O, frabjous day. Put September 23 on your calendars, some moron has decided that the end of the world is nigh (https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/acts-of-faith/wp/2017/09/17/the-world-as-we-know-it-is-about-to-end-again-if-you-believe-this-biblical-doomsday-claim/?tid=hybrid_experimentrandom_2_na):
Quote from: The Washington Post
But the theory has been getting renewed attention recently. Added to it is the precise date of the astronomical event leading to Earth’s destruction. And that, according to David Meade, is in six days â€" Sept. 23, 2017. Unsealed, an evangelical Christian publication, foretells the Rapture in a viral, four-minute YouTube video, complete with special effects and ominous doomsday soundtrack. It’s called “September 23, 2017: You Need to See This.â€
Why Sept. 23, 2017?
Meade’s prediction is based largely on verses and numerical codes in the Bible. He’s honed in one number: 33.
“Jesus lived for 33 years. The name Elohim, which is the name of God to the Jews, was mentioned 33 times [in the Bible],†Meade told The Washington Post. “It’s a very biblically significant, numerologically significant number. I’m talking astronomy. I’m talking the Bible … and merging the two.â€
Robert Schumann, in reviewing Frédéric Chopin's Variations on "Là i darem la mano" by Mozart, wrote "Hats off, gentlemen, a genius."
Well, hats back on, gentlemen (and ladies, and anyone else not otherwise included), an idiot.
I been seeing those videos on youtube since March. oddly enough they were saying last year the end of the world was gonna be Sept 23, 2016.
If the world ends on Sept 23, 2017, the culprit will probably be Trump not your guy.... Better wait until late in the day. I wouldn't was to miss the MCAS Miramar air show for the end of the world
End of the world? Oh, shit. I hate it when that happens. The 23rd is not a good day for me. I've got to get my firewood in and clean out the garage.
The Millerites come again--and again--and again. At least all of these 1000's of predictions do have one thing in common--they are all wrong.
Nothing biblical can last since it is all fictional.
Why do Christians keep predicting the end of the world when Jesus specifically said that no one would know the day or the hour of his return, that he'd be like a thief in the night? That doesn't leave much room for interpetation.
Quote from: Mike Cl on September 18, 2017, 09:27:58 AM
The Millerites come again--and again--and again. At least all of these 1000's of predictions do have one thing in common--they are all wrong.
Nothing biblical can last since it is all fictional.
A broken clock is right twice a day. Disaster prediction is probably right once a decade. Apocalypse prediction .. so far .. nada.
Quote from: Baruch on September 18, 2017, 12:44:52 PM
A broken clock is right twice a day. Disaster prediction is probably right once a decade. Apocalypse prediction .. so far .. nada.
So far end of the world, or any other kind, of religious predictions are not up to the broken clock standard. Not by a long shot. Never right is 0%. But then their source material is faulty so that stands to reason. Oooops! Bad word--reason.
Yeah, but just because they've been wrong all those other times doesn't mean they'll be wrong this time.
I mean, just look how beautiful it'll be:
(http://king-of-the.net/images/rapture.jpg)
(http://img.elephantjournal.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/05/Screen-shot-2011-05-20-at-4.00.19-PM.png)
Quote from: Blackleaf on September 18, 2017, 09:38:19 AM
Why do Christians keep predicting the end of the world when Jesus specifically said that no one would know the day or the hour of his return, that he'd be like a thief in the night? That doesn't leave much room for interpetation.
I predict tomorrow will be the end of the world. Since the prediction has been made, it can't happen tomorrow.
Tomorrow, I will make the same prediction.
Repeat
ad infinitum. Logically, no end of the world ever. :)
Quote from: trdsf on September 18, 2017, 04:34:08 PM
I predict tomorrow will be the end of the world. Since the prediction has been made, it can't happen tomorrow.
Tomorrow, I will make the same prediction.
Repeat ad infinitum. Logically, no end of the world ever. :)
Well, at least as long as you live to keep predicting, anyway.
Apocalypse won't be pretty ... no rapture, and nobody to bury all those dead bodies ;-(
Jeremiah 25:33:
QuoteAnd the slain of the Lord shall be at that day from one end of the earth even unto the other end of the earth: they shall not be lamented, neither gathered, nor buried; they shall be dung upon the ground.
