Numerical coincidences in the Quran

[Poison Tree]

Assassinations Foretold in Moby Dick!  there is no god but Melville and Ishmael is his prophet

[SGOS]

the reason why it is recent topic beacuse poeple could not find those nummerical miracles without computer, with quran search programs it is easy to find them.

telll me that this is coincidence
 

Start at the beginning of the first sentence.
Count 48 letters and then add one.
That brings you to "f" in find.
Count the number of letters from the "f" until you come to an "a".
Count the number of letters from the "a" until you come to an "r".
Count the letters from there until you get to a "t".
Total the number of letters and divide by 6.
Put the 4 letters together and it spells fart.
Spell it backwards.  It doesn't spell anything and there's nothing left of the fart.
But if you spell traf backwards, you get another fart.

Tell me that's a coincidence.

[Solitary]

Solitary  :shock:  #-o  It's truly amazing how the human mind can rationalize and see patterns in the dumbest things. Why is the Kennedy coincidences just ignored which are more like a miracle than any religious coincidences? I guess it takes faith to do that. I bet if you take the time to go through everything Shakespeare wrote you could find more miracles. Tomorrow, and tomorrow, creeps in this petty pace from day to day, to the last syllable of recorded time (proof there will be tape recorders). And all our yesterdays have lighted fools the way to dusty death. (Allah is the light) Out! out! brief candle. Life's but a walking shadow, a poor player that struts and frets his time on stage. (A ghost that leaves his body when death comes.) It is a tale told by an idiot, full of sound an fury signifying nothing. (Allah is a big scary stupid loud mouth that doesn't exist, and nothing to fear.)  :P  :roll:  

[Icarus]

1) The letters DNA are from the english name of our genome system. Why would they appear in the Qu'ran, which is written in arabic and supposed to be 'the perfect language'? Also, the year 1865 is measured in catholic years... again, why would a number of significance in the Qu'ran rely on a dating system created by an opposing church?

Mendel was spoke German so he was studying inheritance in DNS not DNA. It would be a lot more impressive if the Qu'ran had 1953 instead of 1865, the year Watson and Crick published their paper the the structure of DNA. Mendel had no idea he was observing anything to do with deoxyribonucleic acid, just making observations on inherited traits.

[SGOS]

you make fun of yourself...

You make Islam into a joke.

[Sargon The Grape]

I'll just leave this here.

