who else is afraid donald trump will get elected?

[trdsf]

I'm not even a little afraid Trump will win. Frankly, I don't think any Republican has a chance. But that doesn't stop me from poo-pooing Trump to my elitist Republican friends. Because ha-ha!

Vote Sanders in the primary, so the general is already won.

Funny thing is, in most national polling, Sanders clobbers Trump while he's only at parity with most other candidates.  I would love to see Bernie disassemble Donny in a Presidential debate.

I also am not convinced that Trump won't run independent when he starts failing to win primaries.  Which will only serve to turn a Democratic win into a Democratic landslide.

[Gerard]

Somehow I hope he takes the Republican nomination. He'll never ever be elected President. There might be a third party candidate if he get's the nomination. Republicans will have something to think about when the clownshow is over. Big purge! Well, that's what I hope.

Gerard

[Gerard]

But I think that when the first primaries are over, we'll see that the Donald will not be eaten as hot as he's being cooked now. My guess? Once the primaries are underway it will become a game between either Bush, Christie or Rubio against a somewhat more teapartyite type. No Cruz, no Carson, no Huckabee and yes... no Donald. But thenagain I'm not that good at prophesy.....

Gerard

[Gerard]

Is Paul Ryan competing even?

Gerard

[doorknob]

hmmmm

this thread looks derailed.

[Baruch]

Is Paul Ryan competing even?

Gerard

Paul Ryan became Speaker ... same as PM in GB, right?  Well at least when the Speaker looks in the mirror in the morning!  And more powerful than under Speaker Orange ... now that the House of Lards is held by the same party as the Un-Commons.

[FaithIsFilth]

That is not even remotely correct.  They do not want to take "your guns" away.  Certain guns, yes, but taking "certain guns" is a far cry from taking "your guns", which implies all.  And they very much should be looking at some reasonable gun laws and taking certain guns away because it works.

So we are in agreement. They want to take any decent guns that might pose a threat to them. Those in power don't give a shit about human life. If you think they do, even a little, you are mistaken. They want to take the guns so they have all the power. If you want all the decent guns taken, that means you want to see the police state have 100% of the power and for the people to have none.

I don't trust the government enough to say that guns should be banned. If you think the actions of the government are fucked up now, wait until they have absolutely zero incentive to not just completely put the boot down on the people's throats. They already have the boot on your throat, and they are looking for ways they can take away what remaining rights you have, little by little. Now, this doesn't mean that Hillary Clinton is Hitler. It's not going to be obvious like that. They will take your rights little by little over time. This is not to say that they will take every last right, but they will take a shitload, and that is enough.

Bush ripped up the constitution after 9/11. Obama ripped it up into smaller pieces. The police state is rising. The streets of America are now filled with military vehicles. Protesting is banned in places like that shithole France and we see the freedoms that have been taken there. The information war wages on, which Hillary Clinton admits the US is losing. Independent media is under attack. Videos that deal with war and politics on youtube have recently been de-monetized. The US government, working with google, is trying to stop these people from making money, so they have less of an incentive to report on the sick shit Western governments are doing at the moment. We have Youtube closing down people's accounts because they have an anti-government message. Western leaders are on the so called "news" calling anti-government people who don't accept the official story of 9/11 terrorists who are no better than ISIS. On other "news" stations, we have people making the case that anti-government people like 9/11 truthers should have their guns taken or be banned from buying guns because those beliefs are just too "crazy". You know what? What the 9/11 truthers believe is a thousand times less crazy than what any religious person believes, but you don't see people on the news saying ban all theists from having guns because they're just so "crazy". The anti-gun agenda is clear. Anti-government people are not being demonized in the media because these media people are just so upset that the anti-government people say such 'offensive' things. These prestitute media whores demonize the anti-government people because it is their job to do so. Western governments see these anti-government people as a threat to their bullshit, and that is why they call them terrorists and that is why they are fighting an information war.

I used to be an anti-gunner, and I get it. You want to stop people from dying. Having a gun at home makes you more likely to get shot. I get it. That's partly why I don't have a gun. That, plus I'm really poor and can't really afford one. You look at a place like my country, Canada, and you wish your gun death rate was similar to ours. I get it. You have to also acknowledge that you are taking a leap of faith when you give up all the decent guns, and you are putting your faith in the American government. The same government that is the biggest terrorist around the world. The same government that has nuked cities. The same government that locks up non-violent drug offenders. The same government that locks up whistleblowers. The same government that arms the friends of ISIS and Al Qaeda, or that arms the people that join ISIS and Al Qaeda. The same government that just ok'ed the shootdown of a Russian jet and who may be responsible for getting World War III started. Because of the US government, the women of Syria have gone from wearing tanktops to wearing beekeeper outfits and getting their heads chopped off.

