https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ooShpws3Dik
I'll admit, I think Trump did better this time around. But it's still the same ol' song and dance with neither candidate making much headway. Meh, I call it a wash.
But even so, Clinton answered the questions like a knowledgeable politician and Trump answered them like he's trying to give a book report on book he has never read. There's no question in my mind who appears more presidential.
I swear to Dawkins, whenever Trump uses his "I'm the most _____" line, it's a surefire tell that he's lying. Whenever he says that he's the most knowledgeable, has the best tempertment, respects women the most, etc - his statement can be safely assumed to be a lie.
Also, there were a few moments I'd like to draw attention to.
The pussygate apology
Trump had all weekend to prepare for this one and he did okay at first, acknowledging his mistake and apologizing to the American people. And then he jumps into some bizzare diatribe about ISIS. I think that he was trying to say that there are way bigger issues to worry about, but jeez, it's hard to parse his message out of that verbal fog. I get the impression that he's never had to apologize for anything before and can't stay on message if his life depended on it. Not a great showing, imo.
Of course I avoided paying taxes
One hell of an an admission here (https://youtu.be/ooShpws3Dik?t=59m29s).
I'd jail Clinton
Stupid inflammatory rhetoric designed to appeal to the "jail Hillary" conservative base. The downside is that it alienates everyone else. If any Dem-leaning voters weren't already planning on voting for Clinton, they are now.
Clean coal
Clinton's trying to put the coal industry out of business? Good! They should go out of business. It's an obsolete industry that's killing the planet and the sooner we ditch it, the better. It's one hell of a dangerous job, too.
Name something good about your opponent.
*both candidates get a deer-in-headlights look*
Clinton did a stealth insult by praising his children (implying that there's nothing good that can be said about Trump)
Trump praised Clinton's determination, which is good on him.
Oddly enough, I think Trump took the higher road there.
What's my plan again?
Hillary's plan is the worst. She's been trying her plan for 500 years. Disaster. Big disaster. Horrible, horrible disaster. Like Hindenberg. Probably caused WWI. My plan is the best plan. I understand plans more than anyone else in the world. Cause *sniffs* I'm the best planner everywhere *sniffs* in the world. ISIS is horrible. It's like medieval times out there. *moderator interrupts* Can I finish? Can I finish??? *5 min rant about unfair mic privileges before the mic is finally cut*
I was able to stay tuned in better this time. Trump did better, a whole 25 minutes before he began interrupting. I focused intently on the ACA (obamacare) portion. It became apparent Clinton has no real comprehension of the disaster it is OR she refuses to acknowledge the failings which are immense. Obamacare has had a very negative effect on many people I know.
I don't know that she was involved in the manufacturing of this burden but it was supposed to be a favorite issue of hers and her response was pure deflection. So what if an Insurance company can't refuse you for a pre-existing condition if you can't afford to use it (or pay the premiums)?
I absolutely hate Trumps 15% corp tax.
Finally, I don't tune into debates to see them "and my opponent would have you..." for most of their answers. I want to hear "my plan is..."
Wait, not finally:
Name something good about your opponent.
That was a great ending question!
ACA would be even worse, if Pharaoh Obama hadn't waved his staff of Ra ... and held off the small business mandates!
I do not agree that everything the government touches turns to turds ... nor does everything the government touches turn to tulips.
Just listened to the Stephan Molyneux Youtube review of yesterday's debate ... I don't always agree with him, but at least he thinks for himself.
But as I have said before, probably both candidates are actors, following a predetermined script, and will be elected or not based on a predetermined Diebold vote count ... gotta love that CIA!
I agree it would be chaos if all the rich and powerful got what was coming to them, in a genuine state of justice, not the Nixonian farce it is now. I would agree with the Bushes, Kennedys and Clintons ... only the extension of pardon should extend to all Americans, not just the Country Club class. President Pharaoh has been even more active than President Clinton, in pardoning drug dealers and other threats.
Quote from: Hydra009 on October 10, 2016, 06:55:33 PM
The pussygate apology
Trump had all weekend to prepare for this one and he did okay at first, acknowledging his mistake and apologizing to the American people. And then he jumps into some bizzare diatribe about ISIS.
