LGBT People: The Pope is Not Our Ally

[The Skeletal Atheist]

Last year when Ol' Frankie Boy made his now famous "who am I to judge" comment regarding gay priests I noticed my Facebook feed blowing up with gleeful updates from the various LGBT groups I "liked". It seemed that the LGBT community had found a new hobby: fellating the pope. The fucking Advocate named him person of the year, despite there being people much more qualified for that distinction.

In the act of going gaga over the pope many in the LGBT community have forgotten two important things:

1: Nothing the pope has said has contradicted homophobic church doctrine.

When the pope made his "who am I to judge" comment his words did not challenge church doctrine one fucking bit; all he did was wrap up church doctrine in a flowery cloth. The fact is any man can be a priest as long as he's Catholic and celibate (there seems to be some leeway on that one as long as they only fuck children). The celibate part is important here. A homosexual orientation is not a sin according to official dogma, but homosexual behavior is. If you are a gay Catholic you are expected to remain celibate for life even if you are not a priest. If you are a gay priest you are expected to tout the church doctrine that homosexuality is "intrinsically disordered".

Mr. Better Than The Last Guy also said something to the effect that homosexuals should be treated with respect. This statement, once again, does not contradict church doctrine one fucking bit. According to church doctrine all "sinners" should be treated with "respect"; how the fuck else are they suppose to get converts? They draw you in by being nice, then they tell you that your sexual orientation is disordered and you can never be in a loving relationship if you want to go to heaven.

2. When he was a cardinal the pope was an openly homophobic bastard.

When the issue of gay marriage came up in Argentina in 2010 the pope, then a cardinal, campaigned against it. I realize this is in line with what the church doctrine is, but he also felt appropriate to throw Satan into the mix. When speaking on the subject of gay marriage as a cardinal he described it as a "'move' of the Father of Lies who seeks to confuse and deceive the children of God". He could have simply said it was against God and still kept to church dogma, but he went the extra mile and attached a nefarious plot by the devil to it. That bit of embellishment doesn't strike me as the words of someone who thinks gays should have equal rights. He also characterised adoption by a gay couple as "discrimination against children", whatever the hell that means.

 I do not expect him to change church doctrine a bit in regards to homosexuality, and that is fine with me. What is not fine with me is ignorant gays acting like he's our best ally since Harvey Milk. Spraying some air freshener on moldy old dogma and backing off a bit doesn't make you an ally.

Gays need to get this in their heads: unless some fundamental change happens in Catholic doctrine the best any pope can do is back off a bit. While that is a good thing, it does not make the pope some kind of champion for gay rights. I won't consider the church or the pope an ally until I see gay marriages happening right in the middle of the Vatican.

Edit: inspiration for this post came from Hydra009's post here: viewtopic.php?f=18&t=3496

[AllPurposeAtheist]

:-k well... To the best of my knowledge he hasn't advocated burning you at the stake yet. That's something.  :)

[The Skeletal Atheist]

:-k well... To the best of my knowledge he hasn't advocated burning you at the stake yet. That's something.  :)

We don't burn as well as witches.

[GSOgymrat]

As an atheist, why should I care what the Pope says about anything?

[The Skeletal Atheist]

As an atheist, why should I care what the Pope says about anything?

It's good that you don't but a lot of gay folk have latched on to his ambiguous statements in some sort of vain hope that the church is becoming more tolerant. It's not.

[GSOgymrat]

As an atheist, why should I care what the Pope says about anything?

It's good that you don't but a lot of gay folk have latched on to his ambiguous statements in some sort of vain hope that the church is becoming more tolerant. It's not.

A gay person who looks for validation from the Catholic church is going to be disappointed and needs to reassess how he or she measures their self-worth.

[The Skeletal Atheist]

Yep. Now only if those who are doing so would stop fellating the pope long enough to realize that.

[Hijiri Byakuren]

As an atheist, why should I care what the Pope says about anything?

He's ostensibly the leader of the single largest organization in the world.

[AllPurposeAtheist]

Kinda like compassionate conservatism.  :rollin:

[The Skeletal Atheist]

As an atheist, why should I care what the Pope says about anything?

He's ostensibly the leader of the single largest organization in the world.

This.

[Insult to Rocks]

I've never understood why so many homosexuals seek the approval of religious organizations on a personal level. I understand wanting religions to stop trying to kill you, but how can you actively participate in a religion that literally says that you are to be stoned for being what you are. If any group should take a hard line against religion, it's the LGBT community.

[Plu]

I've never understood why so many homosexuals seek the approval of religious organizations on a personal level.

Because they still have far more influence on which kind of laws and policies get made and passed than they should.

(Although that's not really on a personal level, I guess.)

[Shiranu]

I've never understood why so many homosexuals seek the approval of religious organizations on a personal level.

They aren't atheists and they believe that their religion is being applied wrongly when used to persecuting them.

[Atheon]

As an atheist, why should I care what the Pope says about anything?

Because he has tremendous influence over hundreds of millions of people who vote and over tens of thousands who make laws and decide public policy.

[Cocoa Beware]

I for one am rather shocked that a sizable portion of the LGBT thinks so highly of the pope.

In order for any of this to be true, the Vatican who selected this particular fellow would have had to contradict the dogma of  their predecessors and do an utter 180 in the blink of an eye; that is pertaining to their views on homosexuality.

That seems impossibly ridiculous to me.