The Church of Lies by Flora Jessop

[SGOS]

She escaped from the abusive polygamous Mormon Fundamentalist Cult in the isolated Arizona/Utah desert back in the 1970s.  She's an easy read, not the greatest writer, but she makes up for it by having a story to tell.  Everyone knew that the members were being abused back in the 1950s, and government officials tried to break it up.  They were unsuccessful because the public apparently was not horrified by polygamy enough to support government intervention.  Now the government tends to ignore the colony.

However, the real issue here is abuse, not polygamy.  That's unfortunate, because people seem to focus on the polygamy and have philosophical debates about the morality of multiple wives.   When I visited my family in Utah a few years ago, the general feeling I picked up was that the government should just leave them alone because "there really wasn't that much that was wrong with polygamy."  That fact that young girls are forced into arranged marriages or that women and members are abused, does not seem to play into public perception.  

So the cult goes on hurting people in the name of freedom of religion.

[stromboli]

Every time I see shows like "Sister Wives" or any other that in any way puts a positive spin on this shit, it angers me. I grew up with polygamy all around me and sympathy towards it in my family and neighbors. The argument will continue about whether it is viable or not, but the patriarchal Mormon version is nothing but abusive and criminal.

[Krisyork2008]

I personally see nothing wrong with polygamy. I'm not going to sit here and argue the point that we as a species blah blah blah. We've changed a lot since our early days of survival, and it seems that some people need multiple lovers, throughout their life, and others want only one. As long as everyone is happy and noone is getting hurt, then polygamy is great.

Just recently in a neighboring town of mine, there was a legal three person adoption. A lesbian couple used their best guy friend to artificially inseminate one of them, and they went to court and all became equal parents. This is in Massachusetts, the couple is married but the guy is not part of their relationship.

Sorry kind of off topic.

[SGOS]

I personally see nothing wrong with polygamy.

I don't either, but that is not at issue, or at least it shouldn't be.  Even Flora Jessop seems to confuse polygamy with abuse.  There is even a picture of her in the book next to a banner that says "Polygamy is Abuse."  Of course, from her perspective, the most visible aspects that distinguished her childhood from regular society were polygamy, abuse, and child incest.  These qualities defined her life, so she's probably going to lump them together.

Unfortunately the most visible aspect of this cult  to the public at large is polygamy, which is unusual enough to spark public debate, while the issues of child molestation, women as property or slaves, and brainwashing, along with other criminal activities, gets swept under the carpet as people are sidetracked on the stupid polygamy debate.

As I said, most of the people I met in Utah (granted about one zillionth of the population) seemed to think they should be left alone because they didn't see anything wrong with polygamy.  The fact that these people were criminals in many other respects is lost in the debate.

[SGOS]

Sorry kind of off topic.

Well it is, and it isn't.  The reason I was even interested enough to start the thread was because of my reaction to the book and my limited perspective on public thought (at least in Utah).  Specifically, that the focus has been redirected from more serious issues.  Around the rest of the country, there probably isn't enough interest to even get to the point of "public thought".  It's just seen as another harmless, but somewhat "whacky" cult...  "Oh, it just those polygamy people," but there's much more going on below the surface.

[aitm]

I don't think Polygamy is the problem at all. The problem it seems, is, is the woman given the opportunity to make an informed, intelligent, willfull and free choice?

[PickelledEggs]

Yeah I think the issue with polygamy is, like aitm said, is about if the women are getting forced in to them. After you think about it though, if they aren't being forced in to a polygamous marriage/relationship, I don't really know what harm can really be done. Still very foreign to me, but as long as no one is taking advantage of the situation there shouldn't be a problem.

To be fair, there should be a show called Brother Husbands. That would be hilarious to just see the conservatives' reviews on it.

[SGOS]

I don't think Polygamy is the problem at all. The problem it seems, is, is the woman given the opportunity to make an informed, intelligent, willfull and free choice?

Bingo.  Free choice, does not exist in the cult.  With the help of the media they have launched a great PR campaign, however.  I've seen a special on TV years ago, where the wives are interviewed and talk about the love they feel for the other wives, and how much they like being part of the culture of polygamy, but they never mention that they don't mind their husbands fucking their daughters, or that they had no say in choosing their husbands, or that their 12 year old daughters are given to old men, who need to spice up their sex lives.

Either the media is misrepresenting the truth, or Flora Jessop is.  But I tend to think Flora is being honest about it and things are really not all that wonderful in Utopia.  There have also been coverage of "allegations" of abuse, but the thing seems to have a magnetic attraction for opening a debate on polygamy.

[stromboli]

I personally see nothing wrong with polygamy. I'm not going to sit here and argue the point that we as a species blah blah blah. We've changed a lot since our early days of survival, and it seems that some people need multiple lovers, throughout their life, and others want only one. As long as everyone is happy and noone is getting hurt, then polygamy is great.

Just recently in a neighboring town of mine, there was a legal three person adoption. A lesbian couple used their best guy friend to artificially inseminate one of them, and they went to court and all became equal parents. This is in Massachusetts, the couple is married but the guy is not part of their relationship.

Sorry kind of off topic.

I see nothing wrong with polygamy either. That is not what we are talking about. We are talking about Mormon polygamy that is religion based, patriarchal, tightly controlled families wherein young women are treated as breeding machines and are passed around like candy. Yes, that is true. I grew up in the middle of it.

 Polygamy that is based on a rational, free choice ability to decide for yourself situation- fine. But polygamy based on a rigid code of imposed behavior and moral standards, where women are treated as "sacred vessels" that are guarded over until puberty and then bartered over, and given away without their consent as wives.