He did that other times during the night. Jumping onto an irrelevant issue to the original question. That jarred me also. I think once (maybe more) he would begin to answer, jump to another topic, and then jump to still another. I would try to grasp the relevance, get lost in my confusion, and realize he was changing topics without rhyme or reason. Politicians do this all the time, but they usually make a smooth enough transition that you don't recognize they avoided the question until much later. Oddly, Trump doesn't seem to have that skill.
His skills lie in what he did most of last night. He's a great attacker. In my counseling courses, we learned about something called congruence. It's when a person's manner is congruent with his inner nature. Everything works together; Unconscious motives, body language, facial expressions, voice tone all come together to reveal the real person. Others pick up on it, and the individual feels comfortable with himself. It's considered an ideal goal.
If you rate the winner of a debate on believability and a sense that the person is being real, I would give the win to Trump, and I think that's the part of him that his supporters relate to ("Trump says it like it is"). It's not necessarily like it is, but it's like HE is. It's him being real. He was not in that zone in the first debate. Last night he re-found his zone.
If you rate the winner as the one knowing the most about policy and somewhat being able to articulate a plan to implement it, then I'd give the win to Clinton. From what I heard on the radio today, most gave Clinton a slight edge, including the BBC (an outside observer).
Overall, I think Trump helped himself last night, partly because he didn't appear as impotent as he did in the first debate. He didn't really say anything of substance, but he nurtured and comforted his ardent supporters with a confident stage presence, and gave his supporters less reason to jump ship. I don't know if Clinton helped herself as much. She didn't make a good case for Obamacare. She tried, but the program is too unpopular to waste time defending it. Obama even said earlier that it might be time to reconsider single payer, giving her an opportunity to consider revamping the whole healthcare thing into something more people would support.
How would I rate the debate over all? Not good. I thought it was tawdry, cheap, and a distasteful exhibition of wasted political potential. Before I watched it (I was streaming it), they were showing previous debates all afternoon going way back. When I tuned in they were at Reagan and Carter. And all of the debates I watched were far superior with much more substantive discussion and thoughtful consideration given to issues; At least compared to last night's Cross Fire format. Even though I never gave those earlier debates much credit, they represented something sorely needed in today's political discussion.
Mastery of foreign policy talking points? Well ... at least Clinton seems to be able to memorize her powerpoint bullets, and repeat the same platitudes over and over again. She has feelings, and expresses them .... but a plan to actually do something, that ain't it. But then Trump doesn't memorize powerpoint bullets as well as she does.
Quote from: chill98 on October 10, 2016, 08:32:18 PMI was able to stay tuned in better this time. Trump did better, a whole 25 minutes before he began interrupting. I focused intently on the ACA (obamacare) portion. It became apparent Clinton has no real comprehension of the disaster it is OR she refuses to acknowledge the failings which are immense. Obamacare has had a very negative effect on many people I know.
I'll have to take your word on that. Admittedly, I know little about the healthcare situation besides the fact that Americans pay more for their healthcare than people in other developed countries.
In broad terms, I'd like to see healthcare costs more in line with other developed countries while retaining good quality healthcare and expanding coverage to people who otherwise couldn't afford it. Whichever plan gets as much of that accomplished as possible is good enough for me.
One issue that I consider extremely important is climate change. We recently hit the 400 parts-per-million threshold at all observation stations, and it's going to be at least that for the foreseeable future. This is the most important problem of the 21st century. And we have two candidates - one who believes it is a threat and would ratchet it down slowly (http://www.vox.com/science-and-health/2016/10/10/13227682/trump-clinton-climate-energy-difference) (but at an almost certainly inadequate pace) and another candidate who doesn't take it seriously and whose energy policies (http://www.nytimes.com/2016/05/27/us/politics/donald-trump-global-warming-energy-policy.html) essentially amount to a lone session of russian roulette with all the chambers loaded. Choosing between these two candidates is a no-brainer, but it's not a great outcome either way.
QuoteFinally, I don't tune into debates to see them "and my opponent would have you..." for most of their answers. I want to hear "my plan is..."
Agreed.
Polls and analyses again show Clinton winning.
