The bible(ew) teaches predestination and free will

[Passion of Christ]

You're good at this whole "spewing nonsense" thing.

If it's nonsense how would you view time then? Feel free to help me understand how this this would work if what I believe is nonsense don't just state your opinion.

[Shiranu]

One more reason it's a good thing this god doesn't exist, then... this guy is a walking paradox machine. Basically everything about his existence would mean that reality is completely fubar.

Also; if a computer is programmed to bleep it's light twice at 12:05, is it free-will that it is bleeping it's light twice at 12:05?

If a human is programmed through genetics to walk across the road, and an all knowing being knows that this will be the outcome (and has since the beginning of time), does this really qualify as being free-will? How is it different from the computer if you want to say it has no free-will?

Finally, if god is all knowing... why the Adam and Eve story (if you believe in it)? He knew we were going to fail... but instead of not creating us (sparing billions upon billions of humans from suffering) he makes us anyways. That is not a god worth worship.

[Passion of Christ]

One more reason it's a good thing this god doesn't exist, then... this guy is a walking paradox machine. Basically everything about his existence would mean that reality is completely fubar.

No it's the opposite, you need God for time to make any coherent sense at all. You have one God and one you, you are one person with one consciousness and you are in relationship to God who created time. So while there are many things you have the option to do God knows what you're going to do and what you have a single time track with one you making all the choices you make. Most scientists atm seem to believe that we split apart into different multiple universes one for each possible choice we make. But there is only one of us we can't be divided into clones. Even if we could be divided into clones only one of those people would be us the other would all be copies.

[Plu]

If it's nonsense how would you view time then?

Time is a complicated thing and I'm not really interested in discussing it with you.

[Passion of Christ]

Time is a complicated thing and I'm not really interested in discussing it with you.

More like you don't know what to say because the atheistic/materialist perspective of the universe/existence is nonsense. You can affirm this by not backing up your opinion on what time is.

[Plu]

Feel free to make assumptions about what I do or do not know, you seem to be good at it. :)

[Passion of Christ]

Feel free to make assumptions about what I do or do not know, you seem to be good at it. :)

Feel free to say what you believe if you're so sure of yourself. You won't because you don't have a clue. You don't have a clue because atheism is nonsense it's good of you confirm this for everyone to see.

[Plu]

[Passion of Christ]

I've given a good account of how pre-destination and freewill can work. You think of it as God seeing the book of our life but we are now in the process of writing that book and we have the freedom of choice as to what we write in that book. If you have nothing to counter that with beyond ad hominem, snide comments or cartoon pictures then it's perfectly clear to everyone that you have nothing at all worth saying in response. You're perfectly entitled to say it's "spewing nonsense" but if you're not going to explain why you believe that or suggest the way it ought to work then your opinion is worth the text on the screen.

[Plu]

I've given a good account of how pre-destination and freewill can work.

Keep thinking that  :rollin:

[Passion of Christ]

Keep thinking that  :rollin:

I don't have to think anything you just have to demonstrate with your statements of your own opinion that have no backing in any reason.

[PickelledEggs]

this thread is hilarious. Hey poc, tell us more of how free will doesn't interfere with the divine plan :rollin:

Sent from my I-605 JediX20 via Tapatalk

[Passion of Christ]

this thread is hilarious.

It certainly is but the humour is coming from the atheists responses and lack of any coherent arguments or reasoning.  

Hey poc, tell us more of how free will doesn't interfere with the divine plan :rollin:

The divine plan is a loving eternal relationship with beings he made with freewill but we can use that freewill to sin and reject God. Feel free to explain the flaw in this plan if we have the freedom of choice to decide what we ourselves want to do. God exists beyond time as he created time, he only exists in an eternity of "now" he isn't a being who is placed within a specific time period he covers all time periods and exists beyond time. He existed when the universe didn't exist and exists when the universe will no longer exist. His perspective of time is different from our own perspective but this does not negate our freedom within our own perspective within our own perceived flow of time. The past is behind us the future isn't yet written (it will be written but we're the one to write it not God) and it will only ever be the present for us regardless of what time it is. In 2012 we were living in the present, in 2014 we're living in the present and in 2016 we will still be living the present as only the present exists for us even if the present moves a certain direction along a timeline from the past into the future.

So I given my reasoning for pre-destination and freewill in the context of time in relationship to an eternal God who exists beyond time who created time. If there are any theological flaws in my reasoning feel free to point them out.

[Passion of Christ]

this thread is hilarious.

It certainly is but the humour is coming from the atheists responses and lack of any coherent arguments or reasoning.  

Hey poc, tell us more of how free will doesn't interfere with the divine plan :rollin:

The divine plan is a loving eternal relationship with beings he made with freewill but we can use that freewill to sin and reject God. Feel free to explain the flaw in this plan if we have the freedom of choice to decide what we ourselves want to do. God exists beyond time as he created time, he only exists in an eternity of "now" he isn't a being who is placed within a specific time period he covers all time periods and exists beyond time. He existed when the universe didn't exist and exists when the universe will no longer exist. His perspective of time is different from our own perspective but this does not negate our freedom within our own perceived flow of time. The past is behind us the future isn't yet written (it will be written but we're the one to write it not God) and it will only ever be the present for us regardless of what time it is. In 2012 we were living in the present, in 2014 we're living in the present and in 2016 we will still be living the present as only the present exists for us even if the present moves a certain direction along a timeline from the past into the future.

So I given my reasoning for pre-destination and freewill in the context of time in relationship to an eternal God who exists beyond time who created time. If there are any theological flaws in my reasoning feel free to point them out.

[PickelledEggs]

Ok. so let me make sure I understand YOUR definition of pre destination before I say anything.

You define pre destination, not as something as written in stone, but just something that your god wants to happen for us? Basically "his best case scenario" not his "this is what will happen"?