Thank you, Karl Marx, and progressives.
Why is western culture so hellbent to self destruct?
Do you see other cultures doing the same?
Cultural revolution or (assisted) cultural suicide?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r_8hLQmfudM
No, all part of liberation. Liberation from tradition, liberation from expectations, liberation from ethics, liberation from morality, liberation from normalcy, liberation from gender, liberation from legality ... in a phrase, social nervous breakdown into psychosis. See French Revolution. And women aren't more prone to psychosis than men are.
I see feminism as an issue with pros and cons and elements that can be intelligently discussed, but you guys (I'm talking about the tone of several recent threads, not anyone in particular) are embarrassing me by sounding like a bunch of women hating cranks that still haven't gotten over a bad relationship, or got dumped one too many times. Feminism hasn't been a big debate since the 70s. It's seldom that I feel embarrassed by the behavior of others. Hell, I'm not even embarrassed by the behavior of crazy right wing extremists, but are you guys actually serious about the perceived threats from feminism, or are you just trolling for triggers? Or is this one of those things where a bunch of guys are out of earshot of their wives, and it becomes fashionable to make negative generalizations about women, because you're in a safe zone?
Quote from: SGOS on June 07, 2018, 08:25:15 AM
I see feminism as an issue with pros and cons and elements that can be intelligently discussed, but you guys (I'm talking about the tone of several recent threads, not anyone in particular) are embarrassing me by sounding like a bunch of women hating cranks that still haven't gotten over a bad relationship, or got dumped one too many times. Feminism hasn't been a big debate since the 70s. It's seldom that I feel embarrassed by the behavior of others. Hell, I'm not even embarrassed by the behavior of crazy right wing extremists, but are you guys actually serious about the perceived threats from feminism, or are you just trolling for triggers? Or is this one of those things where a bunch of guys are out of earshot of their wives, and it becomes fashionable to make negative generalizations about women, because you're in a safe zone?
There is trolling on this issue, and on Islam. In my case I am pro-woman in spite of long actual experience. And pro-individual woman as well. But there are larger issues at stake, social, cultural and political. On the political end, it means that people will die if things are pushed too far.
That isn't to say I haven't had problems with men at work or outside of work ... but since there is no "male-ism" movement to attach political opportunism to, it isn't an issue. I don't expect anyone to behave themselves against any standard at all.
Being progressive isn't pro-gay or pro-woman .. it is being a psycho French revolutionary.
Here is the problem with equality vs egality ...
“Human beings are born with different capacities. If they are free, they are not equal. And if they are equal, they are not free.†- Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn
Egality means we accept that people are different, and with freedom, the outcome will be unequal, but fair. Unfairness consists of preventing freedom. And psychosis is ignoring that people are different. Forced equality is Procrustean ... a mythological motel terrorist from ancient Greece.
Quote from: SGOS on June 07, 2018, 08:25:15 AM
I see feminism as an issue with pros and cons and elements that can be intelligently discussed, but you guys (I'm talking about the tone of several recent threads, not anyone in particular) are embarrassing me by sounding like a bunch of women hating cranks that still haven't gotten over a bad relationship, or got dumped one too many times. Feminism hasn't been a big debate since the 70s. It's seldom that I feel embarrassed by the behavior of others. Hell, I'm not even embarrassed by the behavior of crazy right wing extremists, but are you guys actually serious about the perceived threats from feminism, or are you just trolling for triggers? Or is this one of those things where a bunch of guys are out of earshot of their wives, and it becomes fashionable to make negative generalizations about women, because you're in a safe zone?
So you deny everything that is wrong with Feminism because it hurts your feelings to the point of calling men who oppose the negative crybaby Femanazi Bullshit that is wrecking our world? I think so. I think Baruch and pr are for equality just not hypocritical shit that is constantly shoved down peoples throats.
Also attacking someone elses lives with women is very childish.
Quote from: Draconic Aiur on June 07, 2018, 07:12:42 PM
So you deny everything that is wrong with Feminism because it hurts your feelings to the point of calling men who oppose the negative crybaby Femanazi Bullshit that is wrecking our world? I think so. I think Baruch and pr are for equality just not hypocritical shit that is constantly shoved down peoples throats.