I get that you think banning guns is going to solve things, but if you don't think there is going to be any downside to that, I just don't know what to tell you. If you are willing to make that leap of faith and risk giving someone like Trump, Cliton, or another Bush and their police state 100% of the power and control, be my guest. If you believe that someone like Hillary Clinton is not a threat to your freedoms, you are free to go ahead and put your faith in her.

[AllPurposeAtheist]

The part that worries me most about tRump isn't the economic issues. tRump knows that even poor people vote. That's not really the issue because I don't think that any politician gives a rats ass about our bank account or lack of.  What really bothers me about tRump is that he's a fascist and would drum up the support to back a lot of brown shirt types to become very violent towards any opposition. He might go so far as to attempt to outlaw opposition parties.  Now that gives me the eebiejeebies.

[SGOS]

I shake my head in shame every time I look at the title of this thread. I've never claimed to be good at spelling guys and my apologies!

FYI  You can modify posts to change spelling and other mistakes.  What you may not realize is that you can modify the title of a thread too, but that option only appears when you modify the first post of the thread.

[Baruch]

The part that worries me most about tRump isn't the economic issues. tRump knows that even poor people vote. That's not really the issue because I don't think that any politician gives a rats ass about our bank account or lack of.  What really bothers me about tRump is that he's a fascist and would drum up the support to back a lot of brown shirt types to become very violent towards any opposition. He might go so far as to attempt to outlaw opposition parties.  Now that gives me the eebiejeebies.

I would like to be so egotistical ... that like Nixon ... I could keep an enemies list.  But I am anonymous and unimportant ... so I will never be important enough to play golf or have personal bodyguards ... or have an enemies list (real or imagined).  Am I missing out?  Mr Trump, having had a rich father, has had a personal bodyguard his whole life.  Has to be odd to constantly fear being kidnapped for ransom.  Might make one paranoid.

The US is not based on a semi-religious faith in government, with the President as a semi-Pope ... but we do now have this faith and this ex-cathedra authority.  Sheeple.  It may not be that everyone is Hitler under the skin, but we do all seem to be Nixon under the skin.  Such a person has no business voting, running for office or holding office.  Such a person has no business being in Business either ... people and any power at all, don't mix.  And that is why, skepticism of all government, even when I work for that government, and see it from the inside out, as well as the outside in ... something not all of you can claim ... I am still skeptical.  You can't unlike George W ... look into Putin's soul ... or Obama's.

Now do I think that having a gun will protect me from feral police or the army should they take notice of me?  Of course not.  So I am still divided on guns just like the rest of you.  Crazy people shouldn't have access to a spork.  No President should have access to the Bomb.

Now I would love to see opposition parties outlawed ... serially, if we can't do this simultaneously.  Party feeling is contrary to George Washington ... and Thomas Jefferson knew it!  Thomas Jefferson invented partisanship, though it was to tie down excessive Federal power exerted by Washington and John Adams.  So here we are ... still battling between the Federalists vs the Jeffersonians.

Given the size and nature of America, it would be very difficult to regulate guns like Australia.  I am totally gobsmacked that the Australians agreed to be a bunch of castrated wallabies!  I used to look up to Crocodile Dundee, but not anymore.

[FaithIsFilth]

One point I forgot to add. Rifles only account for 3 hundred some odd murders a year in the US. Under 400 murders a year by rifle, so banning these won't do much, and if you think politicians motive here is just to save lives, you are wrong. The rifle issue is extremely overblown. I read over on af.org last night that the overall homicide rate in the US is 121st. The gun homicide rate is over 50% lower than it was 20 plus years ago, and we're talking about banning rifles to save what, a couple hundred lives, because people are still going to commit these acts with other types of guns?

[aitm]

Don't fear stupid voters, the ones to fear are the fearful voters. Like religion, you cannot fight fear with reason. Right now, you have a nation of very frightened people who are convinced that a war with muslims is imminent and they are eyeing their dark skinned neighbors very carefully.

