Islamic father slashes his 17 year old sons throat for being gay

Started by Munch, November 07, 2019, 01:34:33 PM

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Munch

The images are pretty graphic

https://ananova.news/muslim-dad-slashes-17yo-sons-throat-for-being-gay/

Summery. A 17 year old man of muslim decent woke up to find his father over him, screaming at him how he was gay, something his son did everything to keep from his family, before he slashed his throat.

This happened in Bern, Switzerland.

The fathers been arrested after his son was in an induced coma for months, but so far nothings been said if he'll stand trial.


Religion of peace everyone. 
'Political correctness is fascism pretending to be manners' - George Carlin

Draconic Aiur


Baruch

You can take the Muslim our of the ME, but not the ME out of the Muslim.  Even without Islamic theology, gayness and premarital sex is forbidden in most traditional societies ;-(  This would have been true, in conservative parts of the US 60 years ago.
Ha’át’íísh baa naniná?
Azee’ Å,a’ish nanídį́į́h?
Táadoo ánít’iní.
What are you doing?
Are you taking any medications?
Don't do that.

Shiranu

QuoteThis would have been true, in conservative parts of the US 60 years ago.

32 states still have no laws against "gay conversion therapy", which is a recognized form of torture. Some of those states still allow, or ignore, physical punishment as a form of gay conversion.

53% of America's LGBT population lives in those states.

Forget 60 years ago, we still legalize the torture of LGBT children today in more than half the country. Our LGBT community has the highest suicide rate out of any demographic and a major identified link to that is laws that dehumanize or strip rights away from the community.


That doesn't justify or excuse his actions in even the slightest fucking way... but when it comes to the tens of thousands of LGBT members of society who we abuse ourselves, who we legalize discrimination and oppression against, who we push into suicide, we don't seem to have much interest in talking about that. Infact, bring those topics up (here in the States anyways) and even so-called liberals and progressives will often take a demeaning and dismissive view of the LGBT community.

It's only when the "other" does it that it's suddenly a big deal (and yes, what he did is a big deal).
Every day is a good day to *remove from server* an autocrat.

Baruch

Ha’át’íísh baa naniná?
Azee’ Å,a’ish nanídį́į́h?
Táadoo ánít’iní.
What are you doing?
Are you taking any medications?
Don't do that.

Shiranu

Quote from: Baruch on November 07, 2019, 05:03:20 PM
Education?  Extermination?

Don't know, tbh.

Extermination is probably the most effective, but least likely.
Every day is a good day to *remove from server* an autocrat.

Gawdzilla Sama

We 'new atheists' have a reputation for being militant, but make no mistake  we didn't start this war. If you want to place blame put it on the the religious zealots who have been poisoning the minds of the  young for a long long time."
PZ Myers

Shiranu

Quote from: Gawdzilla Sama on November 07, 2019, 05:46:36 PM
People of the Book.

Or just people. Homophobia doesn't really have any racial or cultural exclusivity.
Every day is a good day to *remove from server* an autocrat.

Gawdzilla Sama

Quote from: Shiranu on November 07, 2019, 06:17:22 PM
Or just people. Homophobia doesn't really have any racial or cultural exclusivity.
The father qualifies as people of the book. Book doesn't seem to help much.
We 'new atheists' have a reputation for being militant, but make no mistake  we didn't start this war. If you want to place blame put it on the the religious zealots who have been poisoning the minds of the  young for a long long time."
PZ Myers

Munch

Quote from: Shiranu on November 07, 2019, 06:17:22 PM
Or just people. Homophobia doesn't really have any racial or cultural exclusivity.

however it seems to be far more prevalent within people who are willing to believe in make believe stories made up thousands of years ago.

You can look at parts of human history like greek culture and see the influence there, while probably no utopia itself, it was far more of a progressive culture back then compared to many other places at the time, before Christianity bulldozed its way in.

The only reason gay people today can marry, adopt, donate blood, is due to the absence of religion, more specifically, these two major religions and all their off-brand versions of them.
'Political correctness is fascism pretending to be manners' - George Carlin

Shiranu

QuoteYou can look at parts of human history like greek culture and see the influence there, while probably no utopia itself, it was far more of a progressive culture back then compared to many other places at the time, before Christianity bulldozed its way in.

Debatable, but not one I am really educated enough to debate in. However many modern scholars believe that pederasty was almost entirely an aristocratic pursuit that the general population disproved of, and certainly within Plato's lifetime there was a huge social shift on the tolerance of homosexuals in Athens. When he first started writing, he talked about how they perhaps had even purer love than heterosexual couples, but by the end of his life he (and many Athenian thinkers) condemned it as a deed worse than adultery.