Also attacking someone elses lives with women is very childish.
I know I am. The problem with equality is people forget what the term actually means, equal, as in balanced, on the same level. You try that with some people and their start forming the opinions of 'well my group have been oppressed for years so we should come out on top now!".
That isn't equality.
I'm also never going to say we should make exceptions for people that goes against a societal standard
Quote from: SGOS on June 07, 2018, 08:25:15 AM
I see feminism as an issue with pros and cons and elements that can be intelligently discussed, but you guys (I'm talking about the tone of several recent threads, not anyone in particular) are embarrassing me by sounding like a bunch of women hating cranks that still haven't gotten over a bad relationship, or got dumped one too many times. Feminism hasn't been a big debate since the 70s. It's seldom that I feel embarrassed by the behavior of others. Hell, I'm not even embarrassed by the behavior of crazy right wing extremists, but are you guys actually serious about the perceived threats from feminism, or are you just trolling for triggers? Or is this one of those things where a bunch of guys are out of earshot of their wives, and it becomes fashionable to make negative generalizations about women, because you're in a safe zone?
Name an issue in particular, fucko.
Quote from: pr126 on June 07, 2018, 03:04:24 AM
Thank you, Karl Marx, and progressives.
Why is western culture so hellbent to self destruct?
Do you see other cultures doing the same?
Cultural revolution or (assisted) cultural suicide?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r_8hLQmfudM
I have to say that, objectively, that 2nd picture is just plain ugly. I don't mean that people can't decorate themselves as they want, but other people also get to decide how they think about it.
Quote from: Draconic Aiur on June 07, 2018, 07:12:42 PM
So you deny everything that is wrong with Feminism because it hurts your feelings to the point of calling men who oppose the negative crybaby Femanazi Bullshit that is wrecking our world? I think so. I think Baruch and pr are for equality just not hypocritical shit that is constantly shoved down peoples throats.
Also attacking someone elses lives with women is very childish.
Women have had unhappy relationships with other women, it isn't just the experience of men. But egality, not equality. Fairness that isn't Marxist. Even in the French motto, it is Egalite, not Equalite. Synonym choice matters. It that utopia? No, it is not. Marxists are the utopians.
There is a cure for third wave feminism.
Their activism about the unbearable rape culture, toxic masculinity, patriarchy, male privilege (white males only of course), women's rights, equality, pay-gap, institutionalized and systemic male oppression, misogyny, sexism, etc.
Here is the cure:
Spend a year in any of the 57 Islam dominated countries.
Or any central/Latin America countries.
Anywhere in Africa. Indonesia, Phillipines, India.
Or the Asian countries.
Then compare their experiences to western culture.
I wonder what feminist think now in Northern and Western Europe with all the multicultural enrichments that are part of the daily life for the foreseeable future.
They don't have to travel anywhere. It comes to them.
Quote from: pr126 on June 08, 2018, 01:34:36 AM
There is a cure for third wave feminism.
Their activism about the unbearable rape culture, toxic masculinity, patriarchy, male privilege (white males only of course), women's rights, equality, pay-gap, institutionalized and systemic male oppression, misogyny, sexism, etc.
Here is the cure:
Spend a year in any of the 57 Islam dominated countries.
Or any central/Latin America countries.
Anywhere in Africa. Indonesia, Phillipines, India.
Or the Asian countries.
Then compare their experiences to western culture.
I wonder what feminist think now in Northern and Western Europe with all the multicultural enrichments that are part of the daily life for the foreseeable future.
They don't have to travel anywhere. It comes to them.
So you are saying that being in a terrible society justifies slightly less-bad ones?
Quote from: Cavebear on June 08, 2018, 02:49:46 AM
So you are saying that being in a terrible society justifies slightly less-bad ones?
What I find interesting is that feminist completely ignoring how women are treated in the rest of the world.
Why is that? Why do they find the hijab liberating?
Do women in America have less rights than the men?
