Just a little venting hope this is the right forum. In some of the discussions I have had , a percentage of people who are not atheist have no idea of what it is, I have tried to explain on a few occasions what it was, then be told I was wrong. I don't mean not understanding what it is like to be an atheist, but the literal definition of it.
In your opinion what makes this so difficult to understand ?
Is it they can only frame their understanding of it based on their own theistic belief ? do they just not want to understand it ?
I guess one could throw in how agnosticism and gnosticism come into the picture as well.
Thoughts ?
Any theist reading this, I just want to assure you that I don't eat babies , am not a scientist, and I do in fact have morals and a life philosophy darn it. !
It's the "A" in front of theism. they first have to look up theism and then figure out the A.
I think they just can't comprehend. And there doesn't really have to be a reason why they just don't.
Quote from: stromboli on April 20, 2015, 07:34:43 PM
It's the "A" in front of theism. they first have to look up theism and then figure out the A.
And they have a really hard time with even that. It's a privative a (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Privative_a). It indicates negation/absence. It works like -in or -un.
A-morphous = without shape
a-typical = not typical
an-aerobic = without oxygen
A-theism = without a belief in god, godless
Atheism. Super simple stuff.
Maybe because if a theist tried to understand what an atheist was, then they'd have to think about what they believe. And reason and thinking is of the devil. Only belief and faith is of the lawrd. And so, the closer theists get to thinking, the more nervous they become.
I have no idea. Last week some Christian told me that an atheist is their own god.
...he just couldn't fathom not having a god belief.
I know a guy who is a very edgy guy in his 50s, a rock-and-roller, a recovered drug addict, a guy who lived a life of drunkenness and debauchery (straight and gay), a guy who has experienced prison time; he has lived a hard and on-the-edge life. He's a take-no-guff tough guy who leans liberal politically. He also doesn't like Christians, Muslims or other religious types, and doesn't like organized religion at all. But he believes in some kind of "higher power", and simply doesn't "get" atheists. He's totally puzzled by how someone can lack belief in a god. He's also a vegetarian and doesn't "get" meat eating. Both of these things seem to me incongruous with his life experience. But hey, everyone is different.
Quote from: Mike Cl on April 20, 2015, 10:58:16 PM
Maybe because if a theist tried to understand what an atheist was, then they'd have to think about what they believe. And reason and thinking is of the devil. Only belief and faith is of the lawrd. And so, the closer theists get to thinking, the more nervous they become.
And also their religious beliefs are so central to some people that they couldn't imagine going without. Yet curiously, they seem to have no problem when it comes to those dastardly communists or depraved nihilists. So, the difficulty is less with picturing atheists and more in picturing atheists as anything other than villains.
Explaining this stuff to theists is almost like dealing with someone who has lived his whole life under a dictatorship and having to explain over and over again that the president isn't a dictator.
Quote from: Atheon on April 21, 2015, 12:50:31 AM
I know a guy who is a very edgy guy in his 50s, a rock-and-roller, a recovered drug addict, a guy who lived a life of drunkenness and debauchery (straight and gay), a guy who has experienced prison time; he has lived a hard and on-the-edge life. He's a take-no-guff tough guy who leans liberal politically. He also doesn't like Christians, Muslims or other religious types, and doesn't like organized religion at all. But he believes in some kind of "higher power", and simply doesn't "get" atheists. He's totally puzzled by how someone can lack belief in a god. He's also a vegetarian and doesn't "get" meat eating. Both of these things seem to me incongruous with his life experience. But hey, everyone is different.
That's sounds a bit different, at least he sounds like he understands what what the word atheists and atheism means, he may think it's wrong , which is fine be me and I can respect that but it's when people think its some religion with all of these doctrines and beliefs, that drives me nuts.
As for him being vegan/vegatarion, while I eat meat, I can actually see that, many people associate the vegan diet as "cleaner" way of life.
They can't understand atheism, just like a child can't understand not having a mother and father, and being responsible for themselves and their actions. It's terrifying for them to think there is no God, just like a child is of loosing their parents---their guardians, where they get love from, take care of all their needs, and obey them or get punished. Growing up is hard to do, and makes you insecure when you cut the apron cord. It's like skydiving into the unknown until you can do it without a static line. :surprised: :biggrin2: Solitary
It just goes to show you how pervasive religious brainwashing is. Their belief is so ingrained into their minds that they cannot comprehend someone who does not believe in a god. To do so would open a psychological door to doubt and fear. So a mechanism kicks in that makes them assume that something is terribly wrong with you. Satan has conscripted your soul and you don't even know it. Some will try to save you, others will ostracize you. In either case they can go fuck themselves.
Because there is no benefit, nor profit in it for them. And at certain places they kill you. So it is not just the religion itself. People do not choose some religion, because they individually want to believe in one. They become Christians, because they are born in a Christian country. They become muslims, because they are born in a muslim one. And it is beneficial and profitable to flock the land rule. Nobody actually chooses anything.
