The first corporation as moved from "expressing disdain" about discriminatory laws passed by a state to actually doing something (http://www.latimes.com/business/hiltzik/la-fi-hiltzik-paypal-nc-20160405-snap-htmlstory.html) as PayPal cancels a planned expansion in North Carolina in response to the recent law they passed allowing people to discriminate against gays. The first shot of what I hope to be many has been fired at state-sponsored hate and bigotry.
I don't blame them, though this move punishes Charlotte more than McCrory, and Charlotte was (until recently) the one with the rule accommodating transgender people.
Charlotte's actually getting screwed over by both parties. McCrory reverses their ordinance because he's an asshole and Paypal won't expand there because they're mad with McCrory.
QuoteThus far, McCrory has portrayed himself and his state as victims of "political threats and economic retaliation," which seems accurate enough. Thus far he has refused to relent, insisting through a spokesman that he would resist “a well-coordinated, national campaign to smear our state’s reputation after we passed a common-sense law to ensure no government can take away our basic expectations of privacy in bathrooms, locker rooms and showers.â€
This is why I can't stand this guy. He does something stupid, it becomes national news and gets a lot of flak. The state even loses business over it. His response: "my stupid decision was a great decision and yall just haters." :embarrassed:
Yes, it's a shame Charlottee will take the hit over this.
PayPal needs the space! I'm getting dozens of reports of suspicious activity in my account. They must be very busy sorting those out.
This is the first comment I've seen on the laws giving Christians the right to discriminate, and it's more like a blurp made in passing by an Obama advisor, who was there to be interviewed on a different issue. I haven't heard anything from an actual official yet. Although, the ACLU appears busy getting ready to take the new laws to court. In my mind, I thought the issue had been settled by the Supreme Court. But no. Wait! Let's just pass a bunch of new state laws that contradict the SC. How is that even possible?
I assume officials haven't commented because 1) They would rather not, or 2)They (like me) would never outguess the courts. But the states that are doing this seem like they might be engaging in a kind of civil disobedience. They call this religious freedom, and that certainly has a positive ring to it, but it's actually demanding the freedom to deny freedom. It's like they almost get there with the freedom thing, but don't quite fully grasp the concept yet.
https://www.yahoo.com/katiecouric/valerie-jarrett-on-the-white-1401849343565878.html
QuoteThe Department of Justice and other federal agencies are scrutinizing new state laws that some call legalized discrimination against gay, bisexual and transgender people, President Obama’s senior adviser told Yahoo Global News Anchor Katie Couric on Wednesday.
Valerie Jarrett said what, if any, action may be taken against Mississippi’s and North Carolina’s so-called religious freedom legislation is still to be determined.
“We’ll be interested in hearing what their findings are,†Jarrett said during a live interview. “But they are certainly taking a look at the parameters of the impact of these laws.â€
So are these laws going down, or are others wondering if there's a chance that they may have any legal merit?
The Supreme Court, the Catholic Church and Hobby Lobby ... opened this can of worms. Southern Protestants are just carpet bagging ;-)
We've been sold a bill of sale with the states rights issue. This is one nation and not 50 sovereign nations,but many seem to think that their state should have all the power over the federal government because federal government..ohhhh...spooky! They try to make it sound as if a state law always makes more sense than a federal law.
The most ridiculous thing is that you can drive from say..Maine to California in four days and along the way go from being a perfectly law abiding citizen to a potential felon, back to law abiding, back to felon and once again law abiding just by perfectly legally crossing state lines..
Quote from: AllPurposeAtheist on April 07, 2016, 12:40:37 AM
We've been sold a bill of sale with the states rights issue. This is one nation and not 50 sovereign nations,but many seem to think that their state should have all the power over the federal government because federal government..ohhhh...spooky! They try to make it sound as if a state law always makes more sense than a federal law.
When somebody starts on that shit I ask them why they don't support "county right" or "city rights" or "neighborhood rights".
Quote
The most ridiculous thing is that you can drive from say..Maine to California in four days and along the way go from being a perfectly law abiding citizen to a potential felon, back to law abiding, back to felon and once again law abiding just by perfectly legally crossing state lines..