QuoteWhat I find interesting is that feminist completely ignoring how women are treated in the rest of the world.
We don't.
QuoteDo women in America have less rights than the men?
In many states, yes; either through legislation or through cultural norms.
Shiranu wrote:QuoteWe don't.
When? How?
By putting on hijabs in solidarity and screaming Allahu Akbar?
https://youtu.be/sREyrKc7EiQ?t=615
So what are feminist doing about Muslim women whom can be beaten (Q4:34) raped, honor killed, subjected to FGM, have to be permanently covered up (beaten, arrested, imprisoned if they don't|), polygamy, abuse, prevented from education (Afghanistan) gender apartheid, treated as a house slave?
Anything? Nothing?
Well, they put on hijabs in solidarity. Isn't that enough?
QuoteIn many states, yes; either through legislation or through cultural norms.
Could you be more specific? What cultural norms?
What legislation?
Is it enacted upon at the present or just a useless law on paper dating back to hundreds of years?
Quote from: Draconic Aiur on June 07, 2018, 07:12:42 PM
So you deny everything that is wrong with Feminism because it hurts your feelings to the point of calling men who oppose the negative crybaby Femanazi Bullshit that is wrecking our world?
If you read carefully, you will note that I never said that. I said, "I see feminism as an issue with pros and cons and elements that can be intelligently discussed." PROS and CONS. This means I see negatives as well as positives.
Quote from: Gilgamesh on June 07, 2018, 10:01:15 PM
Name an issue in particular, fucko.
Fucko?? Sheesh! Now there's the makings of an intelligent discussion.
Quote from: pr126 on June 08, 2018, 04:05:14 AM
What I find interesting is that feminist completely ignoring how women are treated in the rest of the world.
Why is that? Why do they find the hijab liberating?
Do women in America have less rights than the men?
Does the fact that women have lesser rights in some parts of the world justify lesser rights in others?
Quote from: Cavebear on June 08, 2018, 05:34:37 AM
Does the fact that women have lesser rights in some parts of the world justify lesser rights in others?
No, but but they way they act does. Their fan club sucks.
Quote from: SGOS on June 08, 2018, 05:21:04 AM
Fucko?? Sheesh! Now there's the makings of an intelligent discussion.
I'm not certain but it might have been "Or is this one of those things where a bunch of guys are out of earshot of their wives, and it becomes fashionable to make negative generalizations about women, because you're in a safe zone".
I thought this whole anti feminism thing was just trolling to trigger SJWs. But I haven't had a feminist in my face since somewhere in the 1970s, so to me this all seems to be a slight over-reaction to the issue. It's possible that I misperceived; I don't think these current threads are the playful baiting that I did at first. Some of you have already been triggered and are sincerely angry, but I'm not sure who triggered you, certainly not any of the women I hang with, as the matter never even comes up.
Quote from: Cavebear on June 08, 2018, 05:42:55 AM
I'm not certain but it might have been "Or is this one of those things where a bunch of guys are out of earshot of their wives, and it becomes fashionable to make negative generalizations about women, because you're in a safe zone".
That question was not designed to troll for a reaction. I asked because I've seen guys do this in groups. I'm talking about guys who love their wives, but still make odd generalizations about them. Hell, I've seen women make odd generalizations about men. So I asked because the whole anti-feminism thing seems to me like it's partially fabricated to create an issue. I really had no idea that anti-feminism was a current global movement, or that men were so deeply bothered by it.
Quote from: Cavebear on June 08, 2018, 05:42:55 AM
I'm not certain but it might have been "Or is this one of those things where a bunch of guys are out of earshot of their wives, and it becomes fashionable to make negative generalizations about women, because you're in a safe zone".
or
"are embarrassing me by sounding like a bunch of women hating cranks that still haven't gotten over a bad relationship, or got dumped one too many times."
Quote from: SGOS on June 08, 2018, 05:46:40 AM
I thought this whole anti feminism thing was just trolling to trigger SJWs. But I haven't had a feminist in my face since somewhere in the 1970s, so to me this all seems to be a slight over-reaction to the issue. It's possible that I misperceived; I don't think these current threads are the playful baiting that I did at first. Some of you have already been triggered and are sincerely angry, but I'm not sure who triggered you, certainly not any of the women I hang with, as the matter never even comes up.
