'There Is No God', or 'I Believe There Is No God'?

[Munch]

I saw a recent video by TJ Kirk/the amazing atheist, where he brought up the fact of how religious people, at first Christians, want to blame atheists for being why more people don't believe in Christianity or god in the west. He brought up the fact that christians target atheists as if their none belief is what is causing this AND for why Islamic fundamentalism is becoming so much stronger in the west, when its nothing to do with atheism, is just that the western world is growing smarter, they are seeing the bible as this book of fairy tales without even saying they are atheists, all on their own.

I believe the spread of information in the current age we live in is what has caused this, that more information is there at the touch of our findertips, and it has made this current generation to look things up more, and question the validity of faith on what is actually is. As he said, even in muslim countries where practicing atheism is a crime, there are people questioning and leaving islam, but doing so in secret for fear of what it will bring to them.

Its not that atheists are trying to destroy religions, despite christians saying they do that which leads to the spread of other faiths like islam, its because the world is growing smarter, its seeing faith for what it is, and honestly, I think counties there christianity is the main religions, those will be the countries that will dismiss faith first, because in countries like america and europe, we don't behead people here (anymore) for not believing in god.

[widdershins]

multiple studies have shown that the smarter and more educated you are, the more likely you are to be liberal and atheist, so that makes perfect sense.  But religion will always need a bogeyman.  Since there is no actual devil, they need to point the finger at people and say, "There!  THERE is the cause of all our imagined strife!"

[Baruch]

multiple studies have shown that the smarter and more educated you are, the more likely you are to be liberal and atheist, so that makes perfect sense.  But religion will always need a bogeyman.  Since there is no actual devil, they need to point the finger at people and say, "There!  THERE is the cause of all our imagined strife!"

There maybe no straw man devil ... but there is evil (devil minus d).  Unless you are completely amoral libertine.

[Munch]

There maybe no straw man devil ... but there is evil (devil minus d).  Unless you are completely amoral libertine.

Well, evil as an entity doesn't exist, it's a moral standard and those who operate outside of it in the worst way possible belong in that category. Same as their is no god of homosexuality or basketball.

[Unbeliever]

There maybe no straw man devil ... but there is evil (devil minus d).  Unless you are completely amoral libertine.

Bad behavior happens, and some call it "evil." But it's only bad behavior. Even the worst possible behavior isn't "evil" in the religious sense, because according to the Bible God creates evil, and since there's no God then there's no evil that was created by God, in that sense of the word.  A lion is evil only from the antelope's perspective; Hitler wasn't evil, either, but he (and his henchmen) did behave very badly according to the opinions of most people in the world.

Again, as with the existence of God, it comes down to definitions, I guess.

[Baruch]

Bad behavior happens, and some call it "evil." But it's only bad behavior. Even the worst possible behavior isn't "evil" in the religious sense, because according to the Bible God creates evil, and since there's no God then there's no evil that was created by God, in that sense of the word.  A lion is evil only from the antelope's perspective; Hitler wasn't evil, either, but he (and his henchmen) did behave very badly according to the opinions of most people in the world.

Again, as with the existence of God, it comes down to definitions, I guess.

You need a long spell in the torture cells of the Spice Trade Guild ;-(  You simply are too bourgeois to appreciate Guantanamo.  Evil = extremely bad.  Not sending you to bed without your supper.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mGygaPaneIo

Similar to the US President taking orders from his master, concerning his machinations ...

[Unbeliever]

[Cavebear]

All religion is merely the codified rules of humans successfully existing in large groups, with a little fear of hell thrown in for control.  The religion comes after the human rules are shown to work.  Religionists try to make it the other way around, but it doesn't fit that way.

[Baruch]

All religion is merely the codified rules of humans successfully existing in large groups, with a little fear of hell thrown in for control.  The religion comes after the human rules are shown to work.  Religionists try to make it the other way around, but it doesn't fit that way.

