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Humanities Section => Philosophy & Rhetoric General Discussion => Topic started by: Absurd Atheist on August 20, 2017, 07:25:25 PM

Title: The Wise One's Burden
Post by: Absurd Atheist on August 20, 2017, 07:25:25 PM
Just came across this silly poem I wrote a little while back after discovering Absurdism. It's a little embarrassing but I thought you guys might have a good laugh. Don't ask why it's missing the last two lines.

The Wise One’s Burden
A).
Take up the Wise One’s Burden, to question the vast unknown
Embrace the stark absurd, to interrogate the worlds we own
Release the world from meaning, yet revolt against despair
Purposeless the world may be, yet that is the burden we bear
B).
Take up the Wise One’s Burden, to accept the human condition
One world in which we think and live, another we view with suspicion
Faced with the problem of time, we depend on hierarchy of power
To escape trials of reality, we’ve created this Ivory tower
C).
Take up the Wise One’s Burden, the war that lasts forever
Tear down this stained masquerade, a painful and failed endeavor
Reflect with heavy heart, on the house we’ve built on sand
Forgive the lies once told, and crude thoughts we now reprimand
D).
Take up the Wise One’s Burden, and solve the terminal soul
In memory, we last forever, but only as part of the whole
Title: Re: The Wise One's Burden
Post by: Sorginak on August 20, 2017, 07:30:03 PM
I like it.  Thank you for sharing.
Title: Re: The Wise One's Burden
Post by: Baruch on August 20, 2017, 09:53:57 PM
As borrowed from Rudyard Kipling?  I am so triggered by 19th century British Imperialism ... not really.
Title: Re: The Wise One's Burden
Post by: Absurd Atheist on August 21, 2017, 08:32:01 PM
Quote from: Baruch on August 20, 2017, 09:53:57 PM
As borrowed from Rudyard Kipling?  I am so triggered by 19th century British Imperialism ... not really.

Yes, it was supposed to be satirical in the presentation.
Title: Re: The Wise One's Burden
Post by: Cavebear on August 26, 2017, 02:41:49 AM
Quote from: Absurd Atheist on August 20, 2017, 07:25:25 PM
Just came across this silly poem I wrote a little while back after discovering Absurdism. It's a little embarrassing but I thought you guys might have a good laugh. Don't ask why it's missing the last two lines.

The Wise One’s Burden
A).
Take up the Wise One’s Burden, to question the vast unknown
Embrace the stark absurd, to interrogate the worlds we own
Release the world from meaning, yet revolt against despair
Purposeless the world may be, yet that is the burden we bear
B).
Take up the Wise One’s Burden, to accept the human condition
One world in which we think and live, another we view with suspicion
Faced with the problem of time, we depend on hierarchy of power
To escape trials of reality, we’ve created this Ivory tower
C).
Take up the Wise One’s Burden, the war that lasts forever
Tear down this stained masquerade, a painful and failed endeavor
Reflect with heavy heart, on the house we’ve built on sand
Forgive the lies once told, and crude thoughts we now reprimand
D).
Take up the Wise One’s Burden, and solve the terminal soul
In memory, we last forever, but only as part of the whole

Lost me at the 2nd sentence.  "World's We Own"?
Title: Re: The Wise One's Burden
Post by: Absurd Atheist on August 26, 2017, 10:34:46 AM
Quote from: Cavebear on August 26, 2017, 02:41:49 AM
Lost me at the 2nd sentence.  "World's We Own"?

I interpret this as referring to the perspective world which we think in, versus the world around us which we live in. The interrogation might be belief systems, actions, etc. which are all fabricated within the mind.
Title: Re: The Wise One's Burden
Post by: Cavebear on August 26, 2017, 10:56:34 AM
Quote from: Absurd Atheist on August 26, 2017, 10:34:46 AM
I interpret this as referring to the perspective world which we think in, versus the world around us which we live in. The interrogation might be belief systems, actions, etc. which are all fabricated within the mind.