Troll? Trigger? More like conversation and giving the finger to a person that came out of nowhere and said some unintelligible shit based on false psychological pairings. Also please don't think that just because you haven't heard of modern feminism it doesn't exist, because it shows your ignorance.
Quote from: SGOS on June 08, 2018, 05:46:40 AM
I thought this whole anti feminism thing was just trolling to trigger SJWs. But I haven't had a feminist in my face since somewhere in the 1970s, so to me this all seems to be a slight over-reaction to the issue. It's possible that I misperceived; I don't think these current threads are the playful baiting that I did at first. Some of you have already been triggered and are sincerely angry, but I'm not sure who triggered you, certainly not any of the women I hang with, as the matter never even comes up.
I've never come face to face with a neo nazi or a white supremacist, but apparently they exist according to people on these threads
Quote from: Munch on June 08, 2018, 06:04:27 AM
I've never come face to face with a neo nazi or a white supremacist, but apparently they exist according to people on these threads
and the news, on on the internet, and in history. Am I the only only one that researches this shit?
Quote from: SGOS on June 08, 2018, 05:46:40 AM
I thought this whole anti feminism thing was just trolling to trigger SJWs. But I haven't had a feminist in my face since somewhere in the 1970s, so to me this all seems to be a slight over-reaction to the issue. It's possible that I misperceived; I don't think these current threads are the playful baiting that I did at first. Some of you have already been triggered and are sincerely angry, but I'm not sure who triggered you, certainly not any of the women I hang with, as the matter never even comes up.
I am not specifically involved with any political women's movement and I am not and never have been married, so I actually don't have a personal part in this.
But let me give you an example of my typical experience as a fellow male.
I was assigned a 4 week travel to Ft Worth TX to evaluate contract proposals with a guy from San Francisco and another from Washington DC, The other 2 guys were married. It took them only 2 days to find "temporary wives". For the 4 weeks. They cheated the instant they possibly could. And they were typical. And that guy from Washington DC was my supervisor. I detested him after that travel. He left the govt soon after, seeking fortune and fame in the commercial world.
Quote from: Cavebear on June 08, 2018, 05:34:37 AM
Does the fact that women have lesser rights in some parts of the world justify lesser rights in others?
I do believe that the feminists' grievances are baseless. It comes from Marxist indoctrination.
Here is why:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eYGNTJEtR_A&t=388s
Quote from: Munch on June 08, 2018, 06:04:27 AM
I've never come face to face with a neo nazi or a white supremacist, but apparently they exist according to people on these threads
Well, yes, they obviously exist.
Quote from: pr126 on June 08, 2018, 06:14:36 AM
I do believe that the feminists' grievances are baseless. It comes from Marxist indoctrination.
Here is why:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eYGNTJEtR_A&t=388s
As a fellow male, I HAVE to tell you that you must be either kidding or you are burning your stew at the bottom and can't tell...
Quote from: Munch on June 08, 2018, 06:04:27 AM
I've never come face to face with a neo nazi or a white supremacist, but apparently they exist according to people on these threads
They do, and I have no doubt that some women carry around some unattractive baggage too. I just don't tend to tie myself up in a knot over it, and I wouldn't hang out with that type if I actually met one. I just don't have the same anger about it. I was just surprised to learn that anti-feminism was a thing.
Quote from: Shiranu on June 08, 2018, 04:14:39 AM
We don't.
In many states, yes; either through legislation or through cultural norms.
Burn the culture down, achieve feral nihilism ;-) End all states, make the Federal Government into a tyranny. I particularly look forward to destroying California.
Quote from: Cavebear on June 08, 2018, 06:22:17 AM
As a fellow male, I HAVE to tell you that you must be either kidding or you are burning your stew at the bottom and can't tell...
Not kidding. I know what my problem is.
I am not infected with the Karl Marx virus.
