http://www.christianpost.com/news/left-behind-fans-question-nicolas-cages-faith-wonder-about-actual-rapture-before-films-release-111780/
More silly baloney from Christian movie goers.
Quote'Left Behind' Fans Question Nicolas Cage's Faith, Wonder About Actual Rapture Before Film's Release
One guy interviewed wondered if he would get raptured before the movie was released and not be able to see the movie at all.
QuoteAnother issue among Left Behind's fans was whether the film would be "theologically sound" and reflect "biblical truth."
Here we go with he same kind of shit they started with the Noah film. WTF is theologically sound, anyway?
Poor Nicholas Cage. He's like a boy who made a deal with the devil with the wish, "I want to star in movies for the rest of my life." And the devil gave him exactly what he asked for.
I've always wondered about him as an actor, he got his start playing quirky often buffoonish roles (think Peggy Sue Got Married and the Vampire's Kiss). Gradually, he started playing heroic leading roles. For the most part, his recent movies have been major disappointments. He's going back to his roots or something. National Treasure and Next were like the end of a serious career. Now, I hear he's in debt up to his ass, and selling his mansion. I will see this movie, and I'm hoping it presents itself as a fantasy, not as a serious admonishment to sinners to get ready for judgment day. Although, the Left Behind franchise has been pure schmaltz so far. So my hopes will probably be dashed.
As a side issue, as a matter of biblical accuracy, I can't remember the Bible talking much about the rapture, other than non specifics. I can't remember it going farther than just saying people will be carried up to Heaven, which I always took as a metaphor, not as "Whoosh! Zoom! There he goes! Well, will you look at that??" Maybe a defragmenting body, like someone being beamed up to the Enterprise, but not people suddenly zooming up into the air.
People are questioning Nicolas Cages faith, a guy who pulls faces like this?
(http://eupresents.files.wordpress.com/2013/02/nic-cage-2.gif)(https://therubberchickens.files.wordpress.com/2014/08/giphy4.gif)(http://media.tumblr.com/tumblr_lo22mr15x61qzxr43.gif)(http://s.pikabu.ru/images/big_size_comm/2012-10_6/13516250107353.gif)
If there is a heaven or hell, its a fucking scary place with him in either.
(http://i.imgur.com/FxPla.gif)
Nick Cage was in the movie "Knowing" that came out a few years ago, honestly that movie tricked me and I'm still mad about that. I think his acting roles are picked out less about faith and more about a paycheck. He's in just as many movies a year as Samuel L. Jackson.
In the end, these are just movies, people takes these things literally lol
I figured out the rapture was BS when I was a Christian. Same reason I am now an atheist, I research stuff. Xtian writer Hal Lindsey wrote a book about it that basically said you had to "read between the lines" of the Bible to support it. Popular literature trumps reasearch, apparently.
Cage bores me.. Only one movie I've ever seen him in I liked was Raising Arizona.. Other than that...crap.. As for rapture.. i kind of wish it actually happened and we could go on about life without these fuckers everywhere, but since it's fiction i don't worry about it.
I don't know how that guy had a career at all. Never liked him as an actor.
Quote from: stromboli on September 19, 2014, 03:37:06 PM
I figured out the rapture was BS when I was a Christian. Same reason I am now an atheist, I research stuff. Xtian writer Hal Lindsey wrote a book about it that basically said you had to "read between the lines" of the Bible to support it. Popular literature trumps reasearch, apparently.
Research!!?? You are a sinner! You ate the forbidden fruit of knowledge, a crime that all true christians must atone for! Now stick crayons up your nose until you are with the Lawd again!!
(http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_OP1LjIo5mj8/SoiDujPwufI/AAAAAAAAALA/9fZvcy7QPWk/s400/crayon%2Bhomer.gif)
Quote from: Munch on September 19, 2014, 05:52:16 PM
Research!!?? You are a sinner! You ate the forbidden fruit of knowledge, a crime that all true christians must atone for!
