What Does It Even Mean to Exist Forever?

[WitchSabrina]

:rollin:  Aitm


The concept of Forever isn't difficult.   In order to exist forever you must make a serious mark on the world - a piece of art, writing that becomes epic, curing a disease, etc.   Heaven or hell has nothing to do with it.  Only the living can truly appreciate someone who's dead and gone in whatever fashion the dead left their mark.

[WitchSabrina]

:rollin:  Aitm


The concept of Forever isn't difficult.   In order to exist forever you must make a serious mark on the world - a piece of art, writing that becomes epic, curing a disease, etc.   Heaven or hell has nothing to do with it.  Only the living can truly appreciate someone who's dead and gone in whatever fashion the dead left their mark.

[Johan]

although, admittedly, an all-powerful God could cause the person to be eternally happy.  

So can a never ending supply of Prozac in heavy doses. But that doesn't mean I'd want to live my life that way.

[frosty]

:rollin:  Aitm


The concept of Forever isn't difficult.   In order to exist forever you must make a serious mark on the world - a piece of art, writing that becomes epic, curing a disease, etc.   Heaven or hell has nothing to do with it.  Only the living can truly appreciate someone who's dead and gone in whatever fashion the dead left their mark.

I get your point, but even that is not existing "forever". Those works will only exist as long as recorded human history exists. So many people have had their "works" (whatever those may be) lost to the passage of time because they were not considered important by society. If they are not perceived as important by whoever is still living they will simply be discarded.

[Jmpty]

See: Law of conservation of matter, and law of conservation of energy.

[Colanth]

See: entropy.

[Jmpty]

See: entropy.

Ah, but when the universe experiences heat death, all the matter and energy will still be. It can't not be. It will just be evenly distributed throughout the universe. Finally, some quiet.

[frosty]

See: entropy.

Ah, but when the universe experiences heat death, all the matter and energy will still be. It can't not be. It will just be evenly distributed throughout the universe. Finally, some quiet.

And that's when it all comes full circle, and the religious new agers will say "that's it!!! The matter and energy is God, the be all end all of everything!!!!111". The Alpha and Omega, the first and the last!!

Perhaps I beat them to the punch. But you get the point.

[Alias]

Has anyone contemplated that the eternal we are looking for with our mind, is veiled by mind?
Whatever you see your self as, is a label and comes from mind, is it not?
A theist should say, god is everything and the burden of proof is on the atheist to prove a individual self.
One expressing as many vs individuals.

[WitchSabrina]

:rollin:  Aitm


The concept of Forever isn't difficult.   In order to exist forever you must make a serious mark on the world - a piece of art, writing that becomes epic, curing a disease, etc.   Heaven or hell has nothing to do with it.  Only the living can truly appreciate someone who's dead and gone in whatever fashion the dead left their mark.

I get your point, but even that is not existing "forever". Those works will only exist as long as recorded human history exists. So many people have had their "works" (whatever those may be) lost to the passage of time because they were not considered important by society. If they are not perceived as important by whoever is still living they will simply be discarded.

True enough.  I get your point.   I was referring to creating something special enough as to always be recognized by people -for as long as people exist.  For without people to appreciate certain works (like Shakespeare for example) - then time ceases to have meaning.   Of course *time* could continue without mankind - but we certainly won't care if we're not here anymore.   Unless you're proposing aliens - which I am not.  :rollin:

[Bellator]

:rollin:  Aitm


The concept of Forever isn't difficult.   In order to exist forever you must make a serious mark on the world - a piece of art, writing that becomes epic, curing a disease, etc.   Heaven or hell has nothing to do with it.  Only the living can truly appreciate someone who's dead and gone in whatever fashion the dead left their mark.

I get your point, but even that is not existing "forever". Those works will only exist as long as recorded human history exists. So many people have had their "works" (whatever those may be) lost to the passage of time because they were not considered important by society. If they are not perceived as important by whoever is still living they will simply be discarded.

True enough.  I get your point.   I was referring to creating something special enough as to always be recognized by people -for as long as people exist.  For without people to appreciate certain works (like Shakespeare for example) - then time ceases to have meaning.   Of course *time* could continue without mankind - but we certainly won't care if we're not here anymore.   Unless you're proposing aliens - which I am not.  :rollin:

May I be so bold as to suggest that Bach is also timeless and would appeal to more people than Shakespeare, as music is the universal language. Then again, what today passes for music...
And I am pretty sure that time will continue long after mankind has turned into stardust. I had better not start on parallel universes, but that is a wonderful subject for another "time".

[frosty]

:rollin:  Aitm


The concept of Forever isn't difficult.   In order to exist forever you must make a serious mark on the world - a piece of art, writing that becomes epic, curing a disease, etc.   Heaven or hell has nothing to do with it.  Only the living can truly appreciate someone who's dead and gone in whatever fashion the dead left their mark.

I get your point, but even that is not existing "forever". Those works will only exist as long as recorded human history exists. So many people have had their "works" (whatever those may be) lost to the passage of time because they were not considered important by society. If they are not perceived as important by whoever is still living they will simply be discarded.

True enough.  I get your point.   I was referring to creating something special enough as to always be recognized by people -for as long as people exist.  For without people to appreciate certain works (like Shakespeare for example) - then time ceases to have meaning.   Of course *time* could continue without mankind - but we certainly won't care if we're not here anymore.   Unless you're proposing aliens - which I am not.  :rollin:

I have a feeling the alien subject may create some strong opinions, but I will say this. Out of the ever expanding universe, with the trillions (and more) of stars, the plethora of planets around, and the varying planetary conditions we see regarding the few planets we can observe, the mathematical probability of us being the only "intelligent" lifeform out there seems very slim. Perhaps the biological organisms that any hypothetical alien would be based from can survive in different planetary environments than us humans. To simply rule out any other life because A) we cannot see it, therefore it does not exist and B) certain planets do not match our own specific living conditions, I think is a little shortsighted.

We have made great strides as a species but we simply do not know everything there is to know about what's out there. Keep in mind I am referring to scientific paradigms here, not religious or spiritual. Any scientists, even the biggest of the hotheads, will admit that we do not know everything there is to know about everything.

And to anybody that replies, keep in mind that aliens at this point are still a hypothetical maybe and I am not in any way insisting that they in fact exist, because I have no proof to show you.

[Colanth]

See: entropy.

Ah, but when the universe experiences heat death, all the matter and energy will still be. It can't not be. It will just be evenly distributed throughout the universe.

As individual sub-atomic particles, but not as "you".

[Colanth]

Has anyone contemplated that the eternal we are looking for with our mind, is veiled by mind?
Whatever you see your self as, is a label and comes from mind, is it not?
A theist should say, god

Oops - burden of proof right there, and no one has ever met it.

[Jmpty]

Has anyone contemplated that the eternal we are looking for with our mind, is veiled by mind?
Whatever you see your self as, is a label and comes from mind, is it not?
A theist should say, god

Oops - burden of proof right there, and no one has ever met it.

I can prove it, I just don't feel like it right now.