Many here are.
The media and the academia worked very hard for a century to infect you all.
Quote from: Cavebear on June 08, 2018, 05:42:55 AM
I'm not certain but it might have been "Or is this one of those things where a bunch of guys are out of earshot of their wives, and it becomes fashionable to make negative generalizations about women, because you're in a safe zone".
Men have no safe zone (it used to be the work place). White people have no cry closet ;-) Men have been doing this since they congregated at the whine bar in ancient Rome. Men and women bitch differently. If you don't like the negative generalizations (and yes they are unfair) then voice your idealism all you want to. Nobody is listening to virtue signaling. Maybe there is a heaven, where everything is just perfect, per John Lennon. But not for atheists, sorry. You feed worms same as the Popes.
Quote from: Cavebear on June 08, 2018, 06:16:32 AM
Well, yes, they obviously exist.
White supremacists are waiting for the opportunity for a reverse General Sherman, burning everything down in a march across New England ;-(
Quote from: SGOS on June 08, 2018, 05:56:24 AM
That question was not designed to troll for a reaction. I asked because I've seen guys do this in groups. I'm talking about guys who love their wives, but still make odd generalizations about them. Hell, I've seen women make odd generalizations about men. So I asked because the whole anti-feminism thing seems to me like it's partially fabricated to create an issue. I really had no idea that anti-feminism was a current global movement, or that men were so deeply bothered by it.
Anyone wronged by these paragons of false virtue, women ... probably have no further love for them (aside from puerile sex). I am not one of those ... I have been wronged, by individuals who happen to be women, and wronged by individuals who happen to be men. But some Western men have gone jihadi. Those men in non-Western countries have never been liberated, and have no intention of being so.
Quote from: Munch on June 08, 2018, 06:04:27 AM
I've never come face to face with a neo nazi or a white supremacist, but apparently they exist according to people on these threads
If you aren't cross-dressing and planning the operation you are a misogynist. If you aren't going Dolezal and presenting as a different race, you are racist.
I am glad you have never met a neo-nazi or a white supremacist .. nasty blokes.
Quote from: pr126 on June 08, 2018, 06:43:06 AM
Not kidding. I know what my problem is.
I am not infected with the Karl Marx virus.
Many here are.
And neither am I. That's probably what confuses you about me. And your assumption that all us atheists are communists is just SO SO wrOng. (That was deliberate). I'm no more a communist than you are. Actually, as a "Nationalist Socialist" you are closer to be a COMMIE than I am, LOL!
I like the idea of feeding kids in failed households. For the kids's sakes. I like the idea that those kids should have a chance to grow up in normal apartments if not houses. I grew up in apartments and houses and it worked out pretty well. I like the idea of educating children to their full potential. Why wouldn't anyone?
So WHY do you have a problem with that?
Quote from: Cavebear on June 08, 2018, 06:12:43 AM
I am not specifically involved with any political women's movement and I am not and never have been married, so I actually don't have a personal part in this.
But let me give you an example of my typical experience as a fellow male.
I was assigned a 4 week travel to Ft Worth TX to evaluate contract proposals with a guy from San Francisco and another from Washington DC, The other 2 guys were married. It took them only 2 days to find "temporary wives". For the 4 weeks. They cheated the instant they possibly could. And they were typical. And that guy from Washington DC was my supervisor. I detested him after that travel. He left the govt soon after, seeking fortune and fame in the commercial world.
Not been on many business trips, but nobody was ever so bold as to admit such things. Totally unforgivable, hope their wives took them for everything. On the other hand, this is why you don't take your secretary with you on trips (only executives could) ... probably banging her every day anyway, if you are Bill Clinton. You don't need a sex parter to get off, even if you can't get any sex at home either.
Quote from: pr126 on June 08, 2018, 06:43:06 AM
Not kidding. I know what my problem is.
I am not infected with the Karl Marx virus.
Many here are.
The media and the academia worked very hard for a century to infect you all.
Longer, since the French Revolution. Where is the Scarlet Pimpernel when you need him?