Gobekle Tepe is the world's oldest stone building, built before humans even had agriculture.  There were no State-like structures, just wandering hunter-gatherers some of whom apparently could speak the same language (or they couldn't have organized to build stone buildings).  So basically you had multiples of extended family units ... but it isn't clear that they were patriarchal, they could have been matriarchal.  Again, compare with the San people.  People wouldn't have had fear of Hell, that hadn't been invented yet.  But we know that even Homo Erectus, much earlier, had a view of an after-life and some formal burials.  Religion then was similar to shamanism ... with cult leaders on the male side, and similar ones on the female side ... who practiced mutual exclusive secret societies (gender taboo clubs).  Social enforcement would have been primitive, not unlike a street gang.  But I don't see the point of arguing chicken-egg.  Early humans started out religious, animist in fact.  Societies got much more complex, and much more populous after the invention of agriculture ... and that is when you have the first States.  You have to organize a sedentary people on a much larger scale, particularly when irrigation is required (early states usually formed along large rivers).  Transhumance people like Sami and Bedouin don't need this organization ... but they can get larger than a family or clan ... to tribal size (see Arabia in the time of Muhammad).

[widdershins]

There maybe no straw man devil ... but there is evil (devil minus d).  Unless you are completely amoral libertine.

Evil is what men say it is and is not what men say it is not.  In America beheading people for disagreeing with you is evil.  In the Middle East, it's a Tuesday.

[Hydra009]

I used to call myself an agnostic.  I did that because I said that one cannot prove god does not exist;can't prove a negative.  But I now think that the astounding lack of any evidence of any kind of the existence of any god is proof that none exist. I would love for a theist to come forward (well, hell, they can stay in the background if they wish) and prove me wrong.

Most people don't realize this, but the lack of evidence is actually a pretty damning statement.  We lack evidence of the existence of leprechauns and faeries as well.  Theists like to think that "you can't prove god doesn't exist" is a point for their side.  Nothing could be further from the truth.

[Mike Cl]

Most people don't realize this, but the lack of evidence is actually a pretty damning statement.  We lack evidence of the existence of leprechauns and faeries as well.  Theists like to think that "you can't prove god doesn't exist" is a point for their side.  Nothing could be further from the truth.

Amen! Brother............

[Baruch]

Evil is what men say it is and is not what men say it is not.  In America beheading people for disagreeing with you is evil.  In the Middle East, it's a Tuesday.

That is ... racist.  There is nothing wrong with executing people.  Culturally approved means will vary.  If it is evil here, it is evil everywhere.  This isn't about what side of the road the Brits drive on (the wrong side).  If words only mean what we say we mean, then aren't we Humpty Dumpty?

“When I use a word,” Humpty Dumpty said, in rather a scornful tone, “it means just what I choose it to meanâ€"neither more nor less.” “The question is,” said Alice, “whether you can make words mean so many different things.” ... the actual Humpty Dumpty was an English landlord in Ireland, murdered by his outraged tenants.

So you advocate New Speak then?

[widdershins]

That is ... racist.  There is nothing wrong with executing people.  Culturally approved means will vary.  If it is evil here, it is evil everywhere.  This isn't about what side of the road the Brits drive on (the wrong side).  If words only mean what we say we mean, then aren't we Humpty Dumpty?

“When I use a word,” Humpty Dumpty said, in rather a scornful tone, “it means just what I choose it to meanâ€"neither more nor less.” “The question is,” said Alice, “whether you can make words mean so many different things.” ... the actual Humpty Dumpty was an English landlord in Ireland, murdered by his outraged tenants.

So you advocate New Speak then?

The Middle East is a place, not a race.  Geographist, maybe?  I don't know what you'd call someone who doesn't like a place because that place sucks.

Evil is a concept, not a thing.  As a concept it is defined by the individual.  We don't have a hive mind.  There are many who think me evil because I'm an atheist.  Those people have never met me, of course.  And how do you think Bush justified torture, or guards at Gitmo justified raping prisoners?  Those guys were "evil" and had it coming.  When a Christian tells us that we're all going to burn in Hell for eternity, in his mind, it's because we're evil and deserve it.  Even if you point out that we simply don't believe, it's as mundane as that, in his mind there is something else going on.  Why would a person deserve to burn for an eternity for simple disbelief?  That's something only an evil person deserves, so there must be something more going on.

And I didn't say "executing people", as in a legal means of terminating the life of an egregious offender.  I said specifically beheading people for disagreeing with you.  I read one story about a year ago about a man in the Middle East who cut his beard.  I don't remember why, but he needed to fit in somewhere.  I also don't remember whether he was attacked or just feared he would be, but it was one of those.  People were going to/did/would have wanted to murder him for cutting his own beard off because that, not the violent murder, was the truly evil act in their minds.

[Baruch]

Evil depend on who is killing who, why they are killing them, and how they are killing them?  Not very liberal of you ;-)

"We don't have a hive mind" ... so no memes, no fake news, no culture?  i guess you really are Neo ;-)