Started by Solitary, May 02, 2014, 12:27:10 PM
Quote from: Shol'va on May 02, 2014, 06:05:00 PMI am moderating the discussion and I am holding back a lot because, as it stands, I'm not the debater.What I can address are violations of form, such as logical fallacies.
Quote from: Shol'va on May 02, 2014, 06:52:09 PMI did post a response in that thread if you are interested
Quote from: Hakurei Reimu on May 03, 2014, 07:16:39 AMHe irritates me like Navi â€" "Hey! Listen! Hey! Listen!"
QuoteFor the relative independence of spatially distant things (A and B), this idea is characteristic: an influence on A has no immediate effect on B; this is known as the â€œprinciple of local actionâ€. - Einstein, Albert (1948). "Quanten-Mechanik Und Wirklichkeit" [Quantum Mechanics and Reality].
QuoteIt is inconceivable that inanimate Matter should, without the Mediation of something else, which is not material, operate upon, and affect other matter without mutual Contactâ€¦ so that one body may act upon another at a distance thro' a Vacuum, without the Mediation of any thing else, by and through which their Action and Force may be conveyed from one to another, is to me so great an Absurdity that I believe no Man who has in philosophical Matters a competent Faculty of thinking can ever fall into it. â€"Isaac Newton, Letters to Bentley, 1692/3
QuoteBellâ€™s celebrated theorem states that, in a situation like that considered by Einstein et al., which involves the correlation of measurements on two spatially separated systems which have interacted in the past, no local hidden-variable theory (or more generally, no objective local theory) can predict experimental results identical to those given by standard quantum mechanics. Over the past thirty years a very large number of experiments have been conducted with the aim of testing the predictions of quantum mechanics against those of local hidden-variable theories, and while to the best of my knowledge no single existing experiment has simultaneously blocked all of the so-called â€œloopholesâ€ (detector efficiency, random choice of setting, etc.) each one of those loopholes has been blocked in at least one experiment (cf., e.g., Weihs et al.). Thus, to maintain a local hidden-variable theory in the face of existing experiments would appear to require belief in a very peculiar conspiracy of nature. - A. G. Leggett
QuoteThe reader might well ask why the whole subject of non-local hidden-variable theories is of any interest. In my view, the point of considering such theories is not so much that they are in themselves a particularly plausible picture of physical reality, but that by investigating their consequences one may attain a deeper insight into the nature of the quantum mechanical â€œweirdnessâ€ which Bellâ€™s Theorem exposes. In particular, I believe that the results of the present investigation provide quantitative backing for a point of view which I believe is by now certainly well accepted at the qualitative level, namely that the incompatibility of the predictions of objective local theories with those of quantum mechanics has relatively little to do with locality and much to do with objectivity. - A. G. Leggett
QuoteMost working scientists hold fast to the concept of 'realism' - a viewpoint according to which an external reality exists independent of observation. But quantum physics has shattered some of our cornerstone beliefs. According to Bell's theorem, any theory that is based on the joint assumption of realism and locality (meaning that local events cannot be affected by actions in space-like separated regions) is at variance with certain quantum predictions. Experiments with entangled pairs of particles have amply confirmed these quantum predictions, thus rendering local realistic theories untenable. Maintaining realism as a fundamental concept would therefore necessitate the introduction of 'spooky' actions that defy locality. Here we show by both theory and experiment that a broad and rather reasonable class of such non-local realistic theories is incompatible with experimentally observable quantum correlations. In the experiment, we measure previously untested correlations between two entangled photons, and show that these correlations violate an inequality proposed by Leggett for non-local realistic theories. Our result suggests that giving up the concept of locality is not sufficient to be consistent with quantum experiments, unless certain intuitive features of realism are abandoned.
QuoteBellâ€™s Theorem proves that all hidden-variable theories based on the joint assumption of locality and realism are at variance with the predictions of quantum physics. Locality prohibits any influences between events in space-like separated regions, while realism claims that all measurement outcomes depend on pre-existing properties of objects that are independent of the measurement. The more refined versions of Bellâ€™s theorem by Clauser, Horne, Shimony and Holt and by Clauser and Horne start from the assumptions of local realism and result in inequalities for a set of statistical correlations (expectation values), which must be satisfied by all local realistic hidden-variable theories. The inequalities are violated by quantum mechanical predictions. Greenberger, Horne and Zeilinger showed that already perfect correlations of systems with at least three particles are inconsistent with these assumptions. So far, all experiments motivated by these theorems are in full agreement with quantum predictions.... Therefore it is reasonable to consider the violation of local realism a well established fact.
QuoteThe logical conclusion one can draw from the violation of local realism is that at least one of itâ€™s assumptions fails. Specifically, either locality or realism or both cannot provide a foundational basis for quantum theory.... It is therefore important to ask whether incompatibility theorems similar to Bellâ€™s can be found in which at least one of these concepts is relaxed. Our work addresses a broad class of non-local hidden-variable theories that are based on a very plausible type of realism and that provide an explanation for all existing Bell-type experiments. Nevertheless we demonstrate, both in theory and experiment, their conflict with quantum predictions and observed measurement data. Following the recent approach of Leggett, who introduced the class of non-local models and formulated an incompatibility theorem, we have analysed its assumptions and derived an inequality valid for such theories that can be experimentally tested. In addition, the experiments allow for a simultaneous test of all local hidden-variable models - that is, the measurement data can neither be explained by a local realistic model nor by the considered class of non-local models.
QuoteThe theories are based on the following assumptions: (1) all measurement outcomes are determined by pre-existing properties of particles independent of the measurement (realism);....Nevertheless, we will show that all models based on assumptions (1)-(3) are at variance with other quantum predictions.
QuoteWe believe that our results lend strong support to the view that any future extension of quantum theory that is in agreement with experiments must abandon certain features of realistic descriptions.
Quote from: Casparov on May 04, 2014, 03:30:16 AMRealism is the assumption that physical reality exists independent of observation. The violation of Bellâ€™s Inequalities ruled out Local Realism, and the violation of Leggettâ€™s Inequalities ruled out Non-Local Realism, therefore Realism in any form has been conclusively ruled out.