I've got to say, I've puzzled over that part of Christian mythology for many years. Being so severely punished by God to the point that your children's children are severely punished FOREVER... for what? Seeking knowledge? (I presume you are suppose to obtain knowledge by eating from the tree of knowledge, but then again, the Bible is so logically unintelligible that maybe it means some other mysterious thing). What kind of loving father would want you not to seek knowledge? It makes no sense at all to me.
Quote from: SGOS on September 19, 2014, 06:29:31 PM
I've got to say, I've puzzled over that part of Christian mythology for many years. Being so severely punished by God to the point that your children's children are severely punished FOREVER... for what? Seeking knowledge? (I presume you are suppose to obtain knowledge by eating from the tree of knowledge, but then again, the Bible is so logically unintelligible that maybe it means some other mysterious thing). What kind of loving father would want you not to seek knowledge? It makes no sense at all to me.
Its beautiful really, knowledge is the ultimate pursuit for the truth, to open your mind to broader and newer ideas, so knowledge is of course the thing 'god' would fear the most, for those to discover the man behind the curtain.
When you look at the story of adam and eve in another light, its striking how dark it really is, god keeping is two creations in a bubble, telling them they can live a perfect life, but never to seek knowledge, for it might have them ask questions about gods plan, or reasons, his very existence. And when they started to gain knowledge, it went again gods plan, so he banished his creations, simply for approaching the possibility of asking the question.
That to me is the ultimate difference between religion and everyone outside of it, the christian does not ask because he is told what he has to think, while the non-theist asks the question, and seeks the answers, and never closes himself to seeking.
A person who gets paid a lot of money to fake his emotions should be understood to be exactly that, it really is silly to play more into it than that.
Quote from: aitm on September 19, 2014, 07:03:04 PM
A person who gets paid a lot of money to fake his emotions should be understood to be exactly that, it really is silly to play more into it than that.
I'm never sure what emotions Nicolas Cage is trying to portray half the time, but its fucking scary to look at.
Quote from: Munch on September 19, 2014, 07:01:43 PM
When you look at the story of adam and eve in another light, its striking how dark it really is,
Yes, it is dark. But you learn it as a little kid. It's familiar. Two children in a garden do something naughty, and their parent gets upset, so naturally they are punished. They are the one's at fault. At that age, you are too young to understand that perhaps the parent is a fault. Everything is familiar, so it makes sense.
In reality, the parent here is abusive, abusive to the max, wielding an incredibly out of proportion punishment for something that should be encouraged, rather than forbidden. The story is not about naughty children. It's about a God that has no ethics, love, or compassion, and sadistically punishes the entire world for thousands of years over an innocuous incident.
What I got out of the adam and eve story is that basically
1. "God" wants you to blindly follow without question.
2. He doesn't want you to be smarter than him.
3. There are severe punishments for not abiding by him. Your taught to FEAR him.
4. You have free will, but your free thinking will get you in trouble by not listening to him
5. The Devil will trick you
6. And women caused all of our problems and set forth the wheels in motion, so it's ok to hold them back and oppress them so it doesn't happen again.
To me it's the most basic and start of indoctrination and obviously written by man for control. This is supposed to explain how we got here and set the tone for the Bible.
Total BS of course
You have to admit living in a garden naked with a really hot woman just eating and fucking has its appeal and who wants to sit through boring classes to learn shit that you'll never use since everything is always supplied to you that you'll ever need? They couldn't even get a sunburn, but of course I'm just assuming that because there's no reference to A & E using Coppertoneâ,,¢ sunblock..
Quote from: dragonman73 on September 22, 2014, 07:51:20 AM
What I got out of the adam and eve story is that basically
1. "God" wants you to blindly follow without question.
2. He doesn't want you to be smarter than him.
3. There are severe punishments for not abiding by him. Your taught to FEAR him.
4. You have free will, but your free thinking will get you in trouble by not listening to him
5. The Devil will trick you
6. And women caused all of our problems and set forth the wheels in motion, so it's ok to hold them back and oppress them so it doesn't happen again.
To me it's the most basic and start of indoctrination and obviously written by man for control. This is supposed to explain how we got here and set the tone for the Bible.
Total BS of course
I agree with your assessment of Gen. 2--it is total BS created by a man.
But let me bounce this off of your comments.