Quote from: Cavebear on June 08, 2018, 06:57:43 AM
And neither am I. That's probably what confuses you about me. And your assumption that all us atheists are communists is just SO SO wrOng. (That was deliberate). I'm no more a communist than you are. Actually, as a "Nationalist Socialist" you are closer to be a COMMIE than I am, LOL!
I like the idea of feeding kids in failed households. For the kids's sakes. I like the idea that those kids should have a chance to grow up in normal apartments if not houses. I grew up in apartments and houses and it worked out pretty well. I like the idea of educating children to their full potential. Why wouldn't anyone?
So WHY do you have a problem with that?
Marxism isn't about the poor, the poor are just the excuse for political jihadis to achieve power.
I did not say, communist.
The Karl Marx ideology is morphed into cultural Marxism, (Critical Theory) when the class warfare did not work out after WWI.
A new approach was designed, to attack the culture, eliminate the family, religion (Christianity in particular) not Islam which is used now to accelerate the process of destabilization of western society by the influx of millions of hostile unassimilable migrants.
See Frankfurt School, Fabian Society, Common Purpose.
BTW, National Socialists aka Nazis (Hitler & Co.) are on the left. I don't subscribe to that group.
Is your second paragraph a non sequitur? It doesn't seem to belong to this subject.
Anyway, I do not have a problem with that.
Quote from: Cavebear on June 08, 2018, 06:12:43 AM
I am not specifically involved with any political women's movement and I am not and never have been married, so I actually don't have a personal part in this.
But let me give you an example of my typical experience as a fellow male.
I was assigned a 4 week travel to Ft Worth TX to evaluate contract proposals with a guy from San Francisco and another from Washington DC, The other 2 guys were married. It took them only 2 days to find "temporary wives". For the 4 weeks. They cheated the instant they possibly could. And they were typical. And that guy from Washington DC was my supervisor. I detested him after that travel. He left the govt soon after, seeking fortune and fame in the commercial world.
I have to draw upon my experience from the 1970s to respond to this, and even then I don't know if it's appropriate because I'm not sure where you were going with this story. I met a feminist woman back then who was all about having sex with multiple partners, including the husbands of her friends (sisters as she called them). Her justification was that this was OK, because all men do it. The fact that she wrecked one friend's marriage was one negative outcome.
First, I don't care how many partners she takes on. If she wants to amass a record, then go for it, and I've known a few women like that. To each their own. But I think her reasoning was wrong. Not all men do that. More likely it was pure and simple lust on her part, but that requires no justification to me. We are all biological beings, but can still make choices.
As far as your colleague's behavior, I've heard that some people have agreed upon open marriages, but I doubt it's the norm, and I question how many marriages are actually that open. If they are, then I'm not going to worry about it.
But infidelity can do a lot of damage to yourself and others, including other people's marriages, and your own, and especially to the partner you have made a commitment to. And infidelity, whether by men or women, seems like a terribly selfish behavior, not withstanding the physical health risks to you, to others, and to the people you presumably love. It's not a very nice way to treat others.
Quote from: pr126 on June 08, 2018, 07:18:17 AM
I did not say, communist.
The Karl Marx ideology is morphed into cultural Marxism, (Critical Theory) when the class warfare did not work out after WWI.
A new approach was designed, to attack the culture, eliminate the family, religion (Christianity in particular) not Islam which is used now to accelerate the process of destabilization of western society by the influx of millions of hostile unassimilable migrants.
See Frankfurt School, Fabian Society, Common Purpose.
BTW, National Socialists aka Nazis (Hitler & Co.) are on the left. I don't subscribe to that group.
Is your second paragraph a non sequitur? It doesn't seem to belong to this subject.
Anyway, I do not have a problem with that.
Well, you have thrown around "communist" accusations at US democrats in the past. I was being cautious about that.
But you certainly ARE extremely conservative, almost Nazi-like. But that may be a religious conservatism. Tell me I'm wrong.
Quote from: Cavebear on June 08, 2018, 07:30:12 AM
Well, you have thrown around "communist" accusations at US democrats in the past. I was being cautious about that.