Trump tried to blame Bill Clinton for Trump's own failings. Trump crept around the stage like a petulant creep when Hillary was addressing the issues masterfully. Hillary spoke factfully, while Trump lied. Trump threatened to throw Hillary in jail if he won: that is a BIG loser line in my book; it shows him to be the dictator wannabe that he is. He also dug up a panel of debunked and discredited Bill Clinton accusers and invited them to the debate to try to rattle Hillary; it failed, of course because Hillary is classy.
You don't win a debate by lying and threatening. You win a debate with facts and reason.
It was no contest. Hillary beat Trump.
Unfortunately, it is probably already too late for Global Warming abatement. Humans don't consider the common good, except rarely.
The US pays approximately 2x for health care per capita than Canada ... which is a comparable level of culture.
The "Jail Hillary" also appeals to "Bernie or Bust"ers because they want her jailed too.
It's very characteristic of how a dictator would act. Jail political opponents, though.... Yeah. That's great...
America doesn't really have much of a choice this year does it? Y'all need more political parties.
Quote from: Baruch on October 11, 2016, 06:16:51 AM
Unfortunately, it is probably already too late for Global Warming abatement.
I wonder about that too. Global warming is slow (in human timeframes), but it has tremendous inertia. It has so much inertia that we didn't even identify it happening or recognize its ultimate potential for a couple hundred years while we were already busily adding greenhouse gasses to the environment. The climate remained as stable as the rest of the interglacial period that nourished human success.
Now we have reached a benchmark, where the first measureable differences are showing up. People act like global warming can be stopped on a dime and reversed at the exact geological moment it becomes a crisis. I wouldn't bet on it, and I remember learning that 30 or 40 years ago. It's more than moving on to alternative fuels at this point. With the melting of the artic ice now in progress, and the loss of heat reflecting ice that causes the climate to warm, even without burning fossil fuels, the secondary effects have taken control. The loss of forests and their huge stores of carbon would have to be reversed, and that can't happen in a human lifetime. Secondary dangers, like the release of methane gas from arctic permafrost are now set in motion, and take on a life of their own. How to you reverse things like that? You can't build an artificial refrigeration system and bring down global temperatures by the 2 degrees it takes. My guess is that there are cycles now springing into action that we don't even recognize yet.
Just as the inertia of warming held itself in check for hundreds of years while mankind fiddled, It's likely that the inertia of its increasing momentum (the operative word being "increasing"), will not be reversed so easily. Even if we had the political will, which we don't, the technology to reverse the process is part of a distant future, if it exists at all.
Talk of "before it's too late" may be meaningless. We may have crossed that threshold 50 years ago. But don't tell this to Republicans. It would form the basis for their next argument against taking action: "It's too late, so why bother?"
Technology needs to be introduced to remove some of the CO2 from the atmosphere. One day we will terraform other planets, but we will probably get our first experience in this technology by terraforming Earth.
Trump is eliminated as a Presidential candidate (FINALLY) by his own past and current hatreds. The Presidential campaign is over. All that remains is to see how badly the truly crazy part of the base drags the convention Republicans into wrack and ruin in the House and Senate.
Quote from: Cavebear on October 11, 2016, 09:17:06 AM
Trump is eliminated as a Presidential candidate (FINALLY) by his own past and current hatreds. The Presidential campaign is over. All that remains is to see how badly the truly crazy part of the base drags the convention Republicans into wrack and ruin in the House and Senate.
If the SS TrumpTanic takes down the Republicans in the House and Senate, that would be an added bonus. If his campaign leads to an extinction-level event for the Republican Party, that would be sweet indeed! With the Republicans gone, a true progressive party could rise to challenge the Democrats from the left.
Indeed, I suspect the history books 50 years from now will mention Federalists, Whigs, and Republicans in the same sentence as failed Parties.
I suspect there will be a gradual coalescence of Centrists, Unionists, and Moderate Conservatives forming a sort of Centrist/Union/Middle Class Party. I have no idea what they will call themselves, but the Middle Class has to be reconstructed for the US to succeed. It won't by down-driven by the Republicans nor up-driven by the Democrats.
If it isn't organic and generic, it won't work.
Quote from: Atheon on October 11, 2016, 08:46:37 AM
Technology needs to be introduced to remove some of the CO2 from the atmosphere. One day we will terraform other planets, but we will probably get our first experience in this technology by terraforming Earth.
