Why do you believe?

[Eve]

[quote="FrankDK

[leo]

So Eve were is the evidence ? Your claims about your deity talking to you isn't evidence .

[Eve]

[quote="leo

[goodwithoutgod]

I do not have anywhere near such an issue with those who state "I believe in God" to those who state "there is a God". The first only makes certain people feel good about themselves and no more so than believing in Santa Claus of Easter Bunny. The latter statement is not so much of "belief" but implies "knowledge" which requires evidence to back up those claims. Belief, by definition is full of vagaries, like I often like may utter words such as "I believe my football team is going to win today", belief on that occasion was only just a word that spurred me on to barrack (or "root" in the US)  a little hard and that was all.

Gotta love knowledge statements when proffered in relation to faith.

[Solitary]

Damned Eve, you can read minds too now besides communicating with God. Wow! :roll:  Solitary

[goodwithoutgod]

Why do you believe?

Why do I believe in what? it depends. Right?

believing on the basis of insufficient evidence cannot point one towards the truth.

Sometimes it can. If I believe that I can walk on the wire/robe I may walk on the wire/robe. Then I believed in what was true.
But if I don't believe I will NEVER walk on the wire/robe

"no amount of belief makes something a fact" - James Randi

UNLESS if you do what Jesus Christ said to do.  You make an experiment. Then you will know if it was true on not because you will have facts.
First I have to believe that I can walk on the wire/robe. Then I make an experiment. I am learning to walk on the wire. Then I walk(FACT). I believed in what was true.

Every thinker has questions, why are we here, how did we get here, etc etc...big questions right? Faith doesn't answer those questions because faith is based on blind belief without supporting evidence. It is a faulty reasoning method. You cannot truly posit that "I have a personal relationship with god" because there is zero evidence of a god, and unless you are the only person in the history of mankind that has had intimate communication with the supernatural....it is a one sided conversation...you are the one coming up with the answers, not a supernatural entity. So I will ask the believers the hard introspective question again...why do you believe?

You are right. But nobody claims that faith gives answers to those questions: who am I? where did I come from? why am I here? where am I going?
Faith is trust and something that makes you to ACT.

Positing make-believe metaphysical entities is a consequence of a deeper epistemological problem. Belief in god is not the problem per se. Belief without evidence is the problem. Warrantless, dogged confidence is the problem. Epistemological arrogance masquerading as humility is the problem. Faith is the problem. Belief in an imagined metaphysical entity...god...is a symptom of these larger attitudinal and critical thinking skill-based deficiencies, one that is supported and made possible primarily by faith, and also by social and cultural elements and institutions that are covariant with, and supportive of, faith. Belief in god is one consequence of a failed epistemology, with social and cultural mechanisms that both prop up this metaphysical belief and stifle epistemological challenges.

I have found, in my opinion, that there are five reasons why otherwise reasonable people embrace absurd propositions.

1) They have a history of not formulating their beliefs on the basis of evidence.
2) They formulate their beliefs on what they thought was reliable evidence but wasn't (e.g. the perception of the testament of the holy spirit)
3) They have never been exposed to competing epistemologies and beliefs.
4) They yield to social pressures.
5) They devalue truth or are relativists.

You say no one states that faith leads to truth, but is rather trust. Based on what I ask again? Why do you believe? because the book written by a group of superstitious, agenda based, delusional old men that was pushed by the nicene council says so? No, you are smarter than that, surely you base it on something more substantial...so what then? Why do you believe in god? You hear voices? You have some sort of special "privileged" communication device the rest of the world lacks? Please quantify your reply...

[FrankDK]

> Not so fast with conclusion, my friend. How about I have a little problem with my "IF I believe"?

So you don't believe any more than I do, which is what I suspected all along.

But the scripture I referenced doesn't say, "If you believe enough," it says "if you believe."

If "believe" means "believe enough," then what happens to John 3:16:  "God so loved the world that he gave his only begotten son, that whosoever believeth enough shall have life everlasting."

Wouldn't the standard for believing enough be the same, since God never changes?  That means if you don't believe enough that everything you ask for in prayer happens, then you don't believe enough to be saved.

Good thing Hell is only a story.

Frank

[goodwithoutgod]

> Not so fast with conclusion, my friend. How about I have a little problem with my "IF I believe"?

So you don't believe any more than I do, which is what I suspected all along.

But the scripture I referenced doesn't say, "If you believe enough," it says "if you believe."

If "believe" means "believe enough," then what happens to John 3:16:  "God so loved the world that he gave his only begotten son, that whosoever believeth enough shall have life everlasting."