God created a man first, then a woman from the man, and all humans descended from them.. 4:1
The Quran repeats the silly story about Cain and Abel (though they are unnamed in the Quran). 5:27-31
Homosexual acts are condemned as unnatural. (Will ye commit abomination such as no creature ever did before you?) But, in fact, such acts are common in many other species. 7:80-81
Crucifixion is a Roman punishment, unknown in Egypt at the time this story supposedly occurred. 7:124
When Allah revealed himself to Moses, the mountain (Mt. Sinai?) came crashing down. 7:143
Humans created from a single man. 7:189
"They fold up their breasts that they may hide (their thoughts) from Him."
Allah thinks (in his heart) that humans have their brains in their breasts. 11:5
Joseph saw in a dream eleven planets. Does this mean that according to the Quran there are eleven planets in our solar system? 12:4
"The sun ... runneth unto an appointed term."
The sun (according to the Quran) orbits the earth. 13:2
"He ... spread out the earth."
Sounds like a flat earth to me. 13:3
"And the earth have We spread out."
The earth is flat according to the Quran. 15:19
"And thy Lord inspired the bee, saying ... eat of all fruits."
Allah told bees to eat from all fruits, but decided to eat nectar and pollen instead. 16:68-68
The sun rises and sets at particular places on a flat earth. At the westernmost point on earth, the sun sets in a muddy spring. 18:86, 90
Most scholars consider Dhu'l-Qarneyn ("The Two-Horned Lord") to be Alexander the Great, who is here presented as a devout Muslim. 18:83-98
The Pharaoh threatens to crucify Hebrews on palm tress. (But crucifixion was a Roman form of punishment that was unknown at the time.) 20:71
The sun "floats" in an orbit around the earth. 21:33
The heavens and the earth were of one piece, then We parted them."
The sun, stars, and earth were joined together until Allah separated them (about six thousand years ago). 21:30
Fear your Lord. Lo! the earthquake of the Hour (of Doom)."
Earquakes are sent by Allah to terrorize and kill people. 22:1
"O mankind! if ye are in doubt concerning the Resurrection, then lo! We have created you from dust, then from a drop of seed, then from a clot, then from a little lump of flesh shapely and shapeless, that We may make (it) clear for you."
Oh thanks, Allah. That clears everything up! 22:5
Allah created all animals. Some with no legs, some with two, and some with four. (Most animals have six legs. Did Allah forget about the insects?) 24:45
"He sendeth down from the heaven mountains wherein is hail."
Hail comes from mountains. 24:43
The earth is fixed and does not move. 27:61
"He hath subdued the sun and moon to service. Each runneth unto an appointed term."
The sun orbits the earth. 35:13
"The sun runneth on unto a resting-place for him." 36:38
"For the moon We have appointed mansions till she return like an old shrivelled palm-leaf." 36:38
It is not for the sun to overtake the moon, nor doth the night outstrip the day. They float each in an orbit."
The sun and the moon orbit the earth. (Well at least Allah and Mo are half right here!) 36:40
Jonah was swallowed by a fish. 37:142
"We decked the nether heaven with lamps."
Allah put "lamps" in the lower heaven to serve as lights. These are the stars that we see in the sky at night. 41:12
"And the earth have We spread out."
The earth is flat according to the Quran. 50:7
"And the earth have We laid out, how gracious is the Spreader (thereof)!"
The earth is flat according to the Quran. 51:48
All things We have created by pairs." This is not true. Many bacteria, protists, fungi, and plants reproduce asexually. 51:49
"The moon was rent in twain."
Muhammaed split the moon into two pieces. Beat that one, Jesus! 54:1-2
"Allah it is who hath created seven heavens, and of the earth the like thereof."
The "seven heavens" refer to the sun, moon, and five planets that were known at the time of Muhammad (Mercury, Venus, Mars, Jupiter, and Saturn). The earth was flat and the "seven "heavens" revolved around it. 65:12


"Who hath created seven heavens ... Canst thou see any rifts?"
Allah asks Muhammed to examine the sky to see if it has any cracks. 67:3
Allah made the stars as missiles to throw at devils. 67:5
At the end of the world the earth with the mountains will be lifted up and crushed with one crash. 69:14
"And hath made the moon a light"
This verse implies that the moon produces its own light, rather than reflecting light from the sun. 71:16
"Have We not made the earth an expanse, And the high hills bulwarks?"
The earth is flat according to the Quran. 78:6-7
"He spread the earth."
The earth is flat according to the Quran. 79:30
Someday the stars will fall. 81:2
"He is created from a gushing fluid that issued from between the loins and ribs."
Semen, according to the Quran, is formed not in the testicles, but somewhere "between the loins and ribs." 86:5-7
"He is created from a gushing fluid."
Humans are not created from semen, but from fertilized eggs. 86:6
"And the earth, how it is spread ?"
The earth is flat according to the Quran. 88:20
The sun ... and the moon when she followeth him."
The moon orbits the earth; it doesn't "follow the sun." 91:1-2
"The earth and Him Who spread it."
The earth is flat according to the Quran. 91:6
Thy Lord ... createth man from a clot."
Humans were created from a clot? 96:1-2
If he denieth (Allah's guidance) ... We will seize him by the forelock - The lying, sinful forelock."
Some Muslims say that when Allah talks about the "forelock" here, he is acutally referring to the prefrontal cortex, which, as modern science has recently found out, is the place where all that lying and sinful stuff happens. It's just one of the many scientific miracles in the Quran. 96:13-16
"When Earth is shaken with her (final) earthquake"
At the end of the world, Allah will cause a massive earthquake and then send everyone to heaven or hell. 99:1
Allah dealt with the owners of the elephant by sending swarms of "flying creatures". 105:1-3

I apologize for the formatting, my iPad doesn't copy lists very gracefully.