But you certainly ARE extremely conservative, almost Nazi-like. But that may be a religious conservatism. Tell me I'm wrong.
That was me ... yes, all D's since the 60s are communists ... and worse ... Umpa-loompas.
But Marxist is the current 'go to' term.
QuoteBut you certainly ARE extremely conservative, almost Nazi-like. But that may be a religious conservatism. Tell me I'm wrong.
Wrong.
Not at all religious conservatism, I was, I am, and will be an atheist.
A total disbelief in the supernatural.
All gods and all religions are man-made purely for control of the masses.
All prophets ever existed were mentally unbalanced, or fakes.
Edit: some who left religion has taken their politics as a religion, with the same fervor as a fundamentalist.
I'll thank you not to label me as a Nazi.
Quote from: pr126 on June 08, 2018, 07:43:24 AM
Wrong.
Not at all religious conservatism, I was, I am, and will be an atheist.
A total disbelief in the supernatural.
All gods and all religions are man-made purely for control of the masses.
All prophets ever existed were mentally unbalanced, or fakes.
Edit: some who left religion has taken their politics as a religion, with the same fervor as a fundamentalist.
I'll thank you not to label me as a Nazi.
You never fail to surprize me. Are you unaware that you use to espouse nazi-istic ideas?
But I will stay aware of your current views. BTW, what are they?
Saying one supports equality is admirable but it doesn't really address the praises and criticisms of feminism, which involve not only the legal rights of women but gender norms and how men and women interact with one another. For example, the message I get from the OP video is mainly a criticism that feminism influences women to abandon traditional norms of female beauty and adopt an attitude that is antagonistic to men. Discussion of "feminism" is difficult because there is no widely accepted concept of what feminism entails and people often end up talking past one another. I prefer when it is broken down into something more manageable, like gender wage gap or gender roles in parenting.
Quote from: Cavebear on June 08, 2018, 07:30:12 AM
Well, you have thrown around "communist" accusations at US democrats in the past. I was being cautious about that.
But you certainly ARE extremely conservative, almost Nazi-like. But that may be a religious conservatism. Tell me I'm wrong.
(https://i.imgur.com/Ras9nCt.gif)
Quote from: Shiranu on June 08, 2018, 04:14:39 AM
We don't.
In many states, yes; either through legislation or through cultural norms.
What legal rights do men have that women don't.
Honestly if in 2018 you identify as a feminist you should be shot.
In every single first world nation on earth women have more legal rights than men.
>Women have the right to genital integrity. Men still get parts of their dick chopped off when they're infants and it's perfectly legal.
>Men are required in by law in the US to sign up for the draft to have access to all the legal rights owed to them as adults.
>In the US, the UK, and elsewhere, the 'duluth model' is used to determine rape and sexual assault - this model literally does not recognise that males can be raped; only that they can rape. Women have the right to be recognised by the state to have actually been raped when they're raped - men don;'t
>The violence against women act In the US is specifically anti-male, reducing the standard of proof, and providing measures and services only for female victims. Consequences for domestic violence often require enrolment in sexist programs that use models of domestic violence such as the Duluth Model, which are distinctly anti-male.
These are all objective, systemic, LEGAL RIGHTS that women have and men don't.
Now, I could get into the absolutely biased-as-fuck court system but for now we'll stick to the objectively observable shit.
Cavebear wrote:QuoteBut you certainly ARE extremely conservative, almost Nazi-like. But that may be a religious conservatism. Tell me I'm wrong.
Nazis were not conservatives.
Here is a clue: National Socialist (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nazism)
QuoteNational Socialism (German: Nationalsozialismus), more commonly known as Nazism (/ˈnÉ'Ëtsi.ɪzÉ™m, ˈnæt-/), is the ideology and practices associated with the Nazi Party â€" officially the National Socialist German Workers' Party
Which is on the left of the political spectrum, not the "far right" as the common belief today.
Quote from: Cavebear on June 08, 2018, 08:16:15 AM
You never fail to surprize me. Are you unaware that you use to espouse nazi-istic ideas?