We are terraforming ... badly ;-( Damn apemen!
Quote from: PickelledEggs on October 11, 2016, 08:18:06 AM
The "Jail Hillary" also appeals to "Bernie or Bust"ers because they want her jailed too.
It's very characteristic of how a dictator would act. Jail political opponents, though.... Yeah. That's great...
Nope ... wood-chipper is much more Nazi. A benevolent dictator would be great ... maybe.
Quote from: Cavebear on October 11, 2016, 10:13:16 AM
I suspect the history books 50 years from now will mention Federalists, Whigs, and Republicans in the same sentence as failed Parties.
I heard the same talk 8 years ago
The difference is that the Republicans finally got want they have been striving for over 20 years and the beast is out of their cage.
I don't know about "jail Hillary" as a major factor in the Bernie or Bust movement. I think there were much greater ideals involved in it than that. For some no doubt. Someone always wants to jail every president we've had. I don't take it seriously.
The jail Hillary idiotacy is not a Bernie or Bust movement, It is a Trump base fantasy And not really even a Trump one. Even HE couldn't be THAT nuts.
Quote from: Hydra009 on October 10, 2016, 10:29:26 PM
In broad terms, I'd like to see healthcare costs more in line with other developed countries while retaining good quality healthcare and expanding coverage to people who otherwise couldn't afford it. Whichever plan gets as much of that accomplished as possible is good enough for me.
Healthcare (in its broad range) is approx 18% of the GDP. Lower costs and you lower GDP. That is the underlying motive to keep costs high.
Quote from: Hydra009 on October 10, 2016, 10:29:26 PM
One issue that I consider extremely important is climate change. We recently hit the 400 parts-per-million threshold at all observation stations, and it's going to be at least that for the foreseeable future. This is the most important problem of the 21st century.
You should watch Clinton Cash, they touch on this subject in a couple of places including Columbia and pipelines.
https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2016/apr/07/out-of-time-climate-change-hillary-clinton
She may inflict a carbon tax to appease that part of her base, but count on one thing, she won't actually do anything to disrupt the cash flow.
And the carbon tax will do nothing about CO2. Global trade agreements will assure that.
Nuking China was insure that. But that would be a bad idea. Sorry, Civilization has reached its expiration date. Too bad we will take all the higher life forms with us.
Quote from: PickelledEggs on October 11, 2016, 08:18:06 AMThe "Jail Hillary" also appeals to "Bernie or Bust"ers because they want her jailed too.
News to me. And didn't Bernie personally wave away the email scandal? (he didn't excuse it exactly, he just pleaded for the debate to be directed more towards substantive issues facing Americans) So what charges would be brought that haven't already been considered?
QuoteIt's very characteristic of how a dictator would act. Jail political opponents, though.... Yeah. That's great...
Yeah. Clearly, his latest scandal got to him. I'm still waiting on the lawsuit spree against various newspapers who have been "mean" to him. This is a guy who once sued for the insult of being called a millionaire (http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/thr-esq/donald-trump-loses-libel-lawsuit-232923) (quelle horreur!) and threatened to sue The Onion (http://lawnewz.com/high-profile/that-time-donald-trump-threatened-to-sue-the-onion-over-defamatory-story/) of all things. He's so thin-skinned that I suspect the orangey rind over his face might some sort of protective sheath.
I've seen a few of my "Bernie or bust" aquaintances/friends say that they want her in jail, which is why I say that. whether or not it is a "bernie or bust" thing, I will accept a correction if it's needed. I did think it was though
Quote from: PickelledEggs on October 12, 2016, 03:12:27 AM
I've seen a few of my "Bernie or bust" aquaintances/friends say that they want her in jail, which is why I say that. whether or not it is a "bernie or bust" thing, I will accept a correction if it's needed. I did think it was though
I'm sure there are people like that, in fact I know there are, but it isn't very representative of Bernie supporters as a whole. Back in July, a Pew poll had 90% of Bernie supporters planning on voting for Clinton (https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/the-fix/wp/2016/07/25/the-democratic-convention-is-chaotic-the-democratic-base-isnt/) despite a few of 'em cheering an Infowars van with "Hillary for prison" on the side. Since then, I've seen numbers all over the place in more informal polls but typically with Clinton having a majority of Sanders supporters (http://fivethirtyeight.com/features/about-a-third-of-bernie-sanders-supporters-still-arent-backing-hillary-clinton/). The "Bernie or bust" narrative is overblown.