Or you could just leave that gun at home.
Bruce Springsteen cancels NC tour date over bathroom bill (http://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-36000905)
Losing jobs is one thing, but this really hits us where it hurts. We already have a dearth of good music around here, so pulling what little we get is devastating. Just look at the list (http://www.greensborocoliseum.com/events/upcoming), the next good upcoming concert is Weird Al, but that's not until June.
Look, a lot of us aren't happy about this thing. We'll fix this, just give us a little time. Don't make us a pariah state just yet, okay?
Quote from: Gawdzilla Sama on April 07, 2016, 07:01:28 AM
When somebody starts on that shit I ask them why they don't support "county right" or "city rights" or "neighborhood rights". Or you could just leave that gun at home.
Down in the 'hood ... it is neighborhood rights ... particularly if you are wearing the wrong gang colors ;-(
Quote from: Baruch on April 09, 2016, 12:15:57 PM
Down in the 'hood ... it is neighborhood rights ... particularly if you are wearing the wrong gang colors ;-(
Block Party.
Quote from: Hydra009 on April 09, 2016, 12:13:19 PM
Look, a lot of us aren't happy about this thing. We'll fix this, just give us a little time. Don't make us a pariah state just yet, okay?
Is there enough NCers to bring pressure on the legislators, or will this be corrected by the Supreme Court? Or is it just a matter of North Carolina evolving over time? I don't think most people want NC to be a pariah, except maybe the media. I don't think Pay Pal or Springsteen wish the state ill either. I think they are just trying to apply pressure. Montana often strikes me as a pariah. It's not the progressive state I would hope for, and we have enough wacky little churches in my home town that we could be the envy of the Bible Belt. I would welcome outside help, especially in protecting what's left of Montana's once splendid environment. And I do hope your state progresses. I get no joy out of the deprecation of North Carolina.
Quote from: Hydra009 on April 09, 2016, 12:13:19 PM
Look, a lot of us aren't happy about this thing. We'll fix this, just give us a little time. Don't make us a pariah state just yet, okay?
(http://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-36000905)
Gawd damn, son! Ya's already in the Bible Belt, same as us'ns.
Quote from: Hydra009 on April 09, 2016, 12:13:19 PM
Look, a lot of us aren't happy about this thing. We'll fix this, just give us a little time. Don't make us a pariah state just yet, okay?
For a while there we were taking vacations in the outer banks every year. We found a nice rental house right on the beach that was awesome for us. We loved it.
Then the voters in your state saw fit to amend the state constitution to make same sex marriage illegal. No business in NC has seen a single dime of our vacation budget ever since. Did we expect our little boycott to change any minds in NC? Of course not. Its more a matter of if that's how you as a state feel about how people should be treated, then this is how I as a person feel about associating with any of you.
So I feel your pain if you're living there and also not happy about how things have gone. But give you time to fix it? That gay marriage amendment was like 4 years ago. The voters of your state have a long track record of proudly hating gay people and nothing seems to be changing. The rest of us quite frankly, are tired of waiting for the few hold out non-bigot voters to get their shit together. I don't envy you the position you're in. But you've had more than enough time to fix things IMO.
Quote from: SGOS on April 09, 2016, 12:44:11 PMIs there enough NCers to bring pressure on the legislators, or will this be corrected by the Supreme Court? Or is it just a matter of North Carolina evolving over time?
It's different every time something like this happens, but some combination of the above is likely. This one garnered small protests and a slew of extremely bad press (two words: national embarrassment). Ordinarily, the Republicans might try to stand their ground and hope it blows over. But this bill is likely to have a serious economic cost (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Public_Facilities_Privacy_%26_Security_Act#Commercial) far beyond what the Republicans might be willing to tolerate. It's only a matter of time until the decision is reversed, one way or another.
Quote from: Johan on April 09, 2016, 02:13:46 PMFor a while there we were taking vacations in the outer banks every year. We found a nice rental house right on the beach that was awesome for us. We loved it.
Then the voters in your state saw fit to amend the state constitution to make same sex marriage illegal. No business in NC has seen a single dime of our vacation budget ever since.
