Privet!

[Eve]

??????! ????????

moi dela xorosho. spasibo droog :)

[Eve]

:-|

[Plu]

My assumption that it takes some intelligence to organize something out of chaos(something that is not organized) is based on facts.

No it isn't. It's based on not knowing very much about the real world.

[Eve]

:-|

[Eve]

:-|

[Plu]

You seem to be confusing 'desire to organise' and 'having a purpose' with 'things happening'. You don't need a desire to organise, to organise.

Also you seem to have a very strange idea of 'un-organized matter' which you will need to define better for us to properly crush your argument.

[Eugeny Anatolievich]

Organization of something always has a purpose.

No. Not always. Some natural things look like artificial ones. They look like things made for specific purposes. You can ask: "What for do we have legs?" What is an answer? "To walk".
But it is a wrong question, which has no right answer.
The right question is: "Why do we walk and don't fly?" Answer: "Because we have legs and hasn't wings".

Do you know this man?

This is Immanuel Kant.
He asks you: "Why do you ask wrong and senseless questions? Read 'Critique of Judgement'!"

[Jason78]

Well that escalated quickly.

FACT: physical matter/chaos has no intelligence. Which means has no purposes/no goals, and no desires. Physical matter doesn't need to organize itself.

I'll see your chaos and raise you a Boltzmann brain

[Eve]

:-|

[Eve]

:-|

[Plu]

You seem to be confusing 'desire to organise' and 'having a purpose' with 'things happening'. You don't need a desire to organise, to organise.

Yes, I can do it against my will/desire. Chaos/physical matter has no desire. And it has no will.

Again; you do not need will or desire to organise.

Also you seem to have a very strange idea of 'un-organised matter'.

How do You know that I have a strange idea about un-organised matter? Did I explain it?

Not properly, no. I'm just deducting that you have strange ideas from what little you've shared. I'll gladly update my position when I get more information; that's how it works.

'un-organised matter' which you will need to define better for us to properly crush your argument

It is something that is not organized. :-D It is chaos.

This is a cyclical argument, which brings us nowhere. You need to define the word in basic terms both sides understand.

[Eve]

:-|

[Eve]

:-|

[Plu]

Didn't I already agree? But at least I need some intelligence. Physical matter has no intelligence.

You do not need intelligence to organise either. Organising can be done by natural processes.

I know about chaos(un-organized matter) probably as mush as You do. I believe that it was time when our Universe didn't not exist/was not organised. It became to exist/was organised long time ago. It didn't appear/organised out of nothing. That "thing" from which it is organized is "un-organized matter". I hope it helped.

Right, so strange ideas, like I said. You have no idea what you're talking about. You are making problems that aren't known to exist and then present ideas to solve those problems that aren't known to exist with solutions that cannot be verified to work... because the problem they intend to solve isn't real. It's all a big excercise in futility.

[Jason78]

You do not need intelligence to organise either. Organising can be done by natural processes.

Kinda like how you get natural diamonds and synthetic diamonds?  

I can use my intelligence to create an diamond.   Or I can go out and find one in nature.

Both are neatly ordered arrangements of carbon, yet one was created by an intelligent agent, and the other was not.