Started by Awakepuddle, February 26, 2017, 09:20:11 PM
Quote from: popsthebuilder on March 15, 2017, 09:08:35 AMPeace HarmonyCompassion Ever-giving Long suffering for the sake of anotherSelf sacrifice for the sake of others.Actually I could most likely make a list of words that indeed are universally good, but I'm trying to not bring words associated with faith into it, even though they can be wholly understood without religion.I can most likely name off some universally negative or bad things too if you would like.peacefaith in selfless unity for good
Quote from: Solomon Zorn on March 15, 2017, 03:32:03 PMPops, I really need you to withdraw all of your savings, liquidate your assets, come up to Northwest Indiana, pay my rent in advance, for as far into the future as you can, and massage my back. It shouldn't be a problem for you, since ever-giving, long suffering, self sacrifice is a universal good.
Quote from: popsthebuilder on March 15, 2017, 06:23:17 PMNo savings or assets to be had. And the idea is those in need are those that should be helped. I wouldn't be putting all I had into simply giving to an able bodied man. Perhaps you are elderly or otherwise somehow disabled from supporting or providing for yourself then that would be different.
Quote from: Awakepuddle on March 14, 2017, 10:13:28 PMAgain, my question still stands about using the term qualitative morality rather than objective morality for those people who are discussing morality.
Quote from: Mike Cl on March 15, 2017, 06:12:24 PMI should have known better than to open my big mouth............................:)What is peace? That is too broad a word; need to define it. Same with harmony--what is that? Compassion--what is that? Ever--giving--what is that??? Long suffer for the sake of another and self sacrifice for the sake of others can be very harmful to the giver--and the givee as well. And what does it mean to be 'self sacrificing' ??
Quote from: Solomon Zorn on March 15, 2017, 07:17:10 PMHow selfish of you! Unless you are finally admitting that selflessness, and self-interest have to balance! Any moral, made into a "universal," or absolute truth, is untenable.
Quote from: popsthebuilder on March 15, 2017, 09:24:30 PMHow can you say that it isn't always universally good and moral to keep an innocent, healthy life from being killed?
Quote from: Solomon Zorn on March 15, 2017, 07:17:10 PMAny moral, made into a "universal," or absolute truth, is untenable.
Quote from: popsthebuilderLong suffering and self sacrifice for the benefit of another is not negative towards the other; and yes the level of detriment or discomfort one should endure for another can vary based on the severity of the need. Obviously you wouldn't need to sacrifice your life in order to hold a door open for someone, or help them carry something. Likewise; offering a dollar to a man actively shooting others most likely wouldn't really be beneficial to any, and could prove exceedingly detrimental to ones own health.
Quote from: popsthebuilderIt really is very simple, though I'm sure you wish it was not for some reason.
Quote from: popsthebuilderSelf sacrifice could mean missing a show you were looking forward to seeing because someone needed a favor. Or it could mean literal martyrdom, standing in the face of death do what one knows to be good. So basically self sacrifice would be setting aside ones own wants and needs in order to help another percievably in need in cases that you can.
Quote from: popsthebuilderObviously you can't do something about everything and you can't help everyone who needs it; let alone who wants it.
Quote from: Solomon Zorn on March 15, 2017, 10:08:35 PMWhat you just described is subjective morality, in a nutshell. Many, if not most decisions, are more complex than any universal statements can encompass.Morality is only simple to simpletons(in which category I would not place you). You have just outlined a few of the complexities, and exceptions, but still hold to the idea that self sacrifice is a "universal good."Agreed, on your definition of "self-sacrifice," although I never thought we had a semantic issue.Never said you could.
Quote from: popsthebuilder on March 15, 2017, 09:24:30 PMI never said that being utterly selfless to the point of ones own death for one not even in need was needed and will not.I will admit equal value for life; yours being of no more value than mine, and visa versa. To be clear; I would help you in any concievable fashion I could fathom, to any extent I could muster. The means is one issue, and you would actually needing something from me that I actually have too.The balance is that one life = one life.How can you say that it isn't always universally good and moral to keep an innocent, healthy life from being killed?faith in selfless unity for good
Quote from: dndhuram on May 12, 2017, 03:00:40 AMI agree that there are few universal truths or morals
Quote from: Mike Cl on May 12, 2017, 09:08:42 AMActually, there are none. Can you name just one??