[Baruch]

No, but I do think we have many people who think that means we shouldn't value emotions and always put logic and reason ahead of emotions; something I completely and utterly disagree with.

Logic and reason are no better than emotion and passion because they serve different purposes. Emotion is just as great of tool, if not better, than logic for enacting change for the better. It would be irrational and illogical to ignore the value.

EQ vs IQ is as old as the Plato's rejection of Homer.  Aristotle however tried to put art on a rational basis with his idea of catharsis.

[SGOS]

Nice ignore list :p

The problem with the article in question is that it states "reason is different from logic," but then it follows that with a Baruchian ramble that doesn't clarify much of anything.

In common usage, being rational usually implies not getting overly emotional, as in throwing fits of rage or fits of manic ecstasy.  While being logical, often means just about anything, but not limited to "following a set of rules that test validity."  But common usage is seldom accurate.

However, the dictionary would seem to compare them as similar, rather than contrast them as different, and identifies them as actual synonyms. 

adjective: rational
1. based on or in accordance with reason or logic. 
synonyms: logical, reasoned, sensible, reasonable, cogent, intelligent, judicious, shrewd, common-sense, commonsensical, sound, prudent; down-to-earth, practical, pragmatic


adjective: logical
of or according to the rules of logic or formal argument."  •characterized by or capable of clear, sound reasoning.
synonyms: reasoned, well reasoned, reasonable, rational, left-brained, sound, cogent, well-thought-out, valid; coherent, clear, well organized, systematic, orderly, methodical, analytical, consistent, objective

[Baruch]

The problem with the article in question is that it states "reason is different from logic," but then it follows that with a Baruchian ramble that doesn't clarify much of anything.

In common usage, being rational usually implies not getting overly emotional, as in throwing fits of rage or fits of manic ecstasy.  While being logical, often means just about anything, but not limited to "following a set of rules that test validity."  But common usage is seldom accurate.

However, the dictionary would seem to compare them as similar, rather than contrast them as different, and identifies them as actual synonyms. 

adjective: rational
1. based on or in accordance with reason or logic. 


synonyms: logical, reasoned, sensible, reasonable, cogent, intelligent, judicious, shrewd, common-sense, commonsensical, sound, prudent; down-to-earth, practical, pragmatic


adjective: logical
of or according to the rules of logic or formal argument."  •characterized by or capable of clear, sound reasoning.
synonyms: reasoned, well reasoned, reasonable, rational, left-brained, sound, cogent, well-thought-out, valid; coherent, clear, well organized, systematic, orderly, methodical, analytical, consistent, objective

You get me, and take me back ...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=68X8o0S7vJc

I could quote from this ...
http://plato.stanford.edu/entries/practical-reason/

But then I don't think most readers would bother, any more than I bother to reject in detail the contents of Pr126 links.

[josephpalazzo]

The problem with the article in question is that it states "reason is different from logic," but then it follows that with a Baruchian ramble that doesn't clarify much of anything

Baruch is the self-appointed court jester. He reignsclowns everywhere (read: in all threads).

[Baruch]

Baruch is the self-appointed court jester. He reignsclowns everywhere (read: in all threads).

Glad you are awake ... the sleeper must awaken.  Now get on that giant worm and attack the Haakonens.

[drunkenshoe]

The problem is not humans possessing strong and various emotions, but how they can be manipulated for any agenda.

And a very common way to do that is to convince people how 'logical' to act in a certain way, despite their likely emotions.

[Hakurei Reimu]

No, but I do think we have many people who think that means we shouldn't value emotions and always put logic and reason ahead of emotions; something I completely and utterly disagree with.

Logic and reason are no better than emotion and passion because they serve different purposes. Emotion is just as great of tool, if not better, than logic for enacting change for the better. It would be irrational and illogical to ignore the value.

Emotion has some value, but remember that those emotions are what informed all that bigotry and hubris you also rail against, as well as the compassion and humility you value. Ultimately, your emotions are a response. We'd do well to see that response is well-modulated.

[Baruch]

Lack of EQ isn't proof that EQ is of less value.  Otherwise lack of IQ would prove that IQ is of less value.

[Hakurei Reimu]

There's no value in being a screaming lunatic.

[Baruch]

There's no value in being a screaming lunatic.

In Bedlam, if you can scream louder than the other lunatics, there might be some value in that ;-)