But I will stay aware of your current views. BTW, what are they?
Nazis ate food ... so is eating, Nazi? You espouse Stalinist ideas? Maybe not. But with -ist ... you can label anything as anything.
Quote from: Gilgamesh on June 08, 2018, 11:55:28 AM
Honestly if in 2018 you identify as a feminist you should be shot.
LOL
Quote from: Baruch on June 08, 2018, 12:54:23 PM
Nazis ate food ... so is eating, Nazi? You espouse Stalinist ideas? Maybe not. But with -ist ... you can label anything as anything.
The meaning of Nazi is starting to lose its meaning. All presidents are labeled Nazi by the opposition at one time or another. It's starting to mean someone you hate. But it's been a while since we've had an actual Nazi in the White House. Losers, yes. Criminals, sure. Corporate Puppets, of course, but not an actual Nazi.
Quote from: Gilgamesh on June 08, 2018, 11:53:52 AM
What legal rights do men have that women don't.
Only one class of right in the US that I know of ...
It is legal, in private clubs, including country clubs, to exclude people for any reason. This includes being a woman, a Black or a Jew (see country clubs). But that is only in so far as they are private ... if they offer public accommodation, they aren't private ... they are subject to discrimination laws.
But that isn't a good example ... technically, private clubs for women can exclude men too. So yes, basically women have it all in the US, as far as rights
Men do not have a right to a job, to a free lunch, to dates with either sex ... and neither do women. Men do not have a right to equal pay, and neither do women ... So again, they are men's equal ... given that the US isn't socialist. In so far as the government has attempted to promote equality (not egality) then yes, we aren't full communist yet ... and never can be. The French Revolution was a temporary aberration.
Quote from: SGOS on June 08, 2018, 01:33:23 PM
The meaning of Nazi is starting to lose its meaning. All presidents are labeled Nazi by the opposition at one time or another. It's starting to mean someone you hate. But it's been a while since we've had an actual Nazi in the White House. Losers, yes. Criminals, sure. Corporate Puppets, of course, but not an actual Nazi.
Yes, political labels are false, including communist. Yes, George Washington was our first Nazi President ... he was a White male. All White male Presidents are the same, they are Nazis. But that is OK, everyone thought that FDR was a communist, because he didn't hate Stalin enough, and hated Hitler more .. but American Nazis were the one's who thought that, the same ones who tried to assassinate FDR, and had a coup foiled by General Butler.
https://www.history.com/this-day-in-history/fdr-escapes-assassination-in-miami
That went down the memory hole like so much else ...
Gen Smedley Butler broke up a planned coup against FDR in 1933 ...
https://www.history.com/videos/general-butler-on-war
The original American Feminist wasn't Marxist, she was Roosevelt ...
https://www.history.com/topics/first-ladies/eleanor-roosevelt
She chaired the committee for the Universal Declaration of Human Rights for the UN.
But the Feminism that Pr126 talks about ...
https://aeon.co/essays/the-shining-moment-when-russian-revolutionary-women-reinvented-sex
Came directly from the Soviet Union, in 1920. Not that Ms Margaret Sanger in the US wasn't equally Leftist and racist in that same generation.
Quote from: pr126 on June 08, 2018, 12:17:17 PM
Cavebear wrote:
Nazis were not conservatives.
Here is a clue: National Socialist (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nazism)Which is on the left of the political spectrum, not the "far right" as the common belief today.
National Socialism (Nazism) exhibited most forms of authoritarianism usually considered "rightist" in political theory, but there are conflicting views of it. Some view it as a form of Marxism, though Marxism was essentially international (non-national) in scope. German socialism did have the "sharing principles, though it was mostly "taking" by the State. I think overall, Nazism has to be considered a Nationalist and Conservative movement (harking back to a great past) which a typical conservative view. Communists generally look forward to a change in the future diminishing the past.
I think both ideas are failures (and history suggests that). I suspect that a general social democracy is probably the wave of the next few centuries in order for societies to deal with changes most efficiently to balance "general welfare of the whole" with technological advancement. And some new idea will develop after that.