Ohio toddler finds mom's gun, shoots self.

[TrueStory]

Well, True, I actually mean clip.  Even the DI's used the term "clip".  Regardless, I think you know what I was saying.  Nitpicking details does not change what I was saying.

I answered your question first and then provided some clarification, that is not nitpicking.

Because the killings are suicide then that makes it okay? 

Is that what you are asserting?  I know I didn't make any claim, nor do I want.

Typical comments from a NRA shill; kind of like Christians who believe literally in the bible.  Are you one of those, too???

Thats not nice to call people names that you don't know anything about.  Also I don't have the energy to look up the fallacy where you immediatly claim i'm with the NRA and compare me to a christian following the bible, poisoning the well is what I would guess.

[Mike Cl]

I answered your question first and then provided some clarification, that is not nitpicking.

Is that what you are asserting?  I know I didn't make any claim, nor do I want.
Thats not nice to call people names that you don't know anything about.  Also I don't have the energy to look up the fallacy where you immediatly claim i'm with the NRA and compare me to a christian following the bible, poisoning the well is what I would guess.

If I misread you, True, sorry about that.  I am simply so tired of the usual NRA drivel on this issue and I made a snap judgement that you sort of smacked of that attitude.  I have never, ever been wrong about anybody, or anything before--ever--could be the first time tho.  :))) Regardless of the reasons, the death toll in this country from guns is just appalling.  And nobody wants to do jack about it.

[Aletheia]

Regardless of the reasons, the death toll in this country from guns is just appalling.  And nobody wants to do jack about it.

There are plenty who are trying to rally against the excessive use of guns and the gross negligence in ownership of these guns. However, it's not that easy trying to convince people who were raised to believe it was their God-given right to own a gun. Outright banning guns does not clean up the streets nor does it prevent the accidental deaths associated with family heirlooms or grandfathered guns prior to any mandate. More importantly, it's hard to lobby against large corporations who manufacture guns when their political prowess can be improved with just a little financial contribution to the right politician at the right time.

Overcoming the cycle set forth by a customer base who buys guns because they want or feel they need to, which in turn encourages gun suppliers to exploit this via marketing strategies, who then influence laws to become more lax to enable easier access to these guns, and which lastly saturates a person's environment with guns, therefore making ownership seem "proper" and therefore coveted. This is a rather large problem with multiple parts. Simply calling people idiots for owning guns is not the grand coup de grace that will settle the matter once and for all.

if this cycle is to ever stop then it will have start with educating the customer base on the product they are interested in buying. The attitude towards gun ownership will need to change from one of half-baked ideas and impulsiveness to one of respect and strong sense of responsibility. When a gun is viewed as more trouble than it's probably worth in day-to-day living, then people will be less inclined to buy one. Showing people the reality that a person's needs to be continually trained to use a gun in order to overcome the fear associated with scenarios that warrant the use of a gun for self-defence may help to overcome "impulse" buying.  What good is a gun if you're not capable of shooting your intended target when a life or death situation presents itself? All too much of the good qualities of gun ownership are brought up, but very little is said of the gigantic responsibility and self-discipline needed to safely use a gun.

People need to be educated to understand that when you buy a gun, you're not buying a simple object; you're subscribing to an entirely different lifestyle that will affect everything in your life - good or bad. Only then will they be able to reduce the demand and therefore the supply of guns to the typical consumer.

[hrdlr110]

Aletheia: "When a gun is viewed as more trouble than it's worth in day to day living"

This is the answer. People need to be held accountable for their weapons at all times - even if they are not carrying them. This means if your gun is stolen, then used in a crime, the gun owner should be charged as an accessory. Hard time for the misuse of your weapon might make some very stupid people realise that they are not bright enough to be responsible for a gun. However, at some level of incompetence, the dunning Kruger affect enters into the equation.

[Johan]

Regardless of the reasons, the death toll in this country from guns is just appalling.  And nobody wants to do jack about it.

Ahem  . Gun owner here. You might recall insulting me several times because of it? No? Doesn't ring a bell? Well I have trouble keeping track of everyone who has thrown unsolicited insults in my direction in these threads. Anyway I would encourage you to go back and search through the forum for how many times I've said I believe guns are too easy to purchase in this country. I've also said the gun show loop hole has to go. I've also said that guns should be tightly regulated. I've also said in this thread and others that I think the penalties need to be tougher in cases where improperly secured guns lead to the death of others.

Yeah but nobody wants to do jack about it. Sure. Now if I wanted to act like you or several others do in these threads, this is where I'd tell you to go fuck yourself you fucking moron. But that's not me. I try to keep the insults out of it so as to allow you and several others to keep the market cornered on that sort of thing in these threads.

[Gawdzilla Sama]

Ahem  . Gun owner here. You might recall insulting me several times because of it? No? Doesn't ring a bell? Well I have trouble keeping track of everyone who has thrown unsolicited insults in my direction in these threads. Anyway I would encourage you to go back and search through the forum for how many times I've said I believe guns are too easy to purchase in this country. I've also said the gun show loop hole has to go. I've also said that guns should be tightly regulated. I've also said in this thread and others that I think the penalties need to be tougher in cases where improperly secured guns lead to the death of others.

Yeah but nobody wants to do jack about it. Sure. Now if I wanted to act like you or several others do in these threads, this is where I'd tell you to go fuck yourself you fucking moron. But that's not me. I try to keep the insults out of it so as to allow you and several others to keep the market cornered on that sort of thing in these threads.

It's hard to be a moderate of any kind on the internet. Somebody's always going to find your position "outrageous", usually without having actually read what you post.

[Mike Cl]

Ahem  . Gun owner here. You might recall insulting me several times because of it? No? Doesn't ring a bell? Well I have trouble keeping track of everyone who has thrown unsolicited insults in my direction in these threads. Anyway I would encourage you to go back and search through the forum for how many times I've said I believe guns are too easy to purchase in this country. I've also said the gun show loop hole has to go. I've also said that guns should be tightly regulated. I've also said in this thread and others that I think the penalties need to be tougher in cases where improperly secured guns lead to the death of others.

Actually, I took your advice.  I looked through the last 125 of your posts and 150 of mine.  I did not see either of us calling each other names.  So, no, I don't recall calling you names. If I did, that would not be a good thing.  And my attention needs to be drawn to that--it is almost always counter productive.  I do read your posts carefully--I don't always agree with what you have to say but that's okay.  There is usually several ways to look at the same point.  You do seem to be able to articulate your point well--whether I agree with it or not.

As for the gun thing--you own a gun--good for you.  My profound sense of frustration lies with the fact that our govts. cannot or will not do anything to stem the tide of irresponsible gun ownership and selling of them.  The govt. cannot even get 100 round clips made illegal.  That to me smacks of simply corporate greed--wherever we turn, corporations have more rights than the people do.  This I find frustrating. 

You say--"Yeah but nobody wants to do jack about it. Sure. Now if I wanted to act like you or several others do in these threads, this is where I'd tell you to go fuck yourself you fucking moron. But that's not me. I try to keep the insults out of it so as to allow you and several others to keep the market cornered on that sort of thing in these threads. "

So, I still say that nobody wants to do jack about it.  And I'm really glad you don't call people fucking morons.  That is mighty upstanding of you.