Why do people always forget that the bible starts at Gen 1? In that section we are told that god created humankind in our (????) image--and so He created man and woman in 'our' image and pronounced it good. No adam, no eve, no garden. And men and women were created at the same time--no upper hand for either. After reading Gen. 1 and Gen. 2, the take away should be that one is forewarned about the bible. It is only consistent in it's inconsistency; almost always contradicts itself and can be used to support just about any position one wants to take.
I must be the only one anymore who could give a rats ass what these dumb shits believe.. I'm not watching their stupid movies and not debating shit that's not real and if they decide to enforce the shit at the end of a gun they can just go ahead and waste a bullet on me because I don't want to live in that world anyway.
Quote from: AllPurposeAtheist on September 22, 2014, 09:57:51 AM
I'm not watching their stupid movies and not debating shit that's not real
It's like watching a group of Star Trek nerds debating which deck of the Enterprise the transporter is on.
Quote from: SGOS on September 22, 2014, 10:44:14 AM
It's like watching a group of Star Trek nerds debating which deck of the Enterprise the transporter is on.
Well, not really--at least Star Trek had something real about it.
Quote from: Mike Cl on September 22, 2014, 09:14:41 AM
I agree with your assessment of Gen. 2--it is total BS created by a man.
But let me bounce this off of your comments.
Why do people always forget that the bible starts at Gen 1? In that section we are told that god created humankind in our (????) image--and so He created man and woman in 'our' image and pronounced it good. No adam, no eve, no garden. And men and women were created at the same time--no upper hand for either. After reading Gen. 1 and Gen. 2, the take away should be that one is forewarned about the bible. It is only consistent in it's inconsistency; almost always contradicts itself and can be used to support just about any position one wants to take.
Gen 1 "in our" image is one reason you have the Trinity, because there has to be a multiplicity to explain it. In Mormonism it is one of the missionary cues to explain a multiplicity of gods, and that also Jesus Christ is the pre-earth spiritual son of god; and the holy ghost, which in Mormonism is a separate personage. The Garden of Eden, like Noah's Ark and other Genesis stories comes from Babylonian legends. There are actually 2 accounts of Genesis.
http://skepticsannotatedbible.com/contra/accounts.html
In order to reconcile them, the Rabbis created the Midrash:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Midrash
QuoteIn Judaism, the Midrash (Hebrew: מ×"רש‎; plural midrashim) is the body of exegesis of Torah texts along with homiletic stories as taught by Chazal (Rabbinical Judaism sages of the post-Temple era) that provide an intrinsic analysis to passages in the Tanakh.
Midrash is a method of interpreting biblical stories that goes beyond simple distillation of religious, legal, or moral teachings. It fills in gaps left in the biblical narrative regarding events and personalities that are only hinted at.[1]
The purpose of midrash was to resolve problems in the interpretation of difficult passages of the text of the Hebrew Bible, using Rabbinic principles of hermeneutics and philology to align them with the religious and ethical values of religious teachers.
(The Tanakh is the canon of the Hebrew Bible)
And don't forget Lilith who was originally Adam's first wife. She got dumped from the Protestant bible and only Eve is mentioned.
http://witcombe.sbc.edu/eve-women/7evelilith.html
QuoteAccording to midrashic literature, Adam's first wife was not Eve but a woman named Lilith, who was created in the first Genesis account. Only when Lilith rebelled and abandoned Adam did God create Eve, in the second account, as a replacement. In an important 13th century Kabbalah text, the Sefer ha-Zohar ("The Book of Splendour") written by the Spaniard Moses de Leon (c. 1240-1305), it is explained that:
At the same time Jehovah created Adam, he created a woman, Lilith, who like Adam was taken from the earth. She was given to Adam as his wife. But there was a dispute between them about a matter that when it came before the judges had to be discussed behind closed doors. She spoke the unspeakable name of Jehovah and vanished.
Biblical scholars cannot give you a specific, clear line of transition from old to new testament because the source material is only partly known. The Septuagint, the Greek translation from Hebrew/Aramaic is one source that can be documented. Other sources, including the Midrash, played a part, but what and how is unknown.