Regarding healthcare, I think the ACA is a step in the right direction but it is a compromised program that produces mixed results. I think a better solution would be Medicare for all, with insurance companies providing optional plans just as they do now. I am definitely receptive to other solutions however critics of ACA never produce a clear plan that will provide affordable, quality healthcare to all US citizens. Today I read this article on ACA:
The Affordable Care Act is covering people, holding down costs and not killing jobs
https://www.washingtonpost.com/posteverything/wp/2016/10/11/the-affordable-care-act-is-covering-people-holding-down-costs-and-not-killing-jobs/?utm_term=.3c09eac861d3
No one is interested in providing low cost comprehensive health care (screw insurance) for the American people. The only constituency is the American people, and they don't count as a persuasive special interest group. Did I mention that Hillary's running mate supports Citizens United?
The second debate was completely unfair. The moderators kept cutting Trump off and let Hillary talk as long as she wanted so in the end Trump only got a few more seconds than Hillary. I'm not sure if that is counting the time he talked during her turn or not. If it is then it's even MORE unfair.
Seriously, though, Hillary missed a couple of good opportunities. When asked if he had the discipline to be a good leader and she answered "No", with him interrupting with "I'm shocked to hear that" it would have been the PERFECT time to say, "He doesn't even have the discipline to not interrupt me during my time to speak". Also, with the last question, which admittedly was a bitch to get sideswiped with, she should have given his answer, making sure to point out that he's not a quitter, that he never gives up and that the whole race people were telling him that he couldn't do it and he never quit and showed all of them, playing right into his ego and further cementing the certainty that he won't drop out no matter how damaged he becomes.
One thing Trump said, which was supposed to be a dig on Hillary, actually made me like her more. "She wants to go to single payer". SO DO I! The ACA really is a disaster. Yeah, a few million people who didn't have insurance before have insurance. A few million more who don't qualify and can't afford it now don't get the tax return they depend on at the end of a year. And those who do have it who didn't before are on such shitty plans that they're likely unable to afford the copay anyway. So yeah, they can go to the doctor instead of the emergency room...for now. Until the bills rack up and the doctor stops seeing them. Then they're back in the destroyed credit, emergency room only rut they were in to begin with because the lowest income people have the highest deductibles. And let's face it, the ACA didn't do the Democrats any favors. They're still paying for it and likely will be for at least the next decade or until they can actually go to single payer.
Quote from: widdershins on October 12, 2016, 02:31:37 PM
The second debate was completely unfair. The moderators kept cutting Trump off and let Hillary talk as long as she wanted so in the end Trump only got a few more seconds than Hillary. I'm not sure if that is counting the time he talked during her turn or not. If it is then it's even MORE unfair.
Trump spent more time bitching about the moderators than he did getting cut off by them, so he didn't do himself any favors there.
The same sort of thing happened during the Republican debate and the moderator told the guy who was complaining about it that that's the format he agreed to, basically told him to cram it. That's how they should always handle complaints.
Or better yet, they should just cut the mic of whoever doesn't have the floor. Interrupting is a dick move when Trump does it and it's a dick move when Kaine does it. If you have to put a stop to it the hard way, so be it.
According to NPR Trump actually spoke 1 minute and 40 seconds longer than Hillary. I was surprised when I heard that because it seemed to me Trump was getting cut off more. I think what must have happened is he got cut off more, because he was going over his time more.
But both candidates would ignore the moderators when their time was up. I've often thought the microphones should be controlled by timer switches. At the end of their two minutes, the microphone automatically cuts off. They would be given 15 second warnings and a 5 second warning, and then out comes the hook at the two minute mark and they are done. No more defiance of the moderators, and no more cutting each other off or butting in. The candidates would both look less like assholes too if they clearly understood they were not allowed to break the rules.