Quote from: Unbeliever on September 18, 2017, 06:38:31 PM
Jeremiah 25:33:
Reincarnated as cow patties in India ... sacred dung, but useful for making holy fires in poor villages Unbeliever sahib.
Obligatory:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f9KlMWzKj4s
How embarrassing will that be .. you get to Heaven, and find that the Jews (at least 144,000 Jewish martyrs) will proceed you?
Quote from: Baruch on September 18, 2017, 12:44:52 PM
A broken clock is right twice a day. Disaster prediction is probably right once a decade. Apocalypse prediction .. so far .. nada.
How has it been right "once a decade"? Unless you are picking and choosing your disasters, the minor ones are completely random and The Big One hasn't happened. Your broken clock isn't even right about THAT.
Which, though merely a jest to seem intelligent, is well known to most of us and dismissed as the argument of a simple jester.
Quote from: Cavebear on September 19, 2017, 02:04:58 AM
How has it been right "once a decade"? Unless you are picking and choosing your disasters, the minor ones are completely random and The Big One hasn't happened. Your broken clock isn't even right about THAT.
Which, though merely a jest to seem intelligent, is well known to most of us and dismissed as the argument of a simple jester.
We have global warming, we have active volcanoes (not just potential ones like Yellowstone), we have hurricanes. They are fairly predictable, and do happen, even if we are in denial. Of course they aren't extinction events, and are completely natural.
Quote from: Baruch on September 19, 2017, 12:58:54 PM
We have global warming, we have active volcanoes (not just potential ones like Yellowstone), we have hurricanes. They are fairly predictable, and do happen, even if we are in denial. Of course they aren't extinction events, and are completely natural.
It is the "predictable" that is under question...
Quote from: Cavebear on September 19, 2017, 02:46:19 PM
It is the "predictable" that is under question...
It is wise to not predict the future, but most are fools. Simple physics setups where QM isn't involved, are toy problems, and those are predictable (predictably).
Quote from: Baruch on September 18, 2017, 09:40:54 PM
How embarrassing will that be .. you get to Heaven, and find that the Jews (at least 144,000 Jewish martyrs) will proceed you?
Which would be worse, Jews or Jehovah's Witnesses?
Quote from: Unbeliever on September 22, 2017, 01:24:37 PM
Which would be worse, Jews or Jehovah's Witnesses?
See, that is where the JW heresy went wrong. They said that all of their people would be in the 144,000 ... though they are not Jews. And over time, they have had more than 144,000 members ... so they are like a credit card that has become overdrawn ... and past due.
I wonder if they know that?
Quote from: Unbeliever on September 22, 2017, 10:50:28 PM
I wonder if they know that?
I have heard they have done the usual theological Gordian knot tying ... so that nobody gets the joke. The taboo prevents anyone cutting the knot, until a demigod like Alexander comes along.
Quote from: Baruch on September 19, 2017, 09:34:47 PM
It is wise to not predict the future, but most are fools. Simple physics setups where QM isn't involved, are toy problems, and those are predictable (predictably).
Since volcano eruptions and earthquakes are not very predictable, you are suggesting that events not caused by quantum mechanics are predictable. Therefore volcanoes and earthquakes are caused by quantum mechanics?
Quote from: Cavebear on September 23, 2017, 01:40:34 AM
Since volcano eruptions and earthquakes are not very predictable, you are suggesting that events not caused by quantum mechanics are predictable. Therefore volcanoes and earthquakes are caused by quantum mechanics?
QM says ... microscopic event (not macroscopic event usually) will happen X percent of the time, and the other alternatives will happen their own Y percent of the time, and the total adds to 100%. That isn't what people mean by predictability, they were spoiled by the Newtonian model.
Macroscopic events are mostly turbulence aka classical chaos. Chaos isn't a part of QM (I am stating a fact) ... but reductionists have to claim (not prove) that chaos and non-chaos are reducible o QM, and QM is reducible to String Theory, an String Theory is reducible to ... turtles all the way down.
