Juror: Zimmerman Got Away With Murder

[Jmpty]

http://usnews.nbcnews.com/_news/2013/07 ... -acquitted

A member of the jury that acquitted George Zimmerman said Thursday she thinks Zimmerman "got away with murder" but that jurors had no choice in finding him not guilty under the law.

In an interview Thursday with ABC News, the woman identified as Juror B29 during the trial discussed the deliberations that led to the acquittal of Zimmerman on second-degree murder and manslaughter charges on July 13 in the shooting death last year of Florida teenager Trayvon Martin. Zimmerman said he shot Martin in self defense.

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The juror, whom the network identified as Puerto Rican, was the only minority member on the six-woman jury.






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The jurors' names remain sealed, but the woman allowed ABC to show her face and identify her by the name Maddy. She is a nursing assistant and the mother of eight children.

The woman said the evidence didn't prove murder, "Even though in our hearts we felt he was guilty."

"We had to grab our hearts and put it aside and look at the evidence," she said.

Juror B29 said she initially held out for convicting Zimmerman of second-degree murder, but after nine hours of deliberations, she came to the conclusion that wasn't enough proof under Florida law.

"I was the juror that was going to give them the hung jury. I fought to the end," she said.


 

"George Zimmerman got away with murder, but you can't get away from God. And at the end of the day, he's going to have a lot of questions and answers he has to deal with," she said. But "the law couldn't prove it."

The woman told ABC News that she still isn't sure she made the right call, saying, "I felt like I let a lot of people down" — especially Martin's parents.

"It's hard for me to sleep, it's hard for me to eat because I feel I was forcefully included in Trayvon Martin's death," she said. "And as I carry him on my back, I'm hurting as much (as) Trayvon's Martin's mother, because there's no way that any mother should feel that pain."

A spokesperson for Martin's parents, Tracy Martin and Sybrina Fulton, said the couple had no immediate comment on the interview.

Only one other juror has spoken out publicly about the verdict. Juror B37 said in an interview earlier this month on CNN that only three jurors thought Zimmerman should be acquitted when deliberations began and that all of them cried when they were over.

She said Martin "played a huge role" in his own death and said "he could have walked away and gone home."

Four of the other jurors — all but the woman who spoke to ABC News on Thursday — later issued a statement saying Juror B37's remarks didn't represent their views.

George Zimmerman has sued NBC Universal for defamation. The company strongly denies the allegation.

[AllPurposeAtheist]

Double jepardy doesnt pertain..

[Hijiri Byakuren]

Just when I thought this shitstorm would fucking end already.

[Shiranu]

The more I see from the jury, the more obvious it becomes to me just how broken the jury system is.

I think the (court, I guess would be who's job it would be?) needs to learn how to properly instruct the jury on what they need to do. And what is the point when one side admits they voted based on evidence "not presented" and the other side says, "I think he's guilty of murder, but instead I voted innocent."

And then the one in this thread went on to say, "I don't think it ever should have gone to trial."

...so... you think he's guilty, you thought you should have tried to prolong the case... but at the same time, you think it shouldn't have gone to court?

Your average Joe (or Janes in this case) are just... stupid. I personally don't want to be tried by my peers because my peers are a bunch of fucking morons who are just all over the damn place.

[aitm]

I personally don't want to be tried by my peers because my peers are a bunch of fucking morons who are just all over the damn place.

Boy Howdy. Never over-estimate the intelligence of the average human. I use to blame lawyers for all the crap stupid lawsuits that have led us to the need for "caution knife is sharp" on a knife type of laws, but the truth it seems is the lawyers just present the case, stupid people think, "makes sense to me". Oy.

I was dismissed from the jury pool that was to decide the award to a paralyzed kid,(the dock company had already been found to be guilty) and I did fell sorry for him, but he took a 5 dollar bet to do a belly flop off a dock in about 12 inches of water and broke his fuckin neck. So naturally he sued the dock company he worked for (because they were installing it at the time and the foreman did the dare). When asked if I would have any issues with handing out a large amount of money, I said, "yeah, especially when it was his own fault" The jury awarded him 60 million.....course the company was defunct already so he will never get a dime probably. Still...people are stupid..

[Plu]

I'm really glad in a way that if I ever go to a courthouse, I'll be judged by someone who is trained to dispense justice, and not a bunch of morons that were too dumb to get out of jury duty, or that get a perverted kick out of being able to judge another human being.

[Nonsensei]

Wow how is she stupid? Please explain that to me. She was pretty fucking clear. She felt that Zimmerman was guilty of at least something, but she realized under Florida law that the prosecution hadn't proved their case so she voted for an acquittal.

This is exactly what we want jurors to do. What we don't want them to do is disregard the law and vote based on their feelings.

[Plu]

I personally wasn't being specific about this person. Just people in general I do not have a very good opinion of. If I'm going to be judged, I'd rather it be someone with years of training instead of some random person.