[Baruch]

Don't fear stupid voters, the ones to fear are the fearful voters. Like religion, you cannot fight fear with reason. Right now, you have a nation of very frightened people who are convinced that a war with muslims is imminent and they are eyeing their dark skinned neighbors very carefully.

For Americans, Muslim and Black are closely aligned ... so our alienation from minorities is colored by that relationship, in a way it wouldn't be in Germany.  We have always viewed our Black neighbors very carefully ... mostly to protect our residential real estate prices.

[widdershins]

So we are in agreement. They want to take any decent guns that might pose a threat to them. Those in power don't give a shit about human life. If you think they do, even a little, you are mistaken. They want to take the guns so they have all the power. If you want all the decent guns taken, that means you want to see the police state have 100% of the power and for the people to have none.

No, we are not in agreement as they already have all the "decent guns" that would "pose a threat to them".  They have missiles they can fire from a ship of the coast of China that will go to your house, knock on your door and wait for you to answer before blowing up.  Okay, not quite, but pretty damned close.  If you have an underground bunker they do have missiles that will count the floors it goes through to blow up at the one they want destroyed.  There are no guns that are a threat to that.  I don't care what guns you have, you can't take out a satellite or a battleship with them.  AND you switched the conversation back to "the guns" again.

I don't trust the government enough to say that guns should be banned. If you think the actions of the government are fucked up now, wait until they have absolutely zero incentive to not just completely put the boot down on the people's throats. They already have the boot on your throat, and they are looking for ways they can take away what remaining rights you have, little by little. Now, this doesn't mean that Hillary Clinton is Hitler. It's not going to be obvious like that. They will take your rights little by little over time. This is not to say that they will take every last right, but they will take a shitload, and that is enough.

I don't trust the government either.  They are wholly owned by corporate interest.  If there's a politician out there who can't be bought then unicorns live up my ass.  But assault rifles are being used to kill kids, not politicians, so your slippery slope argument doesn't pan.

Bush ripped up the constitution after 9/11.

I agree with that, specifically with the Patriot Act (you see, I have specific reasons for thinking the way I do).

Obama ripped it up into smaller pieces.

In what way?  Because he's using his power to get something, ANYTHING done in an era of 6 year olds running Congress on the idea that if they are going to give him something (which is always something EVERYONE wants, INCLUDING THEM!) then they had better get something in return.  EVEN IF you count the immigration plan as anti-constitution, at least with that, the courts will work it out.  The Patriot Act is unchallenged for the most part.

The police state is rising. The streets of America are now filled with military vehicles. Protesting is banned in places like that shithole France and we see the freedoms that have been taken there. The information war wages on, which Hillary Clinton admits the US is losing. Independent media is under attack. Videos that deal with war and politics on youtube have recently been de-monetized. The US government, working with google, is trying to stop these people from making money, so they have less of an incentive to report on the sick shit Western governments are doing at the moment. We have Youtube closing down people's accounts because they have an anti-government message. Western leaders are on the so called "news" calling anti-government people who don't accept the official story of 9/11 terrorists who are no better than ISIS. On other "news" stations, we have people making the case that anti-government people like 9/11 truthers should have their guns taken or be banned from buying guns because those beliefs are just too "crazy".

There's a lot there and I'm afraid I'm going to have to stop you at "9/11 truthers".  There is no "truth" to the 9/11 conspiracy crap any more than there is to the Roswell crap.  I watched "Loose Change" and it was bullshit.  I only remember one of the stories, the one that made me laugh at how absolutely ludicrous this all was.  It was about a man having a conversation with another man whose skin was hanging off the ends of his arms, peeled off by extreme heat.  I'm not a doctor, but I've heard of "shock" and I know enough about trauma to know that you don't just have coffee and a casual conversation with a man injured that badly.  It doesn't happen.  So in place of "9/11 truthers" may I, instead, offer the term "9/11 nutbags"?  It seems more accurate to me.

You know what? What the 9/11 truthers believe is a thousand times less crazy than what any religious person believes, but you don't see people on the news saying ban all theists from having guns because they're just so "crazy". The anti-gun agenda is clear. Anti-government people are not being demonized in the media because these media people are just so upset that the anti-government people say such 'offensive' things. These prestitute media whores demonize the anti-government people because it is their job to do so. Western governments see these anti-government people as a threat to their bullshit, and that is why they call them terrorists and that is why they are fighting an information war.