Whew, deep!  And not joking.  How does the perspective world we think in differ from the world around us we live in?  I can guess but you have thought about it.
Title: Re: The Wise One's Burden
Post by: Absurd Atheist on September 05, 2017, 12:57:44 AM
Quote from: Cavebear on August 26, 2017, 10:56:34 AM
Whew, deep!  And not joking.  How does the perspective world we think in differ from the world around us we live in?  I can guess but you have thought about it.

Hmm, the way I see it the perspective world "creates" and the other world "exists". Think of it as a canvas and a painter. Your mind is the painter and paints whatever it feels on the canvas of the world thus constructing reality. So the world as we know it (America, religion, law, language) is really just a big piece of art on a previously blank canvas.

Take the language barrier for example.

In the perspective world, these symbols have meant something for English speakers. しかし、ã"ã,Œã,‰ã®ã,·ãƒ³ãƒœãƒ«ã¯

Both sentences "exist", but if you don't understand Japanese this just means your perspective hasn't learned a "created" sense of meaning. Language to me is another form of mental painting using sound and writing and mutually agreeing on the meaning of otherwise random phonetics and symbols.

Even simple concepts like "up" and "down" are oriented according to perspective and wouldn't exist without a mind to experience and "create" the sense of up and down. I don't know if this made sense but it's how I understand the world of the Self and the Other.
Title: Re: The Wise One's Burden
Post by: Cavebear on September 07, 2017, 04:36:01 AM
Quote from: Absurd Atheist on September 05, 2017, 12:57:44 AM
Hmm, the way I see it the perspective world "creates" and the other world "exists". Think of it as a canvas and a painter. Your mind is the painter and paints whatever it feels on the canvas of the world thus constructing reality. So the world as we know it (America, religion, law, language) is really just a big piece of art on a previously blank canvas.

Take the language barrier for example.

In the perspective world, these symbols have meant something for English speakers. しかし、ã"ã,Œã,‰ã®ã,·ãƒ³ãƒœãƒ«ã¯

Both sentences "exist", but if you don't understand Japanese this just means your perspective hasn't learned a "created" sense of meaning. Language to me is another form of mental painting using sound and writing and mutually agreeing on the meaning of otherwise random phonetics and symbols.

Even simple concepts like "up" and "down" are oriented according to perspective and wouldn't exist without a mind to experience and "create" the sense of up and down. I don't know if this made sense but it's how I understand the world of the Self and the Other.

Some directions have no universal meaning.  Up and down in a on gravity situation, for example.  But right and left do.
Title: Re: The Wise One's Burden
Post by: Absurd Atheist on September 09, 2017, 03:57:34 PM
Quote from: Cavebear on September 07, 2017, 04:36:01 AM
Some directions have no universal meaning.  Up and down in a on gravity situation, for example.  But right and left do.

Right and Left have a universal meaning?
Title: Re: The Wise One's Burden
Post by: Baruch on September 10, 2017, 01:39:04 AM
Quote from: Absurd Atheist on September 09, 2017, 03:57:34 PM
Right and Left have a universal meaning?

I think he got his grammar wrong, not his directions.  On Earth, gravity clearly defines a special direction.  And relative to the N/S poles ... so do the two geographical space dimensions.  It is only in empty space, far from Earth and gravity, that direction has no particular special meaning.

Right and left do have special meaning, for some quantum processes ... has to do with odd and even parity, so it isn't quite the same as your human hands, but a generalization of that, called chirality.
Title: Re: The Wise One's Burden
Post by: Cavebear on September 11, 2017, 02:51:13 AM
Quote from: Absurd Atheist on September 09, 2017, 03:57:34 PM
Right and Left have a universal meaning?

By definition...  Bi-lateral symmetry defines it.  I wouldn't matter to a starfish, of course. 
Title: Re: The Wise One's Burden
Post by: Baruch on September 11, 2017, 01:28:31 PM
Quote from: Cavebear on September 11, 2017, 02:51:13 AM
By definition...  Bi-lateral symmetry defines it.  I wouldn't matter to a starfish, of course.

