When Is The Right Time To Suggest Abandoning Gods?

[SkyChief]

A few of my dear friends are believers.

We have (had) a mutual understanding that discussion about religion/deities is off-limits. For obvious reasons.

I have respected that as well as they have.

Its just gotten to the point that I care about these people very much, and believe that their (perceived) belief in gods is actually holding them back; socially and intellectually.   Its somewhat presumptuous to think this; granted,   but in my heart, I still feel compelled to help them.

But would it be the right thing to do, or would this cause a rift in our relationship?

[Mike Cl]

A few of my dear friends are believers.

We have (had) a mutual understanding that discussion about religion/deities is off-limits. For obvious reasons.

I have respected that as well as they have.

Its just gotten to the point that I care about these people very much, and believe that their (perceived) belief in gods is actually holding them back; socially and intellectually.   Its somewhat presumptuous to think this; granted,   but in my heart, I still feel compelled to help them.

But would it be the right thing to do, or would this cause a rift in our relationship?

It would cause a rift, big time.  Count on it.  Nobody wants to be told their most cherished beliefs are wrong.  They will resist that with all their might.  They will change only when they want to.  If you see that one or two of them are having doubts and they make it known to you, then you can keep feeding those doubts.  But if you want to keep them as friends, I suggest you continue to honor your 'pact'.

[Givemeareason]

A few of my dear friends are believers.

We have (had) a mutual understanding that discussion about religion/deities is off-limits. For obvious reasons.

I have respected that as well as they have.

Its just gotten to the point that I care about these people very much, and believe that their (perceived) belief in gods is actually holding them back; socially and intellectually.   Its somewhat presumptuous to think this; granted,   but in my heart, I still feel compelled to help them.

But would it be the right thing to do, or would this cause a rift in our relationship?

Not knowing your circumstances do they even know you are athiest?  That would make all the difference.  If they know you are athiest,  is that why the discussion is off limits.  If so, by no means should you break your agreement.  If not then why is there an agreement?  Is everyone real touchy about the subject?  Considering there is an agreement, you would all need to get loosened up on the subject. Not sure what you think they would gain by becoming athiest and I would deeply consider that before making such a move if you care about them.  Some people just don't need to recognize the truth.

[hrdlr110]

A few of my dear friends are believers.

We have (had) a mutual understanding that discussion about religion/deities is off-limits. For obvious reasons.

I have respected that as well as they have.

Its just gotten to the point that I care about these people very much, and believe that their (perceived) belief in gods is actually holding them back; socially and intellectually.   Its somewhat presumptuous to think this; granted,   but in my heart, I still feel compelled to help them.

But would it be the right thing to do, or would this cause a rift in our relationship?

And here's the irony, they are thinking the exact same thing about you! And they have the numbers for an intervention - you don't! Maybe you could arrange a conference intervention with some folks here.....?

[SkyChief]

It would cause a rift, big time...    I suggest you continue to honor your 'pact'.

Thanx Mike.  This makes sense.   Sometimes we cant see the forest for all the trees (in this case).

I will continue to honour the 'pact'.  At least they (my believer friends) have had the decency to do it.

And, I have the consolation of knowing my friends have made the same sacrifice to preserve our friendship  (they're probably thinking that poor misguided skychief; if only we could help him see the light...).

again, i suck it up!      

Thanx again for your insights...

[SkyChief]

Not knowing your circumstances do they even know you are athiest?  That would make all the difference.

Yes! for almost 16 years, now.

This is what makes it so difficult. We've known these people for so long, it seems a shame that we (Ms SkyChief & me) have allowed the charade to go on this far.

But it has. 

I would trust my entire estate to these people. 

But they believe in spiritual entities which dont really exist and this troubles me.

[Givemeareason]

Yes! for almost 16 years, now.

This is what makes it so difficult. We've known these people for so long, it seems a shame that we (Ms SkyChief & me) have allowed the charade to go on this far.

But it has. 

I would trust my entire estate to these people. 

But they believe in spiritual entities which dont really exist and this troubles me.

Then suck it up as you say and by all means keep your friendship.   Different viewpoints should never be allowed to destroy friendships.  You just need some athiest friends as you have now found here.  But don't get too cerebral about it.  You need some athiest friends out there as well.

[TomFoolery]

Its somewhat presumptuous to think this; granted,   but in my heart, I still feel compelled to help them.

Some of them probably feel the same way about you and your lack of religion. Religion is one of those things people have to approach you about, because going in with the mentality that someone's life is lacking because of it but you have the answer is something I've generally disliked.

[SGOS]

Wait until the person asks you about your views.  Chances are this person is questioning his indoctrination and looking for a different perspective.  Otherwise, you are just proselytizing.  But if someone is actually asking for help in understanding skepticism for his own use, you have a rare chance (but only a chance) of establishing a meaningful discussion.  For me, even as a Christian, the topic does God exist was always fair game as long as it followed channels of reasoning.  Sometimes I encountered one of my own that said, "Of course God exists, because he exists.  How could he not exist?"  Even as a Christian, I knew this was nonsense, but I now realize, I was kind of an unusual Christian.  A good objective would be to help those who seek, rather than try to convert them.  You won't have many such encounters that way, but the few you might be lucky enough to have will be meaningful.

[AllPurposeAtheist]

I'm in a similar situation with my "significant other".. The good thing is almost all of her kids and grandkids are atheists.  We've decided to leave our views off the table because I do love her with all my heart and don't want to lose her over the magic man in the sky and she doesn't want to lose me over the same man in the sky..
We've discussed it at length and it always comes back to being in love and not wanting to rip each others hearts out..

[Mike Cl]

I'm in a similar situation with my "significant other".. The good thing is almost all of her kids and grandkids are atheists.  We've decided to leave our views off the table because I do love her with all my heart and don't want to lose her over the magic man in the sky and she doesn't want to lose me over the same man in the sky..

Very smart on both your parts!  When push comes to shove, it is not so much what you believe but what you do.

[Solitary]

 

Then suck it up as you say and by all means keep your friendship.   Different viewpoints should never be allowed to destroy friendships.  You just need some athiest friends as you have now found here.  But don't get too cerebral about it.  You need some athiest friends out there as well.

 

Then suck it up as you say and by all means keep your friendship.   Different viewpoints should never be allowed to destroy friendships.  You just need some athiest friends as you have now found here.  But don't get too cerebral about it.  You need some athiest friends out there as well.

Surprise! Another great post by the old coot that is getting mellow with age like a good wine.  Solitary

[Givemeareason]

Surprise! Another great post by the old coot that is getting mellow with age like a good wine.  Solitary

I am glad we are coming to terms now.  I will take that as a complement.  Let us cease this senseless bickering.

[Givemeareason]

Surprise! Another great post by the old coot that is getting mellow with age like a good wine.  Solitary

Please take my response sincerely.  While you may have hurt me you have not harmed me.  And I hope you can say the same.  You may call me the old coot anytime you like.

[Solitary]

 SmOn A coot is a harmless simple person and you are old, why wouldn't I call you that? SmOff To hurt is to harm by definition you old coot. Solitary