[Jason78]

no you have not, show me please why this is silly?

Did you not see Solitary's post?

you cant ignore that consonant letters of neutron(NTRN) appear on in one place out of 6236 verses in the quran in correct position, wich corespond to its wieght ratio, neutron is 1,839 times heavier than an electron and letters are exactly in 18:39

is this coincidence? i dont think, i if you say that it is coincidience, then it mean that chance of something happen by chance is 1/6236=0,00016%

It's 1838.6836605;  Looks like Allah got it wrong.  Unless you're allowed to kinda fudge the numbers to sort of make them fit.   Is that allowed?

Edit: Edited to show my source.

everybody write it as 1839 beacuse of big decimal 8.68 is 9 , did you not learned this in school?


http://medical-dictionary.thefreedictio ... utron+mass
n electrically neutral subatomic particle in the baryon family, having a mass 1,839 times

http://www.windows2universe.org/physica ... .2009_7_15
he mass of a neutron is about 1,839 times that of an electron!

1838.6836605 ? 18:39

It's a completely different number.

[Icarus]

many site beging with the year 1865 when it comes to begining of science of genetics.

i think that you only make exuses to reject these obvious miracles in front of your eyes

if yo udont want to believe obvious stuff wich are clear, what can i say, then dont believe it. even if DNA was mentioned in verse 1953 instaed of 1865, then you would claim,no why is it not mentioned at year 1865 , verse 18:65. that is the nature of atheists, constant denial even though they see clear evidence.

You do know that Genetics encompasses more than just DNA right? DNA gives us the genotype but most geneticists are interested in how different polymorphisms translate into observable changes in the cell and organism. I don't expect you to understand this, if you actually understood genetics as a field of study you would see that the connection you're trying to make is incredibly weak.

[Plu]

1838.6836605 ? 18:39

It's a completely different number.

why do they write it as 1,839 then???

Because it's accurate enough for simple minds and simple calculations. It's not impressive until you get to a few thousand digits, or you know, until you list the actual calculation which had been known hundreds of years before the Quran was written in case of the golden ratio.

The odds of being able to count some things and come to a simple number are pretty fucking high when you use a book, which contains loads of text and an almost infinite number of possible connections.

Like I said; take a course on statistics and psychology. You can thank me later.

[Poison Tree]

Assassinations Foretold in Moby Dick!  there is no god but Melville and Ishmael is his prophet

there is no programming in moby dick i have discussed with many atheists about moby dick so far nobody has ever proved me programming in that book.

if you want to debunk my examples, then you need to study them and destroy them it from the scinetific point of view, not bring me moby dick wich is actually no challange towards quran.

beacuse if you post stuff wich you have not analysed maybe you will be embarassed later just beacuse there is no programming. before you post to me anything reaserch first analysed and them post it to me.

there is no programming in quran i have discussed with many muslims about quran so far nobody has ever proved me programming in that book.

if you want to debunk my examples, then you need to study them and destroy them it from the scinetific point of view, not bring me quran wich is actually no challange towards moby dick.

Boy, that was easy.

[Poison Tree]

3.Adam-Jesus 25 times (beacuse God said in the verse that these two are equal in the sight of God)

I came up with "Jesus" 28 times

4. Name of satan-seek refuge (from satan) 11 times

"Satan" 55 times, not counting "Satan's" or "Satanic". Maybe you wanted "Shaitan" (77 times) or "Iblis " (31 times)
 "seek refuge" 12 times

7. heat-coolness 4 times

"heat" 5 times (not counting heated 1 additional time), "coolness" only once

12. month mentioned 12 times, same as it is in one years

"month" 4 times, "months" 16 times, "monthly" 4 times


Oh, don't tell me, I must be using the wrong translation. Or need to use examples of the word in brackets sometimes, or not others, or ignore these books, or stand on my head. Maybe I need a special decoder ring found in boxes of participating general mills cereal?