[Shiranu]

Wow how is she stupid? Please explain that to me. She was pretty fucking clear. She felt that Zimmerman was guilty of at least something, but she realized under Florida law that the prosecution hadn't proved their case so she voted for an acquittal.

This is exactly what we want jurors to do. What we don't want them to do is disregard the law and vote based on their feelings.

Well, she sounds like she has buyer's remorse; "I thought he was guilty, I still feel he was guilty, I shoulda voted guilty... but I didn't, and now I feel like an idiot."

And again, she was going murder or not guilty... apparently forgetting the lesser charge of Manslaughter that 1/3rd of the jury went with. Shit, half the jury found him guilty and apparently she thought he was guilty as well. That leaves only 1 person who thought he was legitimately innocent (based on "non-presented evidence" and her talking with husband, a violation of jury regulations) and then 1 person who we don't know why she voted the way she did.

[Mister Agenda]

She's not saying she wishes she had voted guilty. She wishes she could have, but he was not guilty of the crime which he was accused of under FL law.

The law is arguably messed up, it sounds like if you shoot someone dead and there are no witnesses you're in the clear if you claim you were in fear for your life. It sounds like an incentive to violence if whoever is left standing is in the clear. Which means if the kid shot Zimmerman dead, his trial should have the same outcome.

I have my doubts that it would have played the same way, though.

[Shiranu]

She's not saying she wishes she had voted guilty.

The woman told ABC News that she still isn't sure she made the right call...

[Colanth]

http://usnews.nbcnews.com/_news/2013/07/25/19681971-juror-zimmerman-got-away-with-murder-but-had-to-be-acquitted

Only one other juror has spoken out publicly about the verdict. Juror B37 said in an interview earlier this month on CNN that only three jurors thought Zimmerman should be acquitted when deliberations began and that all of them cried when they were over.

She said Martin "played a huge role" in his own death and said "he could have walked away and gone home."

The Florida stand your ground law says that he has the right to NOT have to walk away, so according to Florida law he didn't play any part in his own death.  (Which is only one of the reasons the law shouldn't exist.).

[Nonsensei]

http://usnews.nbcnews.com/_news/2013/07/25/19681971-juror-zimmerman-got-away-with-murder-but-had-to-be-acquitted

Only one other juror has spoken out publicly about the verdict. Juror B37 said in an interview earlier this month on CNN that only three jurors thought Zimmerman should be acquitted when deliberations began and that all of them cried when they were over.

She said Martin "played a huge role" in his own death and said "he could have walked away and gone home."

The Florida stand your ground law says that he has the right to NOT have to walk away, so according to Florida law he didn't play any part in his own death.  (Which is only one of the reasons the law shouldn't exist.).

The stand your ground law allows for the use of violence to defend oneself in a dangerous situation. Martin was not in a dangerous situation. He made the situation dangerous. He may not have had an obligation to retreat, but he also wasn't in a situation that could be considered dangerous enough to justify violence. A dangerous situation requires an overt threat, not a threat you think might possibly exist.

Further, most states with a form of stand your ground law have wording that says you have to have a "sincere fear of imminent peril of death or great bodily harm". In florida however the wording is "reasonable" rather than "sincere". This means that the focus in a trail would switch from proving whether or not martin genuinely felt threatened (sincere) to whether or not it was reasonable for him to feel threatened under the circumstances. It essentially raises the bar so that people cant just invoke the law and justify it by saying they felt uneasy.

You might think its reasonable to assume danger if a man is following you down the street, but in a court of law it is likely the criteria would be something more concrete like illegal activities, not just vaguely threatening actions.

Stand your ground would not have protected Martin at all. He would have been found guilty of attacking and murdering Zimmerman had he won the altercation, and no claims of feeling threatened would have kept him out of jail. All because he attacked first and did it against someone who had yet to actually do anything illegal.

Side note: I find it highly suspect that as soon as the jury comes out of sequestration their opinion changes from 6/6 not guilty to 1/6 not guilty.

[Shiranu]

From day 1 the results were...

3 innocent
2 manslaughter
1 second degree murder

That's not 6/6.

And of the ones that have come out, 1 said she was completely right in voting innocent (thanks to "un-presented evidence") and the other thinks she got it wrong. Thats 2/6, not 1/6. Still a terrible ratio, though to declare someone innocent or guilty.

[The Skeletal Atheist]

From day 1 the results were...

3 innocent
2 manslaughter
1 second degree murder

That's not 6/6.

And of the ones that have come out, 1 said she was completely right in voting innocent (thanks to "un-presented evidence") and the other thinks she got it wrong. Thats 2/6, not 1/6. Still a terrible ratio, though to declare someone innocent or guilty.

I'm glad that criminal cases aren't decided by ratios or majority vote like American Idol.