Two Editorials Reflection On Election and Media

[chill98]

Two NY papers reflective editorials that take a look within. 

But the fixation on diversity in our schools and in the press has produced a generation of liberals and progressives narcissistically unaware of conditions outside their self-defined groups, and indifferent to the task of reaching out to Americans in every walk of life.

http://www.nytimes.com/2016/11/20/opinion/sunday/the-end-of-identity-liberalism.html?_r=1

What kind of president will Trump be? It’s a tad too early to say, isn’t it? The media are supposed to tell us what happened, not speculate on the future. But its incessant scaremongering, the utter lack of proportionality and the shameless use of double standards are an embarrassment, one that is demeaning the value of the institution.

http://nypost.com/2016/11/20/keep-crying-wolf-about-trump-and-no-one-will-listen-to-a-real-crisis/

[Mermaid]

Two NY papers reflective editorials that take a look within. 

http://www.nytimes.com/2016/11/20/opinion/sunday/the-end-of-identity-liberalism.html?_r=1

http://nypost.com/2016/11/20/keep-crying-wolf-about-trump-and-no-one-will-listen-to-a-real-crisis/

The same thing is true for both sides of the mountain. When you are surrounded by like-minded people, you tend to forget other viewpoints. Tell me people in red states aren't aware of how many liberals and progressives there are.

[Shiranu]

Once again, education is the great Satan.

I must say, I have encountered far more atheists who think education, particularly higher education, is the work of the devil and the blame for all of societies ills than I have Christians. This seems odd coming from a group that then boasts more of its members are university educated than the other guy.

One day education is the bees knees and proof we are better, the next it is the needle ripping apart the threads of society. It is tiring trying to keep up with if I am suppose to adore or despise it...

I will say this though... it always seems to be people not in the field of education, attending a university or with any direct ties to the academia who promote this view that their is an organized conspiracy in our class rooms and campuses to convert everyone to radical social justice. I'm sure that's just a coincidence though...

[Shiranu]

It's also not to early to hold Trump to the things he said or things he has already done to show how terrible of potential president he is, but that's just my apparently scaremongering and double standard opinion...

[chill98]

The same thing is true for both sides of the mountain. When you are surrounded by like-minded people, you tend to forget other viewpoints. Tell me people in red states aren't aware of how many liberals and progressives there are.

Lemme guess.  You consider yourself among the educated.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Red_herring

[chill98]

Once again, education is the great Satan.

well if you are an example of its outcome....

now go away little yappy doggie.  You obviously did not read or did not comprehend what was actually said.

[Shiranu]

well if you are an example of its outcome....

now go away little yappy doggie.  You obviously did not read or did not comprehend what was actually said.

I actually did read the first one, and it got some things just completely and utterly wrong from my experience living on, attending and working at three different universities in different states (one democrat, two republican). One really blaring issue is this assumption that high school is teaching children... anything... to do with social issues. At least in Texas, that is a blatant lie and I would argue that in most Southern states that is extremely inaccurate as well.

Texas heavily influences what goes into the high school curriculum because of our massive market, so what the Texas board of education decides on therefor heavily influences what is taught in other states... and keep in mind, this B.E. is one that wants prominent black figures in history removed (think MLKs, Harriet Tubman, etc.), refuses to acknowledge the Mexican-American social movement which has had massive influences on our culture (you are from Arizona yes? so you should know that) or even worse demonises figures like Ceaser Chavez. At my university, we have a a plaque commemorating Jefferson Davis and placed by the Daughters of the Confederacy, and very little fuss is raised about it. Does that sound like an environment of over-social awareness being cultivated?

My problem is that, in crying about identity politics being something that is just pushed by these radical "faux-intelligentsia", you are making this oversweeping assumption about younger generations and our education systems that are simply not accurate for even a large minority of students. The people you are laughing at are laughed at by almost everyone on campus as well, but for one reason or another the knee jerk reaction is, "See! All these college younguns are idiots ruining our society!" when we AGREE with you.

My problem is not what is being said in the articles about the "radicals", which I for the most part agree with... it's that they imply, and thus people here and in "the real world" imply, that it is some systemic issue within the education system and all our youth are at risk of being perverted by it. I would be ecstatic if schools taught a a quarter of the social consciousness that you seem to think it does, but they don't. It's this constant loop of, "I hate people who practice identity politics, so everyone who is in a similar group as them probably all think the same!".


I fear it has far less to do with me not understanding and more to do with you not realising the hypocrisy of what you are doing.

[Mermaid]

Lemme guess.  You consider yourself among the educated.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Red_herring

What the fuck?

[Jack89]

But the fixation on diversity in our schools and in the press has produced a generation of liberals and progressives narcissistically unaware of conditions outside their self-defined groups, and indifferent to the task of reaching out to Americans in every walk of life.

University is one thing, there should be political exploration and discussion, but not in grade school or high school.  The teachers' political and social views should not be pushed onto the kids.  That's not their place.  I see on the news high school and middle school kids leaving class and walking down the street protesting.  What the hell is going on here?  Do all of their parent approve of this?  My kids couldn't even leave the campus during lunch until their senior year without parental approval. 