[sasuke]

I once took a math course where the teacher jokingly proved that every natural number is interesting.  He went something like this:
Let S be the set of natural numbers that are not interesting.  If the set is empty, then every natural number is interesting.  If the set is not empty, then we can apply the axiom of choice onto S: specifically that there is a least element in S; call it n.  n itself is pretty interesting as it's the smallest natural number in S.  n is therefore not an element of S.  QED.  Obviously it's not a proof since the word interesting isn't defined explicitly.

Given a book with thousands of words, thousands of interesting numbers and acronyms, and thousands of ways to formulate numbers using permutations and other mathematical tools, and given that our brains are pattern recognition "engines", then yes, every retarded numerology "proof" of anything, Quran related or not, is nothing but evidence that the people who repeat such proofs are either simple minded or tricksters who dress up their snake oil with "math".

Now I remember a few years ago when a lunatic Muslim came here and told us about how the number 23 appears everywhere in the holey Quran.  The number 23 is special because it's the number of chromosomes in a human cell, or something.  There's a date for every discovery, a list of 3 letter acronyms in every discipline, and thousands of operators like addition, multiplication, exponential, cos, tan, etc. to work out an association between a set of words or phrases and the special numbers or acronyms.  As SalsaShark told our Muslim of the month back then: I always find it amazing how bad at math these numerologists can be (paraphrasing).

[Plu]

what is the chance that you get only 3 DNA in one verse in the quran out of 6236 verse and it is exactly 18:65---year 1865

or that neutron (NTRN) is only in verse 18:39 out of 6236 verses and neutron is 1,839 times heavier than eletron

or that venus is mentioned 3 times, from first to second there is 243 verses and we know today that it takes 243 days for venus to rotate around its own axis, and last time venus was mentioned was in verse 17:7 and we know today that venus has 177 degrees inclination.

These questions are not permissable in a statistics context. Like I said; take a course on statistics. The only relevant statistical question to ask is "how many of these so called miracles exist in the Quran versus how many total contextual combinations can you make" And the answer is "a handful of miracles versus billions of contextual combinations", which means that statistically speaking, it is meaningless.

It's kinda like saying that it's a miracle if you find three specks of gold dust in thousand of cubic meters of dirt. Of course you'll find specks of gold dust in that much dirt. It only seems special because you're ignoring just how much dirt you had to scoop through to find those specks. None of your "scholars" will ever tell you about the billions of word counts that add up to nothing meaningful, or the number of years that don't match anything relevant, or the number of attempts they made before they found something that resembled the golden ratio up to three digits. They've been scooping dirt for centuries to find a handful of "miracles".

But I can guaruantuee you, if you give a mathematician a computer and a sheet with a thousand numbers, he will find a way to add, substract, divide and multiply those numbers to get within 3 digits of any number you want. Now imagine giving thousands of islamic scholars thousands of computers and a book with not thousands, but millions of numbers and the freedom to make up more numbers in whatever way they want, and suddenly finding the golden ratio isn't so exciting anymore.

[Plu]

Like I said; it's not statistically pemissable. The odds of anything are irrelevant outside of their context, and you're doing your very best to keep them outside of their context.

This is why they should teach all kids basic statistics and psychology in school. It guards them somewhat against being fucked over by people with more mathematical knowledge and less morals.

[Plu]

You keep repeating the same thing, even though I have already pointed out why no amount of miracles means anything until you compare them to the number of combinations have to be made to find them. You really need that introduction course in statistics.

Seriously. If your first response to "I just rolled a 6 on 10 dice at the same time! It's a miracle!" isn't "How often did you roll?", you really aren't allowed to talk about statistics.