Hi IS a jealous God. Remember? And the kicker is that the pursuit of knowledge is tied to evil, represented by the serpent. Question the word of God or pursue knowledge is viewed as inherent evil. You've got to hand it to the sons of bitches, they came up with a hell of a security system there.
When my mother, a Methodist, first told me the story of Genesis at six years old. I asked her if the person that was there wrote the story? Slap on the head; "people that ask questions like that go to hell." That was the end of her teaching me about the bible. My dad, an atheists, was delighted.
Quote from: Desdinova on September 22, 2014, 11:31:18 AM
Hi IS a jealous God. Remember? And the kicker is that the pursuit of knowledge is tied to evil, represented by the serpent. Question the word of God or pursue knowledge is viewed as inherent evil. You've got to hand it to the sons of bitches, they came up with a hell of a security system there.
Well said. I maintain that religion is based on four things:
guilt
fear
condemnation
judgment
They imply guilt with the concept of sin, impart fear that you will be punished eternally for it, condemn you for your conduct and then judge you, both by society and by the belief of a final judgment.
From Wikipedia
Saul Alinsky died at the age of 63 of a sudden, massive heart attack in 1972, on a street corner in Carmel, California. Two months previously, he had discussed life after death in his interview with Playboy:[4]
ALINSKY: ... if there is an afterlife, and I have anything to say about it, I will unreservedly choose to go to hell.
PLAYBOY: Why?
ALINSKY: Hell would be heaven for me. All my life I've been with the have-nots. Over here, if you're a have-not, you're short of dough. If you're a have-not in hell, you're short of virtue. Once I get into hell, I'll start organizing the have-nots over there.
PLAYBOY: Why them?
ALINSKY: They're my kind of people.
Let's you know why Alinsky is the boogeyman of the right.
Quote from: Desdinova on September 22, 2014, 11:31:18 AM
You've got to hand it to the sons of bitches, they came up with a hell of a security system there.
I wonder how much of the scam is actually calculated by the charlatans that start up religions. I think some of it is just being in the right place at the right time. And some of these religious claims are so off the wall and absurd that it's more like these ideas get thrown against the wall like political claims and accusations during campaigns. You never can understand why some stick and some don't, but that ones that end up sticking are harvested, cultivated, and exploited, regardless of whether they have substance or not. Some religions actually find their way out of cult status, but hundreds more attempts just die off quickly. Is there much rhyme or reason involved? I wonder.
Would anyone be shocked and upset if I said I don't much give a fuck what's in any of those books because I don't believe a word of them? :shhh:
Quote from: SGOS on September 22, 2014, 12:29:38 PM
I wonder how much of the scam is actually calculated by the charlatans that start up religions. I think some of it is just being in the right place at the right time. And some of these religious claims are so off the wall and absurd that it's more like these ideas get thrown against the wall like political claims and accusations during campaigns. You never can understand why some stick and some don't, but that ones that end up sticking are harvested, cultivated, and exploited, regardless of whether they have substance or not. Some religions actually find their way out of cult status, but hundreds more attempts just die off quickly. Is there much rhyme or reason involved? I wonder.
Throw enough shit at a Teflon wall and some is bound to stick..
Quote from: AllPurposeAtheist on September 22, 2014, 12:30:22 PM
Would anyone be shocked and upset if I said I don't much give a fuck what's in any of those books because I don't believe a word of them? :shhh:
FFS APA we would be shocked and upset if you did!
Quote
According to midrashic literature, Adam's first wife was not Eve but a woman named Lilith, who was created in the first Genesis account. Only when Lilith rebelled and abandoned Adam did God create Eve, in the second account, as a replacement. In an important 13th century Kabbalah text, the Sefer ha-Zohar ("The Book of Splendour") written by the Spaniard Moses de Leon (c. 1240-1305), it is explained that:
At the same time Jehovah created Adam, he created a woman, Lilith, who like Adam was taken from the earth. She was given to Adam as his wife. But there was a dispute between them about a matter that when it came before the judges had to be discussed behind closed doors. She spoke the unspeakable name of Jehovah and vanished.