Quote from: SGOS on October 10, 2016, 09:44:15 PM
He did that other times during the night. Jumping onto an irrelevant issue to the original question. That jarred me also. I think once (maybe more) he would begin to answer, jump to another topic, and then jump to still another. I would try to grasp the relevance, get lost in my confusion, and realize he was changing topics without rhyme or reason. Politicians do this all the time, but they usually make a smooth enough transition that you don't recognize they avoided the question until much later. Oddly, Trump doesn't seem to have that skill.
How did Trump avoid the question? He answered and apologised for Pussygate again and again. Before the debate and during. That is not avoiding the issue. He brought up ISIS because Alex Jones told him to. Jones specifically told him to bring up ISIS after the Pussygate apology, and I don't know if I would say that ISIS is irrelevant to what was being talked about. Clinton's positions help ISIS and other Islamist terrorists. Clinton has been the one in favour of arming the Islamist terrorists who are selling little girls off into child marriages Those females are not Americans though, so I guess they don't really count. Hillary has attacked potential victims of rape and actual victims of rape. In the second case she was just doing her job by attacking that twelve year old girl and claiming that she was asking to be raped, but it wasn't her job to attack the women that Bill has potentially raped. Jones also told him in another video to accuse the moderators of cheating multiple times so it would really sink in. Jones is pretty much running the Trump campaign at the moment.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IExKY-WiWkk
Quote from: Hydra009 on October 12, 2016, 03:17:28 PM
Trump spent more time bitching about the moderators than he did getting cut off by them, so he didn't do himself any favors there.
The same sort of thing happened during the Republican debate and the moderator told the guy who was complaining about it that that's the format he agreed to, basically told him to cram it. That's how they should always handle complaints.
Or better yet, they should just cut the mic of whoever doesn't have the floor. Interrupting is a dick move when Trump does it and it's a dick move when Kaine does it. If you have to put a stop to it the hard way, so be it.
I was actually talking to the TV saying, "Just cut his damned mic!", so I'm with you on that.
Quote from: FaithIsFilth on October 12, 2016, 04:03:51 PM
How did Trump avoid the question? He answered and apologised for Pussygate...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IExKY-WiWkk
Yes, he did apologize, and then changed the subject to ISIS. Alex Jones didn't really tell him to, unless maybe he called him on the phone. He said he had a message for Trump, but I really doubt that Trump watched Alex Jones on Utube. Jones was talking to Republicans, and really just wanted to talk shit about Hillary. He did not want to talk about Trump's lewd remarks. Change the subject. Bash Hillary. That's what his video was about.
While standing on a cliff as a silly gesture of sensationalism, while adding clips of cute lemmings jumping into the lake, Alex Jones says, "Hillary is as bad as Trump." This is the universal strategy used by third graders when they get caught doing something stupid. It gives the teacher a headache, because it fails to address the stupidity, and reframes the issue as equivalence. But they're third graders.
Now if Anderson Cooper said, "Please address Pussy Gate and tell us how it relates to ISIS, and why Hillary is such a bitch," it would be a pretty dumb question. In fact, I didn't understand Cooper's question very well. He asked Trump and ended the question, "Do you understand this?" Like he was talking to a child. And I was thinking, "What the Hell is that all about?"
Hillary is no angel, and I don't expect much from her as president either, but Trumps lewd remarks are Trump's and Trump's alone. They don't necessarily mean he would be a bad president, but lewd remarks aside, he has promised a lot of incredibly idiotic and impossible policies, acts like a bull in a china shop, and isn't very inspiring as presidential material. The lewd remarks are just part of the fun political junkies like to sling at each other. But Trump has bigger problems than that.
But I do agree with Alex Jones that Trump needed to attack. Trump did and it helped him appeal to his followers when he did it. Other than that, I wouldn't set my car radio memory buttons to Alex Jones' station.
Stale old popcorn, both of them. Look, my stale old popcorn has more rancid fake butter on it than the other brand ...
And he stalked Clinton around the room. Bad idea... But entirely in character.
Quote from: Cavebear on October 15, 2016, 07:30:05 AM
And he stalked Clinton around the room. Bad idea... But entirely in character.
I would have the parties assassinate the other party's candidates ... then the gloves would be off, and we could see the V clients take off their masks and eat live rats. My biggest problem with Trump, is he ran as a Republican instead of a Democrat ... he is much more of a Democrat. I think they all got together a few years ago and agreed ... Bernie will run against Hillary and deliberately lose, Trump will run against the Republican clown car, and throw the election to Hillary if he wins the nomination. This is a coronation, not an election ... but with special effects to avoid looking like a coronation.