The Ancient Greeks were probably about as far as progressive from you can get, when you compare them to cultures like the Persians and some Indian societies. And that's just on the topic of LGBT... when you get to women, slave rights, etc. ... ooooohh boy.

QuoteThe only reason gay people today can marry, adopt, donate blood, is due to the absence of religion, more specifically, these two major religions and all their off-brand versions of them.

I promise I don't do this just to argue, but this discredits the work of many religious figures who fought for gay rights. Many leading figures of the LGBT rights movement (at least here in America) were religious; Barbara Gittings was Catholic, Harvey Milk (first openly gay public official) was Jewish, the Glide Memorial Methodist Church, the ELCA (Lutheran) church, and many other were massive players in promoting tolerance and granting equal rights to the LGBT community in America.

Shit, the Lutheran church I went to (ELCA) quite literally tore itself in half over the issue, losing a large chunk of it's congregation because the leaders refused to compromise with people who believed the church shouldn't ordain gay pastors or fund pro-LGBT organizations. It cost the church a large amount of money and caused alot of controversy, but they believed gay rights were more important than compromising on that.

And I have met more than my fair share of atheists who are vocally opposed to the LGBT community.


Yes, religion is the banner that bigots hide behind... and certainly are the most well-funded banner. But religion is also one of the biggest voices in favour of LGBT rights. Discrediting the work of countless people who fought for gay rights in the name of their religion is not right.
Every day is a good day to *remove from server* an autocrat.

Munch

Quote from: Shiranu on November 07, 2019, 09:03:22 PM

I promise I don't do this just to argue, but this discredits the work of many religious figures who fought for gay rights. Many leading figures of the LGBT rights movement (at least here in America) were religious; Barbara Gittings was Catholic, Harvey Milk (first openly gay public official) was Jewish, the Glide Memorial Methodist Church, the ELCA (Lutheran) church, and many other were massive players in promoting tolerance and granting equal rights to the LGBT community in America.

Shit, the Lutheran church I went to (ELCA) quite literally tore itself in half over the issue, losing a large chunk of it's congregation because the leaders refused to compromise with people who believed the church shouldn't ordain gay pastors or fund pro-LGBT organizations. It cost the church a large amount of money and caused alot of controversy, but they believed gay rights were more important than compromising on that.

And I have met more than my fair share of atheists who are vocally opposed to the LGBT community.


Yes, religion is the banner that bigots hide behind... and certainly are the most well-funded banner. But religion is also one of the biggest voices in favour of LGBT rights. Discrediting the work of countless people who fought for gay rights in the name of their religion is not right.

fair points. however I would still argue those people you mentioned drove for more lgbt rights not because of their beliefs, but in them breaking some form of code of conduct separate from it. They developed their own sense of morality that wouldn't be welcome in the larger group. I won't discredit them as people, but I can assure you they didn't reach the state of support they held because of their religion, but because they were just decent human beings.
'Political correctness is fascism pretending to be manners' - George Carlin

Draconic Aiur

Religion can be seen as a culture., like Jewish for example.

Shiranu

Quotehowever I would still argue those people you mentioned drove for more lgbt rights not because of their beliefs, but in them breaking some form of code of conduct separate from it. They developed their own sense of morality that wouldn't be welcome in the larger group.

And I would be prone to agree with you. But many of these people explicitly say they do it in the name of their faith, that they were raised in a faith that promotes tolerance and equality. In the case of the churches that were pro-LGBT rights, it means even the doctrine "experts" (for whatever such a subjective title means) believed the Bible and their faith were justifying their actions.

Where and who gets to draw the line on what someone else "really" believes?

Quote...but I can assure you they didn't reach the state of support they held because of their religion, but because they were just decent human beings.

Agreed again, but there is doctrine within their religion that cultivates being a decent human being.


(Edit: And I do realise this is getting extremely off-topic, so I don't mind completely dropping this)
Every day is a good day to *remove from server* an autocrat.

Baruch

The stereotype of religious people being scimitar wielding nut jobs ... is current in certain Western societies.  I suppose there are Anglos with the stereotype that the folks who murdered the Mormon family are typical Aztecs.
Ha’át’íísh baa naniná?
Azee’ Å,a’ish nanídį́į́h?
Táadoo ánít’iní.
What are you doing?
Are you taking any medications?
Don't do that.