Yes, and it was the 30th (and last) state to do that. And ~38% voted against it. And 2 years later, it got struck down (http://www.charlotteobserver.com/news/local/article9200495.html). And the Supreme Court ruling effectively ended the issue once and for all.
QuoteSo I feel your pain if you're living there and also not happy about how things have gone. But give you time to fix it? That gay marriage amendment was like 4 years ago.
And it's been over and done with for a year and a half.
QuoteThe voters of your state have a long track record of proudly hating gay people and nothing seems to be changing.
By and large, they're certainly bigoted, though North Carolina has made the same transition on gay marriage (http://www.publicpolicypolling.com/main/2015/06/gay-marriage-reaches-record-support-in-nc.html) that the country as a whole has made.
Look, Amendment 1 was shitty move. And obviously, I don't agree with these people about that. I don't know of many places where I agree with everyone about everything. But the public's views are changing, both the country and the state - North Carolina changing, too. This is just the defeated party's last tantrums - it's been going on in Georgia, it's been going on in Mississippi, and it's also been going on in North Carolina. It will pass.
(https://qph.is.quoracdn.net/main-qimg-beac5c9e17f64a6c5ccacecdbd992e3f?convert_to_webp=true)
A man does not choose his companions.
Quote from: Hydra009 on April 09, 2016, 03:37:42 PM
This is just the defeated party's last tantrums - it's been going on in Georgia, it's been going on in Mississippi, and it's also been going on in North Carolina. It will pass.
I hope you're right.
Quote from: Hydra009 on April 09, 2016, 03:37:42 PM
But the public's views are changing, both the country and the state - North Carolina changing, too. This is just the defeated party's last tantrums - it's been going on in Georgia, it's been going on in Mississippi, and it's also been going on in North Carolina. It will pass.
Eventually it will pass, and the bigots will get on with their lives once they realize it's possible to be happy without shitting on other people.
Quote from: SGOS on April 09, 2016, 09:43:23 PM
Eventually it will pass, and the bigots will get on with their lives once they realize it's possible to be happy without shitting on other people.
When it comes to most bigots, I just don't think its that simple. I think with lots of them, as long as groups who are not like them exist and enjoy the exact same rights they do, they will always find it impossible to be happy.
Quote from: Johan on April 10, 2016, 12:37:45 AM
When it comes to most bigots, I just don't think its that simple. I think with lots of them, as long as groups who are not like them exist and enjoy the exact same rights they do, they will always find it impossible to be happy.
I agree. This is where "death" comes in. There are some bigoted assholes who will simply always be bigoted assholes. But some day, they'll die. Take Scalia, for example. If he had lived to be a thousand he never would have become less of a douchebag. But now he's dead and he's not a douche at all any more. Being dead has made him a better person. Unfortunately, that's just what it takes for some people.
PayPal? chicken feed! The real ban, with real impact, is now underway! XHampster has banned any person from NC to log on to it's site. That's porn my friends! If anything will hurt NC it will be the lose of one of the biggest providers of porn in the world. How do you really punish the bible-belt states? Take away their porn!
Quote from: Mike Cl on April 11, 2016, 06:23:41 PMPayPal? chicken feed! The real ban, with real impact, is now underway! XHampster has banned any person from NC to log on to it's site. That's porn my friends! If anything will hurt NC it will be the lose of one of the biggest providers of porn in the world. How do you really punish the bible-belt states? Take away their porn!
It just displays an angry popup. I know because a friend of mine checked it for me.
While I agree with the message, it seems like a bad way of going about it. Pressure the people who are in charge, not some lowly jagoff (literally).
So.... is it all just hamster on hamster action or do they have hamster on person porn too?
Quote from: Johan on April 11, 2016, 09:50:13 PM
So.... is it all just hamster on hamster action or do they have hamster on person porn too?
Quote from: Hydra009 on April 11, 2016, 08:46:31 PM
While I agree with the message, it seems like a bad way of going about it. Pressure the people who are in charge, not some lowly jagoff (literally).