Quote from: Baruch on September 22, 2017, 11:52:00 PM
I have heard they have done the usual theological Gordian knot tying ... so that nobody gets the joke. The taboo prevents anyone cutting the knot, until a demigod like Alexander comes along.
I thought you said that
everyone is a demi-god - or is it just famous people like Alexander?
Quote from: Unbeliever on September 24, 2017, 11:02:05 AM
I thought you said that everyone is a demi-god - or is it just famous people like Alexander?
You are the first person to take my statement as non-sarcasm, and make an intelligent question! Are you the real Unbeliever? ;-)
I study humanity, anthropology, comparative religion thru place and time. I get into people's head space, living or dead. Monotheism arises from paganism, so does atheism (all secularism). Monotheism (to atheists) is a way station on the path from many gods to no gods (full secularism). However I don't believe in Aristotelian teleology; human life and breakdown of tradition is too great, each generation nearly starts from scratch. I see all theism as personalism ... and monotheism as fundamentalist paganism. Jews, Christians and Muslims are far into the fundie spectrum compared to pagans. That doesn't mean that pagans are necessarily tolerant, they are simply more complex (see modern Sri Lanka ... Buddhist fundies). To me, secularism is impersonalism. A few Hindus and Buddhists are impersonalists ... but they are LARPing secularists. Most Hindus and Buddhists are theistic.
In Greco-Roman culture, there was a continuum from simple peasant to Zeus on Olympus. Divinity wasn't either/or, but either/and. Since proclaiming one's divinity was a dangerous political statement, usually this was confined to prominent living people (Alexander or the Emperor Augustus) or recently living prominent people (Julius Caesar). But this was political, that wasn't the underlying pagan thinking. But it was articulated, by the rich and powerful, mythologically.
So Alexander's real father was Zeus (as propaganda). Julius Caesar was descended from Venus (as propaganda). When Emperor Augustus made his great-uncle Julius Caesar an official god, given that he was the adopted son of Julius Caesar (his heir) ... that made him the son of a god, same as Hercules or Alexander (and hence the subversive propaganda of the Christians). Of course in old mythology, there were plenty of people who aren't historical at all, but who are descended from gods (Theseus from Poseidon). A continuity of myth, legend, history ... aka propaganda.
As a democratic person, I see people as equal, even if they don't see it that way. So if anyone is a demigod, then we all are. I do assert that I am a demigod (even if I am not totally fictional or legendary, mostly history) and even if I am not rich, powerful or famous. Therefore everyone is a demigod, including Emperor Augustus. Now one of the titles of the Emperor, borrowed from the Cleopatra and her ancestors, who borrowed it from Alexander, is "savior". Thus a historical Jesus (not so but ...) would be a demigod, a son of gods (Joseph and Mary) and implicitly a king (hence the objection of the authorities). Every Jewish person is a son/daughter of gods, even every Gentile. I can't restrict this to monarchs of Egypt or Emperors of Rome.
You see this on money. Originally only totems were put on the design (lions for instance). Then gods were put on the design (they were a bit totemic). Also the Shah of Persia put himself on the coin designs (darics and sigloi). Sometimes even a megalomanaic satrap would put his image on a coin (that was subversive). Eventually with the Macedonians, starting with Phillip, father of Alexander ... Greeks put their face on the coins. From there it became general ... and when the Persians freed themselves from the Greeks, they did the same universally, the Shah's face on the coin. Originally of course the Romans didn't do this. Initially they only put on totems, then they put on gods. Eventually they started putting on legendary or historical ancestors. Starting in the late Republic however, with all the civil wars, they started putting their living faces on the coins; Pompey, Caesar, Anthony, Octavian in particular. These were all war-lords ... and understood the importance of political divinity in the East (even if this wasn't the norm in the West yet). This continued for the rest of the Roman period.