Quote from: Baruch on October 15, 2016, 12:52:45 PM
My biggest problem with Trump, is he ran as a Republican instead of a Democrat ... he is much more of a Democrat.
As a Democrat, I don't think he could have beaten either Hillary of Bernie in the primaries. While, he was wildly popular with rank and file Republicans, rank and file Democrats would not have been as enamored. Running as a Republican was a good strategy for Trump.
Quote from: Baruch on October 15, 2016, 12:52:45 PM
I think they all got together a few years ago and agreed ... Bernie will run against Hillary and deliberately lose, Trump will run against the Republican clown car...
"The Republican clown car" Now that was a good one.
There is nothing Democratic about Trump.
Quote from: Atheon on October 15, 2016, 08:34:32 PM
There is nothing Democratic about Trump.
He was the Clinton's good friend, when they were carpetbagging in New York. Democrats should still keep slaves ... too bad they changed over to be Republicans (but in name only, not like Lincoln nor Teddy).
This is one of the funniest things I've seen in a long time.
(https://4.bp.blogspot.com/-hIgAaQitIW0/WADMMYVb7XI/AAAAAAAACMw/vIbFmfFJa6Qczq4wWAtgHFD5R8ez5XogQCLcB/s640/kelly.PNG)
That can't be real. That doesn't even look like her! What is that, some sort of reenactment?
I've got to look this up. Snopes (http://www.snopes.com/hillary-clinton-grab-crotch/) to the rescue.
Quote from: Hydra009 on October 16, 2016, 09:51:53 AM
That can't be real. That doesn't even look like her! What is that, some sort of reenactment?
I've got to look this up. Snopes (http://www.snopes.com/hillary-clinton-grab-crotch/) to the rescue.
IT's not, look at the line about Johnson at the bottom. That doesn't mean people don't believe it though. I've seen it in my feed this morning posted by a heavy duty Trump supporter.
Heh. I didn't pay attention to the Johnson quote. It's amazing that something like that could possibly look legit to Trump supporters, but they're apparently all about getting #hillarygropedme trending on the Twitter cesspool, so it's safe to say that honesty isn't highly valued over there.
Also, I thought might have been wrong about Trump being thin-skinned (he has taken an enormous amount of flak on the campaign trail and although he has sometimes threatened to sue critics, he weathers it for the most part) but he tweeted (https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/status/787612552654155776) that he'd like to shut down SNL because they made fun of him. So my thin-skinned comment stands. The amount of butthurt coming from this guy is incredible.
Quote from: Mermaid on October 16, 2016, 10:38:51 AM
IT's not, look at the line about Johnson at the bottom. That doesn't mean people don't believe it though. I've seen it in my feed this morning posted by a heavy duty Trump supporter.
That's a real picture, but that's the mom from The Brady Bunch.
Sent from your mom.
I forget where that image is from
Sent from your mom.
I, for one, enjoyed the second debate immensely. I was in a bar playing Dungeons and Dragons, and needed a reference for a troll and a gorgon for my players.
Quote from: Baruch on October 15, 2016, 12:52:45 PM
I would have the parties assassinate the other party's candidates ... then the gloves would be off, and we could see the V clients take off their masks and eat live rats. My biggest problem with Trump, is he ran as a Republican instead of a Democrat ... he is much more of a Democrat. I think they all got together a few years ago and agreed ... Bernie will run against Hillary and deliberately lose, Trump will run against the Republican clown car, and throw the election to Hillary if he wins the nomination. This is a coronation, not an election ... but with special effects to avoid looking like a coronation.
When I first came here, I considered you somewhat thoughtful. Now I realize you are more of a pointless philosopher babbling into the universe. Too bad about that. You had promise...
Quote from: Cavebear on October 19, 2016, 06:19:33 AM
When I first came here, I considered you somewhat thoughtful. Now I realize you are more of a pointless philosopher babbling into the universe. Too bad about that. You had promise...
If words are meaningless (I had someone say this earlier) ... they why are you still using them ;-)