Keep in mind that Paypal's decision is not necessarily punitive in nature. A large corporation wanting to hang on to the most creative elements of it's workforce, may simply prefer settling in a state where laws are not designed to create hardships for some of its more valuable workers, some of which might be integral parts of the company's management itself.
Quote from: SGOS on April 12, 2016, 08:15:32 AM
Keep in mind that Paypal's decision is not necessarily punitive in nature. A large corporation wanting to hang on to the most creative elements of it's workforce, may simply prefer settling in a state where laws are not designed to create hardships for some of its more valuable workers, some of which might be integral parts of the company's management itself.
That may well be the case. It really doesn't matter to me. What matters to me is the fascinating implosion of the religious right right now. They have spent decades telling people that the way to really help America is for the people to lay down in the dirt and let large corporations march right over them, then thank the corporations for any injuries they suffered as a result and now not only are they turning on themselves, not only has their alarmist propaganda turned a large portion of their constituency and, thus, their party into raving lunatics, but now even their precious corporations are turning on them. It's not big oil or anything, but PayPal isn't exactly a tiny company. And while they may have private reasoning influencing their decisions, their public reasons are what's important here, especially when others, like Bruce Springsteen, pile it on too.
Quote from: SGOS on April 12, 2016, 08:15:32 AM
Keep in mind that Paypal's decision is not necessarily punitive in nature. A large corporation wanting to hang on to the most creative elements of it's workforce, may simply prefer settling in a state where laws are not designed to create hardships for some of its more valuable workers, some of which might be integral parts of the company's management itself.
My quote was in reference to the Xhamster thing.
Quote from: Hydra009 on April 12, 2016, 11:29:06 AM
My quote was in reference to the Xhamster thing.
Yeah, I wondered about that.
Quote from: widdershins on April 12, 2016, 11:05:58 AM
That may well be the case. It really doesn't matter to me. What matters to me is the fascinating implosion of the religious right right now. They have spent decades telling people that the way to really help America is for the people to lay down in the dirt and let large corporations march right over them, then thank the corporations for any injuries they suffered as a result and now not only are they turning on themselves, not only has their alarmist propaganda turned a large portion of their constituency and, thus, their party into raving lunatics, but now even their precious corporations are turning on them. It's not big oil or anything, but PayPal isn't exactly a tiny company. And while they may have private reasoning influencing their decisions, their public reasons are what's important here, especially when others, like Bruce Springsteen, pile it on too.
I suspect that the Religious Right's ties to corporate rule were just an affiliation with the Republican Party: "Do whatever you want, and we will support you, as long as you promise to make abortion illegal."
Quote from: SGOS on April 12, 2016, 12:42:31 PM
I suspect that the Religious Right's ties to corporate rule were just an affiliation with the Republican Party: "Do whatever you want, and we will support you, as long as you promise to make abortion illegal."
I remember reading something, I believe within the last year or so, about the Republican party actually starting a courtship with religion at some point for the votes. The corporate overlords are their real masters for most of them, but religion is an overflowing source of stupidity and bigotry which can easily be tapped with the right rhetoric and fear mongering. Over the years religion and Republicans have kind of melded. There are some religions where they believe it is their duty and right to take government office when possible to steer the country toward whatever particular cliff they wish we would all jump off from, so when the Republicans tied that knot they inadvertently laid the groundwork for their own takeover, just like they did with the Tea Party.
Really I don't know how the party has survived in any real sense this long. They keep finding fringe groups full of stupid and anger and aligning themselves with those groups only to have those groups all but take over the party until now they're this disjointed group of a-holes who are so opinionated and difficult to get along with that they can't even come together sensibly on common goals. It's like having a party of Rosie O'Donnells, but all with different opinions.
But they have some pretty smart people on their side, holding the party together somehow, and with the goal of winning "by any means necessary". They have no problem with cheating at every turn. They rig elections with redistricting, disenfranchise voters who are unlikely to vote Republican, run smear campaigns designed as legal proceedings against Democrats (Bill and Hillary have both seen this in abundance), spread misinformation, outright lie about the purpose of bills they're trying to pass, bitch and whine about how any election they lost wasn't fair, at least try to find a reason to impeach any duly elected Democrat president, offer "compromises" in the form of "You capitulate on this list of partisan demands and we won't burn the country down"... In short the "religious" right is the slimiest bunch of politicians on the planet, as far as I can tell.