George Washington understood all this, and having King George on English coins. He would be horrified at the dollar bill or the quarter coin. This idolatry of presidents started with Lincoln (in his own lifetime, there was a fractional paper note with him on it, while he was still alive, and other living people). Washington and others were already on the stamps. With the 100 anniversary of the birth of Lincoln, the Lincoln cent was going to be a commemorative for a single year. But it proved so popular, it continues over 100 years later. Pretty soon we had the Jefferson nickel, the Washington quarter, the Roosevelt dime, the Kennedy half dollar etc. We are pretty imperial, and pretty Roman now. The Presidential dollar commemorative series has made this fair to all the nonliving Presidents. Living Presidents are not eligible. So we haven't gone fully Alexander. But I can easily foresee Trump changing that! We will finally have an elected king in the US. Huzzah!
Worst apocalypse ever.
Quote from: Hydra009 on September 24, 2017, 09:01:28 PM
Worst apocalypse ever.
You know, even though I was the OP, I completely forgot about it yesterday. But then, my asshole roommate moved out yesterday (without warning, which figures), so I was imbibing in many manhattans in celebration. :D
Quote from: trdsf on September 25, 2017, 12:12:52 AM
You know, even though I was the OP, I completely forgot about it yesterday. But then, my asshole roommate moved out yesterday (without warning, which figures), so I was imbibing in many manhattans in celebration. :D
Good luck finding a better roommate. Meanwhile, goodbye to bad rubbish?
Quote from: Baruch on September 25, 2017, 12:16:20 AM
Good luck finding a better roommate. Meanwhile, goodbye to bad rubbish?
I'm not even interested in another roommate right now. I can afford the place just fine on my own. There are only two people right now that I would be willing to consider as roommate material. One is my ex and one is an old friend from WAY back. Other than them, fuck it.
Quote from: trdsf on September 25, 2017, 12:12:52 AM
You know, even though I was the OP, I completely forgot about it yesterday. But then, my asshole roommate moved out yesterday (without warning, which figures), so I was imbibing in many manhattans in celebration. :D
Congrats on your new-found freedom and peace of mind!
You mean I survived the apocalypse, and didn't even get a stupid T-shirt?
Quote from: Unbeliever on September 25, 2017, 09:39:29 AM
You mean I survived the apocalypse, and didn't even get a stupid T-shirt?
All t-shirts come from China now, and you would be helping the enemy, if you bought one ;-)
China may be your enemy, but not mine - nor America's, as far as I know.
Quote from: Unbeliever on September 25, 2017, 04:04:37 PM
China may be your enemy, but not mine - nor America's, as far as I know.
Says the guy with the Karl Marx avatar ;-) Sure comrade, tell me a good joke like that, at the next Party Congress.
Quote from: Baruch on September 24, 2017, 01:08:15 PM
You are the first person to take my statement as non-sarcasm, and make an intelligent question! Are you the real Unbeliever? ;-)
I study humanity, anthropology, comparative religion thru place and time. I get into people's head space, living or dead. Monotheism arises from paganism, so does atheism (all secularism). Monotheism (to atheists) is a way station on the path from many gods to no gods (full secularism). However I don't believe in Aristotelian teleology; human life and breakdown of tradition is too great, each generation nearly starts from scratch. I see all theism as personalism ... and monotheism as fundamentalist paganism. Jews, Christians and Muslims are far into the fundie spectrum compared to pagans. That doesn't mean that pagans are necessarily tolerant, they are simply more complex (see modern Sri Lanka ... Buddhist fundies). To me, secularism is impersonalism. A few Hindus and Buddhists are impersonalists ... but they are LARPing secularists. Most Hindus and Buddhists are theistic.
In Greco-Roman culture, there was a continuum from simple peasant to Zeus on Olympus. Divinity wasn't either/or, but either/and. Since proclaiming one's divinity was a dangerous political statement, usually this was confined to prominent living people (Alexander or the Emperor Augustus) or recently living prominent people (Julius Caesar). But this was political, that wasn't the underlying pagan thinking. But it was articulated, by the rich and powerful, mythologically.
I'm impressed that you acknowledge the gradual religious steps from natural pantheism to multiple specific deities to monotheism. I didn't know you had it in you.
But you still fail to make the last logical step. That there can be one less deity than the popular current idea of ONE deity... Go for "none". You are almost there.
Take that last step and be free...