Correct, religion is pragmatic for them, and they assume that being pragmatic means they have found the truth, when all they have found is ignorance. Solitary
Quote from: Solitary on April 21, 2015, 12:01:58 PM
Correct, religion is pragmatic for them, and they assume that being pragmatic means they have found the truth, when all they have found is ignorance. Solitary
Sol, I don't think they actually look for any truth or feel any worry about being ignorant. It's just 'the way it is' for them. Oh of course they are using those words like 'truth'...etc. It's just words to them. At least that's my experience with those people.
Quote from: Penny Dreadful on April 21, 2015, 12:06:35 PM
speaking of things hard to understand. Hiya Cutie! Good to see you back! Same old gang of assholes here ceptin me the perfect gentlemen as you well know. Speaking of that do you have any new pics? :)~
Quote from: aitm on April 21, 2015, 12:11:46 PM
speaking of things hard to understand. Hiya Cutie! Good to see you back! Same old gang of assholes here ceptin me the perfect gentlemen as you well know. Speaking of that do you have any new pics? :)~
Lol, hey aitm. Well you have to do with my avatar for now. You'll be the first one to get my new pics dear I promise. :kiss:
Yeah, about that av......eh......it needs some help dear.
Quote from: aitm on April 21, 2015, 01:00:05 PM
Yeah, about that av......eh......it needs some help dear.
Why do you think I put on red lipstick? :p
Maybe this is unusual, but no one I know has a problem understanding atheism. What's so difficult to comprehend about not believing?
However, some of my believer friends jokingly refer to me as a "communist". I think they may have a difficult time saying the A-word.
The problem is most theists simply cannot take "We don't know" as an answer. They need absolutes. Also, when it comes to religious beliefs they are usually not deep thinkers, and will latch on to whatever belief makes them feel good.
QuoteWhy do some people find Atheism so hard to understand ?
They're stupid.
Quote from: the_antithesis on April 25, 2015, 10:43:06 AM
They're stupid.
My aunt doesn't understand it, and yes, she is a stupid woman.
Quote from: kilodelta on April 20, 2015, 11:19:44 PM
I have no idea. Last week some Christian told me that an atheist is their own god.
...he just couldn't fathom not having a god belief.
I knew a guy in Alcoholics Anonymous who was always hyping God. He used to say with great authority, "There is a god, and you ain't him!" Then he would punctuate the finality of what he perceived as a deeply profound insight with this satisfied look of self approval.
I used to think, "WTF? Who the Hell is he even talking to? Who is this person who thinks he's God? No Christian would make that claim, or would they? And certainly no atheist would make such a claim, since the basic tenet of atheism is, after all, that there is no god."
In another discussion with someone about atheism, they are trying to prove atheism wrong because it makes certain claims about god, and the creation of the universe. I explained the usual that atheism is not a claim, but lack of a belief. This goes back and forth and I'll spare you the entire conversation but I will share this nugget.
"Atheism has a not claim associated with it! How do you explain a not claim having a not claim with it if it is not actually a claim?"
Quote from: Termin on May 02, 2015, 06:56:45 PM
In another discussion with someone about atheism, they are trying to prove atheism wrong because it makes certain claims about god, and the creation of the universe. I explained the usual that atheism is not a claim, but lack of a belief. This goes back and forth and I'll spare you the entire conversation but I will spare this nugget.
"Atheism has a not claim associated with it! How do you explain a not claim having a not claim with it if it is not actually a claim?"
Is there a translator in the house?????
I replied with this, I wrote it and i'M not sure what is actually means, but I hope the sarcasm comes across.
in response too
Quote
"Atheism has a not claim associated with it! How do you explain a not claim having a not claim with it if it is not actually a claim?"
I responded with
Quote
It's quite simple actually.
Not having a claim is not a not a claim, a not claim is making a claim that something is not, whereas a not claim is not claiming that something is not, or is. So when you say a not claim having a not claim is not actually a claim it is in fact a claim that the not claim is not a claim therefore their never was a claim to not make.
Do you not misunderstand now ?
Short answer: because they are stupid.
Quote from: Termin on May 02, 2015, 08:48:33 PM
I replied with this, I wrote it and i'M not sure what is actually means, but I hope the sarcasm comes across.
in response tooI responded with
I gotta love it!!!! :))
Quote from: Light Craftsman on April 22, 2015, 07:04:20 PM
The problem is most theists simply cannot take "We don't know" as an answer. They need absolutes. Also, when it comes to religious beliefs they are usually not deep thinkers, and will latch on to whatever belief makes them feel good.
"We don't know" is more of an absolute than any of the gods being pitched as the real deal tho.
I think an Americans Against The Tea Party cited a study that one of the main reasons atheists are disrespected is that the human mind is uniquely aware of death.
We force them to confront of the fear of death. Permanent fucking death. No heaven being the slave of a angry God praising Him for all of eternity.
When atheists confront the many assumptions and incorrect notions that the religious make, and as science takes a big Golden Shower on "holy events" like the Flood that never happened, we chip further into that shield. And that makes them angrier and angrier. They scream about how we are "tearing down faith," and about how we can't just let them believe what they want.
Well, we would if you idiots didn't try to get elected and pass stupid laws you fucking tit-shitters.
Tell them they are 99.99% atheist already. There are many gods they don't believe in. The very same rational is why I'm 100% atheists.
Then watch as they try to process that information.