Yes, I'm familiar with the idea of midrash. But it is simply those involved in the jewish religion wishing to create reasons that the two totally different stories could be linked. It is made from whole cloth. The various 'books' of the bible is usually something retold from other cultures. Midrash is often just made up stories. At least, that is how I see it. As for the "our" in Gen. 1 being the holy (holey, actually) trinity, that is another attempt to make up a reason to reconcile the two different stories and to give substance to an idea that is not really anywhere else in the OT. One thing christians are not afraid of doing is making stuff up when they find the inconsistencies of the bible too much to deal with. the holy trinity is basically the wholly made up trinity.
Quote from: stromboli on September 22, 2014, 11:38:23 AM
Well said. I maintain that religion is based on four things:
guilt
fear
condemnation
judgment
They imply guilt with the concept of sin, impart fear that you will be punished eternally for it, condemn you for your conduct and then judge you, both by society and by the belief of a final judgment.
Yeah, that pretty much hits the nail on the head! And fear is the real driving force behind religion. which is why the current Rep. party is made up of so many christian types--they use fear almost as well as religion.
Quote from: Desdinova on September 22, 2014, 11:31:18 AM
Hi IS a jealous God. Remember? And the kicker is that the pursuit of knowledge is tied to evil, represented by the serpent. Question the word of God or pursue knowledge is viewed as inherent evil. You've got to hand it to the sons of bitches, they came up with a hell of a security system there.
Your statement, with guilt, fear, condemnation, and judgement added in creates a great formula for religion. All seem to have them to one degree or another.
Quote from: SGOS on September 19, 2014, 08:19:52 AM
http://www.christianpost.com/news/left-behind-fans-question-nicolas-cages-faith-wonder-about-actual-rapture-before-films-release-111780/
More silly baloney from Christian movie goers.
One guy interviewed wondered if he would get raptured before the movie was released and not be able to see the movie at all.
Wow. If that doesn't demonstrate the arrogance inherent in faith, nothing does.
I remember my Grandma and Aunts telling me how the sky would open up and Christ would return and there would be this great war where God kicked everyone's ass. There would be rivers of blood, hordes of angles decending from the heavens as Gabriel's horn blew, and all the Christians would be lifted up into the arms of God. I'm six years old and they are telling me this shit with a smile on their face like it would be the greatest thing ever. And I'm just sitting there frozen in fear, thinking how it would be such a horrible thing, for this beautiful and amazing world to end like that. I would have fucking nightmares about that shit and spent my days glancing at the sky hoping not to see a big opening with Jesus and his posse coming through. Now years later to think I lived in fear of that shit for more than half my life pisses me off. I knew there was something wrong all along and didn't know what it was until I got the balls to finally deny all that crap. It just fucking pisses me the fuck off!
Quote from: Desdinova on September 22, 2014, 04:19:10 PM
I remember my Grandma and Aunts telling me how the sky would open up and Christ would return and there would be this great war where God kicked everyone's ass. There would be rivers of blood, hordes of angles decending from the heavens as Gabriel's horn blew, and all the Christians would be lifted up into the arms of God. I'm six years old and they are telling me this shit with a smile on their face like it would be the greatest thing ever. And I'm just sitting there frozen in fear, thinking how it would be such a horrible thing, for this beautiful and amazing world to end like that. I would have fucking nightmares about that shit and spent my days glancing at the sky hoping not to see a big opening with Jesus and his posse coming through. Now years later to think I lived in fear of that shit for more than half my life pisses me off. I knew there was something wrong all along and didn't know what it was until I got the balls to finally deny all that crap. It just fucking pisses me the fuck off!
Sometimes I'm also a little irked that I spent so much of my life in fundamentalist fear instilled by my grandmother. The fear lingered even after I decided it was probably bunk, but more than anything, I'm happy that I learned to reason and overcame that fear in the end. It was a shitty way to live, and unlike many fundies who are so god-damned sure they've been saved, even though they are self absorbed assholes who would burn in Hell if there was a god, I had no delusions that I could ever live up to demands of the god of my grandmother.
If there ever were a rapture, I wonder how many of those arrogant fundamentalists, made in the image of a loving god, would find their sorry asses standing in the street after the rapture was over?