Odd number of arms or even?  That is the bi-lateral symmetry but still cut a starfish with an odd number of arms, and the two halves can't be matched.
Title: Re: The Wise One's Burden
Post by: Cavebear on September 11, 2017, 01:35:14 PM
Quote from: Baruch on September 11, 2017, 01:28:31 PM
Odd number of arms or even?  That is the bi-lateral symmetry but still cut a starfish with an odd number of arms, and the two halves can't be matched.

But a cut arm can grow a whole new starfish.  It's Quinteral symmatry?
Title: Re: The Wise One's Burden
Post by: Baruch on September 12, 2017, 12:28:24 AM
Quote from: Cavebear on September 11, 2017, 01:35:14 PM
But a cut arm can grow a whole new starfish.  It's Quinteral symmatry?

Yes, one arm can grow a whole new starfish ... but the arm has to have part of the gut.  Kind of hard to regrow 80% of your body if you can't eat ;-(
Title: Re: The Wise One's Burden
Post by: Cavebear on September 14, 2017, 03:51:11 AM
Quote from: Baruch on September 12, 2017, 12:28:24 AM
Yes, one arm can grow a whole new starfish ... but the arm has to have part of the gut.  Kind of hard to regrow 80% of your body if you can't eat ;-(

Well, can you do that?  I'll give you an arm, a leg AND most of your guts.!
Title: Re: The Wise One's Burden
Post by: Baruch on September 14, 2017, 07:32:40 AM
Quote from: Cavebear on September 14, 2017, 03:51:11 AM
Well, can you do that?  I'll give you an arm, a leg AND most of your guts.!

Yes, starfish are seriously superior to ape men.
Title: Re: The Wise One's Burden
Post by: Cavebear on September 14, 2017, 08:08:19 AM
Quote from: Baruch on September 14, 2017, 07:32:40 AM
Yes, starfish are seriously superior to ape men.

Well, who is further up the food chain?  The lobster eat the starfish and I eat the lobster.
Title: Re: The Wise One's Burden
Post by: Baruch on September 14, 2017, 08:19:26 PM
Quote from: Cavebear on September 14, 2017, 08:08:19 AM
Well, who is further up the food chain?  The lobster eat the starfish and I eat the lobster.

And the crabs eat you, if you fall overboard and drown ;-)  Tough getting the fur out of their mouth parts though ;-(
Title: Re: The Wise One's Burden
Post by: Cavebear on September 19, 2017, 03:10:49 AM
Quote from: Baruch on September 14, 2017, 08:19:26 PM
And the crabs eat you, if you fall overboard and drown ;-)  Tough getting the fur out of their mouth parts though ;-(

If I die in the water, I am food for all the sea life.  If I die on the land, I am food for all the land life.  Molecules to molecules, atoms to atoms, all is recycled.  And that is why I desire an open grave.  *I* won't know I'm being eaten and returned to the Earth...
Title: Re: The Wise One's Burden
Post by: Baruch on September 19, 2017, 10:20:51 PM
Quote from: Cavebear on September 19, 2017, 03:10:49 AM
If I die in the water, I am food for all the sea life.  If I die on the land, I am food for all the land life.  Molecules to molecules, atoms to atoms, all is recycled.  And that is why I desire an open grave.  *I* won't know I'm being eaten and returned to the Earth...

It is a well known paranoia, that you are aware of it as your body decays and is consumed and turned to dust ... because you are still you, being only a body, no matter what condition you are in.
Title: Re: The Wise One's Burden
Post by: Cavebear on September 23, 2017, 04:36:09 AM
Quote from: Baruch on September 19, 2017, 10:20:51 PM
It is a well known paranoia, that you are aware of it as your body decays and is consumed and turned to dust ... because you are still you, being only a body, no matter what condition you are in.

