The 613 Mitzvot (Commandments) Graphed Based On Content

Started by Shiranu, December 18, 2022, 11:08:13 PM

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Shiranu

The 613 Mitzvot of the O.T., as objectively as I could categorize it.

Screwed Up Last Chart of the 613 Mitzvot


Reasonably/Debatable Positive - 123 (20.06%) of the Mitzvot fall under this category. These include commandments like "Don't disrespect your parents", "Don't do sorcery", "Don't eat maggots", "havevows annulled before the court of law", "Don't over consume your crops and give the land time to recover." - overall just good advice that doesn't maybe hit the same high notes but are still amazing life lessons and often border between "Reasonable" and "Objective" categories.

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Cultural Traditions - 271 (44.21%) Coming in at nearly half the commandments, cultural traditions dominates the rules; these are things like how a priest should behave, how food should be prepared for sacred occasions, when the occasions are... small things that neither have "good" nor "bad" messages but rather just tell a people what their expectations in society are and how to fulfill them.

Extremely useful information to have written down or at least codified when your people are constantly being displaced and oppressed across the world.

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Debatable/Reasonably "Bad" - 31 (5.05%) of the Mitzvot fall here; this includes things such as "Never swear in the name of an idol", "Show the Canaanite no favor", "The court must carry out the death penalty" (depends on your view of that), "Carry out the laws of capitive women" (how about no captive women).

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Objectively bad - 32 (5.22%) of the Mitzvot fall here - I think it's safe to say you have a good idea what "bad" commandments are; "Burn and kill the infidel" type things.


Therefor, the "bad" of the 613 commandments can be seen as thus...

    45.01% contains Objectively Good or Really Good messages

    44.21% is cultural tradition that does not have any relation to anyone outside Judaism/the Book

    10.27% is arguably or objectively bad things that most people do not adhere to anymore.

How can it be argued that nearly 90% of a work is tainted by the 10% that is negative?
"A little science distances you from God, but a lot of science brings you nearer to Him." - Louis Pasteur

Mike Cl

Quote from: Shiranu on December 18, 2022, 11:08:13 PMThe 613 Mitzvot of the O.T., as objectively as I could categorize it.


How can it be argued that nearly 90% of a work is tainted by the 10% that is negative?
Not sure I agree with your chart but must admit I have not studied it yet. But let's accept the 90/10 statement for sake of argument.  That's like stating god is all good and perfect; and read in the bible that he admits to jealousy and created the universe with flaws and is pissed with his creations and not himself.  Plus, that 10% negative is a fairly huge number considering it is supposed to guide our lives; so it's okay that 1 out of every ten actions or thoughts are negative/destructive?  The bible, all of them, are crafted by various, mostly unknown authors, for their own purposes and ends--mostly to get, and maintain, power for a select group; propaganda of the most effective sort.
Is God willing to prevent evil, but not able?<br />Then he is not omnipotent,<br />Is he able but not willing?<br />Then whence cometh evil?<br />Is he neither able or willing?<br />Then why call him god?

Shiranu

QuoteThat's like stating god is all good and perfect; and read in the bible that he admits to jealousy and created the universe with flaws and is pissed with his creations and not himself. 

(Just for clarification - I am coming at this from an early Biblical (pre-Roman)/historical perspective and not always my own perspective)

Depends on which God you are referring to; Yahweh, a regional/national god or El - "Lord" - the father of the Gods who was merged with Yahweh?

At the time the Bible was written, the two were distinctly different - El was a pan-Semetic god who operated as a patriarch-like figure (see Zeus, Odin, "God" the bearded man in the sky) who was the father of Yahweh - the local deity of the kingdoms of Judah and Israel.

Early Christians would agree Yahweh was a horrible, disgusting entity and actually spent a lot of time discussing this; they finally concluded that the god most prominently portrayed in the Old Testament was a minor Judean polytheistic god who essentially imitated the one true god (reason for doing so varied by cult).

I'm not going to say this isn't just shifting things around to justify it, but it is at least logically consistent so... that's a lot better than most Christianity today.

QuotePlus, that 10% negative is a fairly huge number considering it is supposed to guide our lives; so it's okay that 1 out of every ten actions or thoughts are negative/destructive? 

Just by eye test, 10% of laws in America are objectively horrible - I would argue far more in truth.

Is it "okay" that 10% of laws on the book are horrible; laws that guide our lives - often without our consent - being objectively harmful and oppressive?

Not really, but it is what it is - and I wouldn't say that the fact that African Americans are thrown in jail for non-violent crimes purely due to racism somehow taints the entire body of the law - merely the people who enforce it and wrote it in the first place.

If it was up to me, that 10% in both cases would be thrown out and forgotten - but it fortunately/unfortunately isn't up to me.

QuoteThe bible, all of them, are crafted by various, mostly unknown authors, for their own purposes and ends--mostly to get, and maintain, power for a select group; propaganda of the most effective sort.

I'll agree with most of that, although I wouldn't say "mostly" it was about power - to a large extent, but not necessarily mostly.

Rather they were often really good texts that really shitty people decided to add notes to and warp for their own agenda - this is just how evil people work, is it not? The same can be seen in politics, in charity, in punk rock, in almost any group dynamic where a good message is being presented - some shitty people slowly get involved and corrupt it.

In terms of "Sacred Texts", I would put the Bible relatively low in terms of spiritual/moral value - but it's also really largely meant more as a history of a the Hebrew/Israelite people more-so than a sacred text... that's what the Talmud and other accompanying works were to provide.

Which now that I write that, it is even more interesting how much "Christianity" (as it developed) is primarily just a means of claiming someone else's culture as your own and once again shows how little Yeshua actually had to do with it.

Some things never change, I suppose.
"A little science distances you from God, but a lot of science brings you nearer to Him." - Louis Pasteur

Mr.Obvious

#3
I would like to say that i too do not necessarily agree with the chart. But i also don't think you can just look at this like a quantitative 'issue'
If you hav ten commandments, and letS say they are these:
1. Don't eat magots
2. Wash your dingus
3. Don't overfish
4. Change your crops regularly
5. Talk about your feelings
6. Show an interest in other people
7. Don't be cruel to animals
8. Cook your water before consumption
9. Don't eat strange plants
10. Kill every last faggot you find.

Then yeah, that 10% does weigh a bit more than 'don't eat maggots'
And where the bible goes bad, it goes horrible.
If the 10% is about raping young girls, enslaving people, bashing gays, having a bear kill children for being mean and pretending that is somehow not only justifiable but truly moraly good... yeah that in my opinion does taint a larger 90%
"If we have to go down, we go down together!"
- Your mum, last night, requesting 69.

Atheist Mantis does not pray.

Mike Cl

The term 'the bible' is a bit of a propaganda slogan.  There never was 'the bible'.  It did not drop from heaven complete.  It was compiled.  There were at least 85 'gospels' written and hundreds of other writings to choose from.  So, the compilers took what they wanted and destroyed the rest (or tried to).  This, to me, demonstrates that they wanted to pick and choose from the writings and then put them into the order that best served their purposes.  To further illustrate that here is no 'the bible' witness the huge number of different editions there are and each edition is different.  If there was a 'word of god' then there should not be hundreds of different ones--only one. 
Is God willing to prevent evil, but not able?<br />Then he is not omnipotent,<br />Is he able but not willing?<br />Then whence cometh evil?<br />Is he neither able or willing?<br />Then why call him god?