Update:
McCrory backpedaled a little bit and amended the bill (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Public_Facilities_Privacy_%26_Security_Act#Efforts_to_repeal_or_modify), though it's little changed and done purely to give a false sense of compromise in order to placate detractors. That didn't work and the opposition continues to mount.
NASCAR came out against it (http://www.motorsport.com/nascar-cup/news/nascar-s-brian-france-says-sport-opposes-controversial-new-n-c-law-689418/). Their chairman is allegedly working behind the scenes to change the law. Obama says the law should be overturned (http://www.wral.com/obama-says-hb2-should-be-overturned/15657287/). Even Trump was critical of it (http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/donald-trump-north-carolina-bathroom-bill_us_5718ca1ee4b0c9244a7aec8c).
And what's more, a federal appeals court (http://abcnews.go.com/US/wireStory/court-overturns-virginia-schools-transgender-bathroom-rule-38513822) ruled that a Virginia school that forced a transexual boy to use the men's bathroom violated a federal anti-discrimination law. Since NC is in the same jurisdiction, this ruling will almost certainly affect our infamous bathroom bill.
I predict this bill will be dead by the end of this year.
The NBA just pulled the AllStar game from NC.. That in itself isn't much, but these things are going to add up and NC along with other states with similar agendas are going to pay the piper..
I hope that all the KKK elements can be concentrated into their home ranges ... so we can more effectively nuke them ;-( The advent of the automobile allowed them to spread thru all the other states.
Quote from: Baruch on April 23, 2016, 09:07:15 PM
I hope that all the KKK elements can be concentrated into their home ranges ... so we can more effectively nuke them ;-( The advent of the automobile allowed them to spread thru all the other states.
I grew up near one of their strongholds, a shitty little shithole on the map called Greenville Ohio..
Quote from: Hydra009 on April 23, 2016, 03:48:44 PM
Update:
McCrory backpedaled a little bit and amended the bill (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Public_Facilities_Privacy_%26_Security_Act#Efforts_to_repeal_or_modify), though it's little changed and done purely to give a false sense of compromise in order to placate detractors. That didn't work and the opposition continues to mount.
NASCAR came out against it (http://www.motorsport.com/nascar-cup/news/nascar-s-brian-france-says-sport-opposes-controversial-new-n-c-law-689418/). Their chairman is allegedly working behind the scenes to change the law. Obama says the law should be overturned (http://www.wral.com/obama-says-hb2-should-be-overturned/15657287/). Even Trump was critical of it (http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/donald-trump-north-carolina-bathroom-bill_us_5718ca1ee4b0c9244a7aec8c).
And what's more, a federal appeals court (http://abcnews.go.com/US/wireStory/court-overturns-virginia-schools-transgender-bathroom-rule-38513822) ruled that a Virginia school that forced a transexual boy to use the men's bathroom violated a federal anti-discrimination law. Since NC is in the same jurisdiction, this ruling will almost certainly affect our infamous bathroom bill.
I predict this bill will be dead by the end of this year.
I certainly hope so. One big issue I have with the bill is one nobody is talking about, restricting local governments within the state from raising the minimum wage within their jurisdiction. Fucking Republicans would like nothing more than to eliminate the minimum wage altogether and return to the system of indentured servitude and slavery (but by a different name) which "made America great" in the first place. I really wish more people were talking about the rest of this horrible jack-off to Republicans of a bill.
I see overturning the bill is being supported by many NC Churches, even by many evangelical sects.
Does this mean that Paypal will be closing their Global Operation Centre in Malaysia?
Quote from: Jack89 on April 27, 2016, 11:23:23 AM
Does this mean that Paypal will be closing their Global Operation Centre in Malaysia?
Of course not. Americans don't care about Malaysia. If we had to care about what was going on in every little country then cheaply made shit at Wal-Mart would cost twice as much or more! THEN where are we going to go at 3:00AM when we don't really want anything, but REALLY want to buy something?