My cousin is a teacher in the Portland, OR area and a full on SJW.  I love her to death, but she is part of the problem.  From the way she talks, I have no doubt she pushes her agenda onto her students. 

[chill98]

(you are from Arizona yes? so you should know that)

NOPE.  Not even close.

And that is as far as I will go with you, little yapping doggie.  You are exactly what has gone wrong with the democratic party.  I am sure you don't like the article as it strikes close to home for you.  It is describing you.

Wisconsin, Michigan, Pennsylvania, Ohio... Lost to Trump.  How did the democrats fuck that up sooo badly?  Minnesota nearly went red, 1.6% of the vote saved Clinton.  A state that carried Obama in 2012 by 7%.  Obama by 21% in 2008.

Fuck texas, everyone knew it was staying red.

[Shiranu]

NOPE.  Not even close.

And that is as far as I will go with you, little yapping doggie.  You are exactly what has gone wrong with the democratic party.  I am sure you don't like the article as it strikes close to home for you.  It is describing you.

Wisconsin, Michigan, Pennsylvania, Ohio... Lost to Trump.  How did the democrats fuck that up sooo badly?  Minnesota nearly went red, 1.6% of the vote saved Clinton.  A state that carried Obama in 2012 by 7%.  Obama by 21% in 2008.

Fuck texas, everyone knew it was staying red.

Ah, the shining beacon of a trump supporter. Doesn't read what anyone else says and just bombasts away like he matters and MUST be right, even when the person he Is calling out agreed with him. I see why you like him so much.

[Sylar]

NOPE.  Not even close.

And that is as far as I will go with you, little yapping doggie.  You are exactly what has gone wrong with the democratic party.  I am sure you don't like the article as it strikes close to home for you.  It is describing you.

Wisconsin, Michigan, Pennsylvania, Ohio... Lost to Trump.  How did the democrats fuck that up sooo badly?  Minnesota nearly went red, 1.6% of the vote saved Clinton.  A state that carried Obama in 2012 by 7%.  Obama by 21% in 2008.

Fuck texas, everyone knew it was staying red.

Democrats suffered from not enough people coming out to vote and from third party candidates taking away a much more significant number of votes than 2008 or 2012, much more than they suffered from Democrats moving to the Republican side.

With the exception of Pennsylvania, Democrats lost an average of 320k votes in each of WI, MI, and OH while Republicans more or less held their numbers (increased around 100k in MI and OH).

With the exception of Ohio, third party voters made the difference in victory for Republicans. Johnson + Stein combined came to an average of 150k votes in each of those three states.

The same scenario holds true for MN -- Republicans increased by 2k votes while Democrats decreased by almost 200k votes. Third party candidates received a combined 148k votes.

Nationwide, Republicans received a little less than 500k extra votes from 2012, while Democrats received almost 3 million less votes than in 2012.

Feel free to double check:

2008 Results: http://www.cnn.com/ELECTION/2008/results/president/
2012 Results: http://www.cnn.com/election/2012/results/main/
2016 Results: http://www.cnn.com/election/results/president

[Baruch]

But are you saying that it wasn't fair that Ross Perot mostly took votes from Republicans in 92 and 96?  In some voting systems, you throw out the minor candidates on the first vote, then revote only allowing the top two.  In that case George H W would have gotten a second term, because I don't know too many Ross Perot voters who would have swung to Bill Clinton.  Of course in that case apparently, Gore would have won in 2000 and Hillary would have won this year.  I have never seen the attraction for "alternative history".  We hardly know what we are doing with the one history we do have!

[chill98]

University is one thing, there should be political exploration and discussion, but not in grade school or high school.  The teachers' political and social views should not be pushed onto the kids.  That's not their place.  I see on the news high school and middle school kids leaving class and walking down the street protesting.  What the hell is going on here?  Do all of their parent approve of this?  My kids couldn't even leave the campus during lunch until their senior year without parental approval. 

We had walk-outs when I was in school, but they were about school policies. 

Google "class cancelled Trump" and be shocked at how many Professors cancelled class due to the inability to cope with democracy in action.   Academics out of touch with the reality of people outside of the ivory towers.  Grown ups?  I don't think so.

So yes, the academics teach the students who go on to become 'professional teachers' instructing the youth of america.  Shaming, bullying, group-think pushed onto the kids to get them to comply with the agenda.  Leading to a belief the ends justify the means as exampled here:

http://wtop.com/montgomery-county/2016/11/trump-supporter-15-beaten-during-rockville-protest/slide/1/

High school kids beating a class mate for wearing the wrong hat.  None of them could vote.  His opinion did not impact the election in Maryland - but that did not prevent the school violence.

[chill98]

Democrats suffered from not enough people coming out to vote and from third party candidates taking away a much more significant number of votes than 2008 or 2012, much more than they suffered from Democrats moving to the Republican side.

That line of thought is based on the idea that people would have voted along the same party line.  The people who stayed home are irrelevant.  They stayed home because they either
1. did not care
2. did not like Clinton
3. did not like either option

Though my list is not all inclusive, it does cover the basic point that Clinton was not inspiring enough to create a voter turn-out, even with the potential of Trump becoming pres.  They came out in droves for Obama, even in states where polls predicted a landslide, such as MN, and MI.