Wouldn't the standard for believing enough be the same, since God never changes?  That means if you don't believe enough that everything you ask for in prayer happens, then you don't believe enough to be saved.

Good thing Hell is only a story.

Frank

I like frank's intimate knowledge of scripture, it may even be better than mine  :-k

[ApostateLois]

Not so fast with conclusion, my friend. How about I have a little problem with my "IF I believe"?

But you DO believe. You believe everything that Jesus said is true. You have faith that God answers prayers. You even make the positive claim that he DOES answer your prayers, that he makes promises and keeps them. Well, this is a promise of Jesus, that he will grant you anything you ask for in prayer, if you believe.

 Now, there are millions who pray in Jesus' name every day. They pray for some really important things, too, such as a mother who prays for her sick child to be healed of cancer. She has faith, she believes with all of her heart that Jesus will hear her prayer and answer it. She prays with tears and fasting, begging God to be merciful, throwing herself on the promise of Jesus that he will give her whatever she asks for. And even with all of that, her child dies of cancer.

That, my friend, is called a broken promise. It means that the Bible lies to us and cannot be trusted. It provides us with a claim--that Jesus will grant WHATEVER you want if you just believe--but then provides no evidence to back up that claim. Whenever people follow this advice, they find again and again that it is bad advice, because God does not deliver on his promise. What would you say to the broken-hearted mother who lost her child to cancer, even though she prayed and believed and had faith? Losing a child, I understand, is the worst thing that a parent can experience. It devastates a family for years, decades, a lifetime. People who have had to bury a child can tell you that the grief is like a knife in the heart. Yet God stands by and does nothing while that child slowly dies and a family is left shattered with heartache. Broken promises are no promises at all. Don't go around making them if you aren't going to keep them.

[Eve]

[quote="Solitary

[Smartmarzipan]

Damned Eve, you can read minds too now besides communicating with God. Wow! :roll:  Solitary

I can?! Why do you say this strange thing?

[Eve]

[quote="

[Eve]

So you d

[Eve]

But you DO believe. You believe everything that Jesus said is true. You have fa

[mykcob4]

Why do you believe? because the book written by a group of superstitious, agenda based, delusional old men that was pushed by the nicene council says so? No, you are smarter than that, surely you base it on something more substantial...so what then? Why do you believe in god? You hear voices? You have some sort of special "privileged" communication device the rest of the world lacks? Please quantify your reply...

I have faith in God Who is Creator of our world because I received a revelation. If I didn't receive this revelation I would probable still be an atheist.
I am one of the children of God. I am His daughter. God speaks to His children when He knows they will listen to Him and trust Him.
When I received a revelation I KNEW that God lives/ He is real. And I knew that He loves me and I love Him. Before that moment I didn't know that God loves me and that I loved Him.
Conclusion: the FOUNDATION of my faith is PERSONAL testimony.

All you know is complete and utter bullshit. What you know is what has been brainwashed into your feeble brain. You parrot crap that other people have told you. You display a complte lack of independent thought. You are completely dishonest to everyone but more importantlt to yourself.
Personal testimony? Yeah right as if there is anything as reliable as people spreading lies and claiming that they have had an intimate relationship/conversation with this myth that they call god.
I don't doubt for one minute that you actually think that you have talked to this god. I know how weak and impressionable your mind is, how uneducated and ignorant you are, and how lost and confussed you are. That is evident from the very first post you wrote on this forum. You and people like you want something. You're too stupid, too ignorant, too uneducated, and too lazy to actually think for yourself or actually do any real research to find out the facts.
You're a fucking lost cause because you won't take personnal responsibility to think critically. You keep justifying your mental weakness. You keep apologizing for a myth. There is no rational for it, none whatsoever. You hate me because I bring it plain and simple and FACTUAL just how fucking dumb you really are. You don't want to face it. You can't because you're affraid of the truth. If you believe in your god so much just try living life the way the bible really dictates that you should. I know that will be hard because the bible is filled with contradictions and doesn't actually make sense.
1) You should not retain material wealth.
2) You should give to the weak and the poor and ask for nothing in return....INSTEAD ABOUT COMPLAING ABOUT OBAMA.
In otherwords just be a hobo like jesus and trust that your god feeds you and keeps you from harm.
After all jesus was nothing more than a bisexual begger that didn't do any work, commited crimes like theft, sat around and got high all the time, slept with anything and anyone, never took responsibility for anything, blamed things on a make believe devil, lied to people saying he was the son of a mythical comicbook charater. And thats if he really existed at all, which he probably didn't given Roman records.