Quote from: Desdinova on September 22, 2014, 04:19:10 PM
I remember my Grandma and Aunts telling me how the sky would open up and Christ would return and there would be this great war where God kicked everyone's ass. There would be rivers of blood, hordes of angles decending from the heavens as Gabriel's horn blew, and all the Christians would be lifted up into the arms of God. I'm six years old and they are telling me this shit with a smile on their face like it would be the greatest thing ever. And I'm just sitting there frozen in fear, thinking how it would be such a horrible thing, for this beautiful and amazing world to end like that. I would have fucking nightmares about that shit and spent my days glancing at the sky hoping not to see a big opening with Jesus and his posse coming through. Now years later to think I lived in fear of that shit for more than half my life pisses me off. I knew there was something wrong all along and didn't know what it was until I got the balls to finally deny all that crap. It just fucking pisses me the fuck off!
Wow! Love the hula hoop girl! Yeah, I went through the whole Rapture thing pretty thoroughly as a Christian. What did it for me was the fact that one of my mentors in becoming a Chrisitan was a Messianic Jew. He pointed out that the word rapture is from the latin word raptus and is not translated from Hebrew. That, and if you read Revelations, there is no really good spot to insert the Rapture except at the beginning of the Tribulation, which creates problems for what comes after. there is also Gog and Magog- which is mentioned toward the end of Revelations and prophecied in Daniel. And also the concept of rapture didn't come about until 1830 and was never mentioned before that.
Quote from: Desdinova on September 22, 2014, 04:19:10 PM
I remember my Grandma and Aunts telling me how the sky would open up and Christ would return and there would be this great war where God kicked everyone's ass. There would be rivers of blood, hordes of angles decending from the heavens as Gabriel's horn blew, and all the Christians would be lifted up into the arms of God. I'm six years old and they are telling me this shit with a smile on their face like it would be the greatest thing ever. And I'm just sitting there frozen in fear, thinking how it would be such a horrible thing, for this beautiful and amazing world to end like that. I would have fucking nightmares about that shit and spent my days glancing at the sky hoping not to see a big opening with Jesus and his posse coming through. Now years later to think I lived in fear of that shit for more than half my life pisses me off. I knew there was something wrong all along and didn't know what it was until I got the balls to finally deny all that crap. It just fucking pisses me the fuck off!
I'm sorry to hear that :(. In what I tell my boyfriend, who had a massive tits for a father, we can choose our family, but we can't choose our relatives, and sadly are grained by the fucked up forced teachings of our parents until we learn better then they do.
This perpetuation that just because the older generation IS older doesn't mean its smarter. The stupidest parents could have the smartest of children, and yet still consider their teachings more profound then anything the child gets from university, Academic or Ph.D, even more so for religious parents who have these fucked up stories floating around in their heads about the apocalypse.
Thanks Munch. It really can be disturbing to little kids. They believe their parents and close adult relatives without question. So when they are told that if they don't accept Jesus and follow all the rules they will be cast into a burning lake of fire where they will suffer for fucking ever, they believe it. I was scared to go to sleep at night, thinking that what if the world ends in my sleep and because I stole a cookie today I will be automatically cast into Lake Hellfire and burn for ever. That my friends is a powerful indoctrination technique that can last a lifetime.
Think of the opportunities here. Somebody like a Kevin Smith (Dogma) doing a "Left Behind" satire wherein the fundies get left behind and only stoner hipsters get saved, something of that nature. That "Leftovers" on HBO hasn't caught my interest, so I don't care about that. But a movie where some obvious craziness involved, like a busload of fundies suddenly deprived of a driver while going down the freeway could be fun. :lol:
Quote from: AllPurposeAtheist on September 22, 2014, 12:30:22 PM
Would anyone be shocked and upset if I said I don't much give a fuck what's in any of those books because I don't believe a word of them? :shhh:
Ditto.................
Well none of us do really care whats in them, but it is both funny and interesting to see the workings of how these people think and what they base their conception of real life on. In a similar way to how primates react to other primates.. though that's insulting to monkeys and gorillas