Oh sad theist you.  You assume I think I would be aware of my own death and end of existence.  When I die, I will be as unaware of any existence as the swatted fly or the stomped ant.  It takes a real theist to imagine existence beyond death.  And I am not one...

Why is "The End" so hard for you to grasp?    There is suddenly "NO AWARENESS".   Is your self image so HUGELY egoistic it cannot conceive of the event of end-of-life?
Title: Re: The Wise One's Burden
Post by: Baruch on September 23, 2017, 05:35:39 PM
Quote from: Cavebear on September 23, 2017, 04:36:09 AM
Oh sad theist you.  You assume I think I would be aware of my own death and end of existence.  When I die, I will be as unaware of any existence as the swatted fly or the stomped ant.  It takes a real theist to imagine existence beyond death.  And I am not one...

Why is "The End" so hard for you to grasp?    There is suddenly "NO AWARENESS".   Is your self image so HUGELY egoistic it cannot conceive of the event of end-of-life?

You may be right.  I was just quoting a traditional belief.
Title: Re: The Wise One's Burden
Post by: Cavebear on September 28, 2017, 04:27:18 AM
Quote from: Baruch on September 23, 2017, 05:35:39 PM
You may be right.  I was just quoting a traditional belief.

And that was not an answer...
Title: Re: The Wise One's Burden
Post by: Baruch on September 28, 2017, 07:26:43 PM
Quote from: Cavebear on September 28, 2017, 04:27:18 AM
And that was not an answer...

As Tevye used to sing ... Tradition!
Title: Re: The Wise One's Burden
Post by: Cavebear on October 01, 2017, 07:23:29 AM
Quote from: Baruch on September 28, 2017, 07:26:43 PM
As Tevye used to sing ... Tradition!

Well, I understood you were a rather traditional type.  I'm not.  But I admired the gradual changes in how the daughters approached their marriages.  Sunrise, sunset...
Title: Re: The Wise One's Burden
Post by: Baruch on October 01, 2017, 03:41:42 PM
Quote from: Cavebear on October 01, 2017, 07:23:29 AM
Well, I understood you were a rather traditional type.  I'm not.  But I admired the gradual changes in how the daughters approached their marriages.  Sunrise, sunset...

There were good parts.  The last daughter, in the book, commits suicide ;-(  I prefer A Funny Thing Happened On The Way To The Forum.
Title: Re: The Wise One's Burden
Post by: Cavebear on October 04, 2017, 03:46:44 AM
Quote from: Baruch on October 01, 2017, 03:41:42 PM
There were good parts.  The last daughter, in the book, commits suicide ;-(  I prefer A Funny Thing Happened On The Way To The Forum.

I don't find humor a good read.  There are a few exceptions.  Caddychack.  Groundhog Day is more my style.
Title: Re: The Wise One's Burden
Post by: Baruch on October 04, 2017, 08:41:34 PM
Quote from: Cavebear on October 04, 2017, 03:46:44 AM
I don't find humor a good read.  There are a few exceptions.  Caddychack.  Groundhog Day is more my style.

A Funny Thing Happened On The Way To The Forum ... could only be seen to be believed .. it is actually quite close to actual Roman comedy ...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T-hZhr2k2hk
Title: Re: The Wise One's Burden
Post by: Cavebear on October 08, 2017, 04:57:35 AM
Quote from: Baruch on October 04, 2017, 08:41:34 PM
A Funny Thing Happened On The Way To The Forum ... could only be seen to be believed .. it is actually quite close to actual Roman comedy ...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T-hZhr2k2hk

There are several kinds of humor.  Banana Peel, Making People look Stupid, and Human Observations.  I prefer the latter.
Title: Re: The Wise One's Burden
Post by: Cavebear on October 08, 2017, 09:29:40 AM
Quote from: Baruch on September 12, 2017, 12:28:24 AM
Yes, one arm can grow a whole new starfish ... but the arm has to have part of the gut.  Kind of hard to regrow 80% of your body if you can't eat ;-(

Some sites suggest a starfish can regrow from part of an arm.