Quote from: Cavebear on September 28, 2017, 03:46:42 AM
I'm impressed that you acknowledge the gradual religious steps from natural pantheism to multiple specific deities to monotheism. I didn't know you had it in you.
But you still fail to make the last logical step. That there can be one less deity than the popular current idea of ONE deity... Go for "none". You are almost there.
Take that last step and be free...
Why be free? Free fall doesn't end so good ;-(
Quote from: Baruch on September 28, 2017, 07:06:06 PM
Why be free? Free fall doesn't end so good ;-(
The difference between "free" and "free fall" is the difference between "without cost" and "THUD".
Quote from: Cavebear on October 01, 2017, 06:02:12 AM
The difference between "free" and "free fall" is the difference between "without cost" and "THUD".
There is no free lunch .. it always ends in a THUD. I hope to die, before the present fantasy economy goes THUD.
Quote from: Baruch on October 01, 2017, 10:43:22 AM
There is no free lunch .. it always ends in a THUD. I hope to die, before the present fantasy economy goes THUD.
The eternal jester...
TANSTAAFL. But the THUD is entirely different, as you well know.
Quote from: Cavebear on October 01, 2017, 10:51:12 AM
The eternal jester...
TANSTAAFL. But the THUD is entirely different, as you well know.
THAD is entirely different, it is in S Korea, to prevent the NorKs from doing any THUDs. Tell me how you feel when all government pensions are cut to zero, as a way to pay for the tax cuts of the rich ;-(
Quote from: Baruch on October 01, 2017, 11:06:02 AM
THAD is entirely different, it is in S Korea, to prevent the NorKs from doing any THUDs. Tell me how you feel when all government pensions are cut to zero, as a way to pay for the tax cuts of the rich ;-(
That has nothing to do with anything, as so many of your posts also do not.
Quote from: Cavebear on October 01, 2017, 11:14:23 AM
That has nothing to do with anything, as so many of your posts also do not.
If it happens (nuke from NorK or killing pensions) you won't find it nothing ;-( Municipal pensions are nearing self destruction (see Dallas) in shades of Detroit past. How much longer until Federal pensions and SS are nuked? Stupid rabbit, tricks are for politicians working for plutocracy.
Quote from: Baruch on October 01, 2017, 01:41:38 PM
If it happens (nuke from NorK or killing pensions) you won't find it nothing ;-( Municipal pensions are nearing self destruction (see Dallas) in shades of Detroit past. How much longer until Federal pensions and SS are nuked? Stupid rabbit, tricks are for politicians working for plutocracy.
Related Nukes to pensions is meaningless.
Quote from: Cavebear on October 04, 2017, 03:04:21 AM
Related Nukes to pensions is meaningless.
Without a government pension, you will have to go on Obamacare ... bwahah!
Quote from: Baruch on October 04, 2017, 07:10:53 AM
Without a government pension, you will have to go on Obamacare ... bwahah!
Wrong as usual. Most people have employee-associated health insurance. You promote a right wing canard...
Quote from: Cavebear on October 04, 2017, 07:18:57 AM
Wrong as usual. Most people have employee-associated health insurance. You promote a right wing canard...
You are a spoiled GS tool ... not that there is anything wrong with that. Some of my best friends are spoiled GS tools.
Quote from: Baruch on October 04, 2017, 07:23:11 AM
You are a spoiled GS tool ... not that there is anything wrong with that. Some of my best friends are spoiled GS tools.
According to Wikipedia, "During 2016, the U.S. population overall was approximately 325 million, with 53 million persons 65 years of age and over covered by the federal Medicare program. The 272 million non-institutional persons under age 65 either obtained their coverage from employer-based (155 million) or non-employer based (90 million) sources, or were uninsured (27 million).[1] Approximately 15 million military personnel received coverage through the Veteran's Administration."
So, of 325 million people, 260 million were covered by insurance not of the ACA act. The ACA is only about those not otherwise covered.
Quote from: Cavebear on October 04, 2017, 07:33:33 AM
According to Wikipedia, "During 2016, the U.S. population overall was approximately 325 million, with 53 million persons 65 years of age and over covered by the federal Medicare program. The 272 million non-institutional persons under age 65 either obtained their coverage from employer-based (155 million) or non-employer based (90 million) sources, or were uninsured (27 million).[1] Approximately 15 million military personnel received coverage through the Veteran's Administration."
