A new perspective on this thing that we know as God.

Started by od19g6, December 31, 2019, 05:13:18 PM

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Baruch

Quote from: Blackleaf on January 01, 2020, 10:18:07 PM
This thread really should be in the general religious discussion section. But oh well. Right away, you've already made a claim you can't support. Just because something isn't physical doesn't mean you can't study it. There are lots of things we can't perceive through our senses that we can study, via the affects they have on the world. God being non-physical doesn't excuse the fact that there is no way to objectively verify that he even exists.

Correct.  Theism is non-objective.  If we admit the physical includes EM field etc.  Objective means, you can have two or more disinterested researchers, examine something quantitatively (the weight of my cat) and they come up with more or less the same answer.  By labeling (right or wrong) something as non-physical, it is more or less subjective, not objective ... a mere idea.  In fundamentalist epistemology only the objective can be known.  Therefore theism is about things that can't be known.  And that leads to ignoring most of psychology and philosophy.  Mathematicians argue if math is real or not, and we leave them to it.
Ha’át’íísh baa naniná?
Azee’ Å,a’ish nanídį́į́h?
Táadoo ánít’iní.
What are you doing?
Are you taking any medications?
Don't do that.

Unbeliever

Quote from: od19g6 on December 31, 2019, 07:04:29 PM
So I  guess I'll start.

So what if I told you that we will never know God completely.

We can only know God through His names and attributes.

What is this "God" thing you're talking about? Can you define it, so we all know what we're discussing?
God Not Found
"There is a sucker born-again every minute." - C. Spellman

Mr.Obvious

Quote from: od19g6 on January 01, 2020, 08:08:14 PM
Sure, take your time.

Okay, it might work with telepathy.
Or do you believe some humans have telepathy?
"If we have to go down, we go down together!"
- Your mum, last night, requesting 69.

Atheist Mantis does not pray.

od19g6

#33
Quote from: Sal1981 on January 01, 2020, 06:30:32 PM
Chimpanzees have shown to be able to learn tool use.
Yes, but chimpanzees can't invent anything near like the human being can. They can only use "tools" from directly around them like sticks etc.

Quote from: Sal1981 on January 01, 2020, 06:30:32 PMProbably not the same level as engineers, but beavers can build dams, that has to count for something. As well as ant colonies, bee hives & wasp hives. Not to mention all the various burrows and nests animals are able to pull off.
Once again that's my point the human being has the capability to create much more complex and grander things than what the mere animal can.

Quote from: Sal1981 on January 01, 2020, 06:30:32 PMTechnology is just tool use.
Yes, and guess what. Only can the human being create that tool.

Quote from: Sal1981 on January 01, 2020, 06:30:32 PMAnts do, some species of ants build massive structures.
Not nearly as grand and technologically advanced as humans can build.

Quote from: Sal1981 on January 01, 2020, 06:30:32 PMYes, ants again.
The human's are much superior.

Quote from: Sal1981 on January 01, 2020, 06:30:32 PMProbably, nothing says they cannot.
Now come on, you know that's not true.

Quote from: Sal1981 on January 01, 2020, 06:30:32 PMProbably not.
Exactly.

Quote from: Sal1981 on January 01, 2020, 06:30:32 PMYou're basically just co-opting something humans do, without divine intervention, and calling it "manifesting" 'god'. We do this regardless.
Human beings can only do these things because we are the highest creatures on earth. We have a reality that no other creature on earth has and that is a divine reality. And that divine / spiritual reality are manifested in the things we do.

Unbeliever

None of that means anything at all. Your God does not exist, you've been lied to by those you trusted to tell you the truth.
God Not Found
"There is a sucker born-again every minute." - C. Spellman

od19g6

Quote from: Blackleaf on January 01, 2020, 10:18:07 PM
This thread really should be in the general religious discussion section. But oh well. Right away, you've already made a claim you can't support. Just because something isn't physical doesn't mean you can't study it. There are lots of things we can't perceive through our senses that we can study, via the affects they have on the world. God being non-physical doesn't excuse the fact that there is no way to objectively verify that he even exists.
It can't be supported physically because God is not even apart of the physical universe, God is beyond the physical universe. We can only verify that God exists through His names and attributes, which is manifested in the physical universe.

od19g6

Quote from: Unbeliever on January 02, 2020, 01:17:49 PM
What is this "God" thing you're talking about? Can you define it, so we all know what we're discussing?
It's the God that we commonly know as created the universe including the human being.

od19g6

Quote from: Mr.Obvious on January 02, 2020, 03:52:09 PM
Okay, it might work with telepathy.
Or do you believe some humans have telepathy?
Just to be clear, what is telepathy?

od19g6

#38
Quote from: Unbeliever on January 02, 2020, 07:08:04 PM
None of that means anything at all. Your God does not exist, you've been lied to by those you trusted to tell you the truth.
ok.

Unbeliever

Quote from: od19g6 on January 02, 2020, 07:12:51 PM
It's the God that we commonly know as created the universe including the human being.
We don't know any such thing. We have no reason at all to believe that any God created the universe.

Besides, telling me what you believe God has done is not defining God, not telling me what it is.
God Not Found
"There is a sucker born-again every minute." - C. Spellman

Hydra009

Quote from: od19g6 on January 02, 2020, 07:10:46 PM
It can't be supported physically because God is not even apart of the physical universe, God is beyond the physical universe.
Well that just sounds like nonexistence with extra steps.

Hydra009

Quote from: od19g6 on January 02, 2020, 07:12:51 PM
It's the God that we commonly know as created the universe including the human being.
Don't be coy.  Which god do you suggest is "commonly known"?  Zeus?  Jupiter?  Odin?  Atum?  Enlil?  Brahma?  Quetzalcoatl?

od19g6

Quote from: Unbeliever on January 02, 2020, 07:27:02 PM
We don't know any such thing. We have no reason at all to believe that any God created the universe.

Besides, telling me what you believe God has done is not defining God, not telling me what it is.
The thing is we really can't know what God fully is. Like I keep saying God is beyond the physical universe. The only that we can know anything about God is through His qualities, names and attributes, and the human being is the best animal to manifest those to the physical world.

od19g6

Quote from: Hydra009 on January 02, 2020, 07:46:10 PM
Well that just sounds like nonexistence with extra steps.
God exists, and the human being is the best proof.

od19g6

#44
Quote from: Hydra009 on January 02, 2020, 07:53:15 PM
Don't be coy.  Which god do you suggest is "commonly known"?  Zeus?  Jupiter?  Odin?  Atum?  Enlil?  Brahma?  Quetzalcoatl?
Well just like I said the one true God that created the universe and all that's in it. He's also the originator of all the religions.