You call a nut a nut.  That's just the way it is.  And all the "anti-government" people I've seen, the people who stockpile guns because they think that when the government attacks they are going to fight back and shoot that missile in its face, are nuts.  I don't care how well armed you are.  I don't care if you have rocket launchers and flame throwers.  Your guns won't mean shit if the government truly assaults the people with a military strike.  They have binoculars that can pick out scopes AND EYES from miles away.  They can find you if you just LOOK AT THEM!  It uses infisible infrared lasers which reflect off transparent surfaces.  They have satellites that can track your every move.  They have helicopters which can see you in the dead of night and shoot you dead through an engine block before you even hear the shots ring out.  You fight politics with politics.  If you think you're going to fight with guns, I'm sorry, but you're a nut.

I used to be an anti-gunner, and I get it. You want to stop people from dying. Having a gun at home makes you more likely to get shot. I get it. That's partly why I don't have a gun. That, plus I'm really poor and can't really afford one. You look at a place like my country, Canada, and you wish your gun death rate was similar to ours. I get it. You have to also acknowledge that you are taking a leap of faith when you give up all the decent guns, and you are putting your faith in the American government. The same government that is the biggest terrorist around the world. The same government that has nuked cities. The same government that locks up non-violent drug offenders. The same government that locks up whistleblowers. The same government that arms the friends of ISIS and Al Qaeda, or that arms the people that join ISIS and Al Qaeda. The same government that just ok'ed the shootdown of a Russian jet and who may be responsible for getting World War III started. Because of the US government, the women of Syria have gone from wearing tanktops to wearing beekeeper outfits and getting their heads chopped off.

I get it, you're scared of the government and you think a gun will make you safe from them.  The government is evil and guns keep us safe.  Except they don't.  They make us less safe.  You think that the only way you can be safe is if you have the "good guns", meaning the ones used in mass killings, the ones used to shoot up grade schools, the ones use to TAKE more innocent lives than they ever have the power to save.  I understand, but it's shortsighted.  You want to trade innocent lives today on the perception that those guns MAY save you from the big, bad government tomorrow.  It's the most common argument for keeping guns designed only for killing people.  It's also an uninformed, shortsighted and ignorant argument.  You can't protect yourself from napalm dropped in a carpet bombing run from 30,000 feet with an AK-47, so your argument is wrong.  You can't protect yourself from a mortar shell fired from 300 miles away with an AK-47.  You can't protect yourself from an attack helicopter firing rounds from a canon that can see you in pitch black and shoot you through the engine block of a huge truck (I've seen video of just this) with an AK-47.  You just can't.

I get that you think banning guns is going to solve things, but if you don't think there is going to be any downside to that, I just don't know what to tell you. If you are willing to make that leap of faith and risk giving someone like Trump, Cliton, or another Bush and their police state 100% of the power and control, be my guest. If you believe that someone like Hillary Clinton is not a threat to your freedoms, you are free to go ahead and put your faith in her.

No "faith" comes into play.  I don't trust the government to do the right thing for me, ESPECIALLY when Republicans are in charge.  But you spout off about how the government is shutting down information, let's talk about the REAL, PROVEN ways they're doing that.  Since 1996 the CDC has been essentially banned from doing any research into the dangers of guns.  Government officials are currently making effort after effort to curb ANY research into climate change and have been for some time.  These are REAL, PROVEN things which you can EASILY find evidence for.  What you are giving is, I'm sorry, but insane rantings about how the government MIGHT be worse if we didn't have "good" guns.  Kids are being killed by these "good" guns NOW.  What MIGHT happen IF those guns are banned is a matter for discussion after it comes out of your fevered brain and into reality.

[widdershins]

One point I forgot to add. Rifles only account for 3 hundred some odd murders a year in the US. Under 400 murders a year by rifle, so banning these won't do much, and if you think politicians motive here is just to save lives, you are wrong. The rifle issue is extremely overblown. I read over on af.org last night that the overall homicide rate in the US is 121st. The gun homicide rate is over 50% lower than it was 20 plus years ago, and we're talking about banning rifles to save what, a couple hundred lives, because people are still going to commit these acts with other types of guns?

Only a couple hundred lives, huh?  That's not much.  Let's have a look at some of them, though, just for kicks.


This is from ONE mass shooting.  Save a couple hundred victims?  WORTH IT!