So, of 325 million people, 260 million were covered by insurance not of the ACA act. The ACA is only about those not otherwise covered.
All your medical plans, and pensions are bankrupt. That will be the next shoe to fall. All of the US is Detroit, it just hasn't had the curtain pulled back to reveal the awful truth yet. Ape people make lousy sentients.
Quote from: Baruch on October 04, 2017, 01:01:54 PM
All your medical plans, and pensions are bankrupt. That will be the next shoe to fall. All of the US is Detroit, it just hasn't had the curtain pulled back to reveal the awful truth yet. Ape people make lousy sentients.
We are a bit more resilient than that. We make things work. And you HATE that, don't you? It really annoys you that we keep bumbling along and getting through problems. Like it was wrong of us to leave the Empire.
Quote from: Cavebear on October 04, 2017, 01:05:35 PM
We are a bit more resilient than that. We make things work. And you HATE that, don't you? It really annoys you that we keep bumbling along and getting through problems. Like it was wrong of us to leave the Empire.
All empires are evil, and all imperialists think that they are omnipotent and omniscient. It ain't so. Each nation is an interesting variation on human failure. But life goes on anyway, because boy meets girl ... I think that individual people matter, their temporary living arrangements are less important.
Quote from: Baruch on October 04, 2017, 01:11:06 PM
All empires are evil, and all imperialists think that they are omnipotent and omniscient. It ain't so. Each nation is an interesting variation on human failure. But life goes on anyway, because boy meets girl ... I think that individual people matter, their temporary living arrangements are less important.
Good, since we are lousy at empire-maintenance. We are more the world's 7-11. Ok, maybe Walmart.
Quote from: Cavebear on October 04, 2017, 01:15:31 PM
Good, since we are lousy at empire-maintenance. We are more the world's 7-11. Ok, maybe Walmart.
Definitely Walmart ;-) At least a 7-11 was convenient.
Quote from: Baruch on October 04, 2017, 01:30:47 PM
Definitely Walmart ;-) At least a 7-11 was convenient.
It is hard to beat a 24/7 Walmart. I'm surprised Walmart hasn't bought 7-11 though.
Quote from: Cavebear on October 04, 2017, 01:57:17 PM
It is hard to beat a 24/7 Walmart. I'm surprised Walmart hasn't bought 7-11 though.
Hard for a bankrupt organization to buy a going concern, but given white-collar crime, it can be done. i prefer smaller stores, Walmart either has too much or too little. Think Goldilocks ... 7-11 is just right ;-) Of course they got a lot of competition from convenience stores attached to gas stations. Those seem to have to little, and give me gas ;-))
Quote from: Baruch on October 04, 2017, 08:16:23 PM
Hard for a bankrupt organization to buy a going concern, but given white-collar crime, it can be done. i prefer smaller stores, Walmart either has too much or too little. Think Goldilocks ... 7-11 is just right ;-) Of course they got a lot of competition from convenience stores attached to gas stations. Those seem to have to little, and give me gas ;-))
A 7-11 store cannot have the selection of a Walmart. I bought a 24" Samsung HDTV at Walmart (for the week my 60" one is waiting for repair) for $138. To test where the problem was and show the repairman.. And I'll return it after, and they won't complain, LOL!
Try that at 7-11.
Quote from: Cavebear on October 08, 2017, 03:08:07 AM
A 7-11 store cannot have the selection of a Walmart. I bought a 24" Samsung HDTV at Walmart (for the week my 60" one is waiting for repair) for $138. To test where the problem was and show the repairman.. And I'll return it after, and they won't complain, LOL!
Try that at 7-11.
At Neiman-Marcus you could buy his-her helicopters. Try that at Walmart. So Neiman-Marcus should be the only store on Earth!
Quote from: Baruch on October 08, 2017, 05:24:14 PM
At Neiman-Marcus you could buy his-her helicopters. Try that at Walmart. So Neiman-Marcus should be the only store on Earth!
Not if they don't stock cat litter tubs 35# for $12.88