Not to copy what the amazing atheist has done already, but since its come out now, I just wanted to bring it up and see everyones thought on it.
After great adaptations of the joker from Jack Nicholson, Heath Ledger, and of course the iconic voice work of him by mark hamill, they now release the up coming suicide squads version of the joker...
(http://i.imgur.com/GG5yDtb.jpg)
And.. just... why....
I mean, okay, in terms of any movie and its creators artistic licence, they can do whatever they want with the characters since its their project.
But as a long time comic book nut, who grew up on shows like batman the animated series, and who got into comic books before that, there is something that needs to be said about creative licence vs character status in terms of what people know of those characters.
Comic book characters have always been recognizable figures, you know spiderman when you see him with the red webbed mask, you know wolverine from the curved mask and claws, you know captain america from the red white and blue spandex armor, or batman for the dark leather and bat ears, or superman for the red cape, dark hair and S on his chest.
Point being, fictional characters are iconic in appearance and actions, and while they are often retold in different styles and actions, the writers and artists always put thought into those designs to keep them in line with what people regard as those characters, so they are instantly recognizable.
Even with the grim dark take on the joker with heath ledger, you knew it was him, with the costume, white face paint and green hair.
Okay, maybe Leto might surprise us with his performance, because to me, the joker is one of the most iconic comic book characters, along with batman himself and superman, so if he could pull off a disturbed, menacing performance, maybe this could work, but as TJ said, I feel more like I'm looking at a street thug from grand theft auto more then the clown prince of crime.
(https://margethelarge.files.wordpress.com/2014/07/joker-2.jpg)
Yeah, this "modern" take on the joker I just a big NO for me. I've played the video games on top of seeing the cartoons, reading a few comic books, and all of the movies (good and bad).
Hell, I prefer Jack Nickolsons take than what this looks like. Heath ledger was brilliant....just like a sociopath reallywould be.
I hate it when an IP is run into the ground this way. :(
So, how do you all feel about the proposed female Thor then? lol
Quote from: Aroura33 on April 25, 2015, 04:36:11 PM
So, how do you all feel about the proposed female Thor then? lol
please don't remind me -_-
Female Thor = Awesome, and makes sense.
This Joker = Marlyn Manson. Meh.
Disagree with female thor making sense, its just marvel trying to appeal to a demographic by fucking up decades of a pre standing character. If they want more impowering female characters, make new ones, don't alter present ones so they are not even the same character anymore.
Quote from: Munch on April 25, 2015, 04:54:14 PM
Disagree with female thor making sense, its just marvel trying to appeal to a demographic by fucking up decades of a pre standing character. If they want more impowering female characters, make new ones, don't alter present ones so they are not even the same character anymore.
Thor can be anyone, so if Green Lantern can be black I don't see why Thor can't be a woman. And it's not "fucking up" a character, it's not like Thor will never come back... it's just a temporary gig.
Did people also throw such a hissyfit when Robin died?
Quote from: Shiranu on April 25, 2015, 05:00:54 PM
Thor can be anyone, so if Green Lantern can be black I don't see why Thor can't be a woman. And it's not "fucking up" a character, it's not like Thor will never come back... it's just a temporary gig.
Did people also throw such a hissyfit when Robin died?
Yes, anyone who picks up his hammer can have his power. But as the actual character goes it simply isn't thor, its just some made up new character carrying around his hammer. As someone else pointed out, even wonder woman has picked up thors hammer, but it didn't make her thor, and the fact that even with this made up female character carrying thors hammer, Thor still exists as a character in the universe, meaning she isn't thor, the guy with the axe he's using in place of the hammer is the real thor.
As for green lantern, there are countless green lanterns, but again its the character who the story is focused on as that green lantern that makes them fan favorites. There is only 1 superman, and even if they tried to make some others, clark kent is always will be superman, peter parker will always be spiderman, logan will always be wolverine, and bruce wayne will always be batman, it doesn't matter it someone else puts on the costume, its not the same character.
Anyway, rant over, new joker design sucks.
What about Flash? There have been many Flashes. You can say you only consider the original to be the true Flash, but remember, that's not Barry Allen, but Jay Garrick. Robins change as well, so has Spider Man, and tons of other characters. Even if you don't like that trend, I don't see why it's a big deal that they applied it to Thor as well.
As for the new Joker, remember that people seriously hated on the Heath Ledger design when it was first revealed. I'm not going to make any judgements about it until I see it in action. I don't think it's going to be good, but that's because it's a DC movie, not because of the costume.
So everyone here can understand
I say it loud, I don't stammer
If someone's going to play with my hammer
I'd rather it be a woman than a man
Green Lantern was my youthful hero
they made a movie that royally sucked
Ryan Reynolds career is slightly fucked
but it all adds up to zero
If you are emotionally involved
with comic books, might be the problem
might reconsider your involvement-
there, problem solved. :biggrin:
(http://0.media.dorkly.cvcdn.com/96/49/2d78727b0787650ee89cd1ead53bedec.jpg)
(http://1.media.dorkly.cvcdn.com/92/64/f81973e277451a3b31816c2dfced1b79.jpg)
(http://www.dorkly.com/images/download.jpg)
(http://2.media.dorkly.cvcdn.com/30/66/72673c27acd2e129a7177bfe4faf8f8b.jpg)
(http://1.media.dorkly.cvcdn.com/11/72/11a2ba5b9d4d86d17bee5101552775bb.jpg)
(http://0.media.dorkly.cvcdn.com/23/82/40dfcdd61fb8073146e8d532ece7adec.jpg)
(http://0.media.dorkly.cvcdn.com/99/30/461b5edfb8302ae8941dd2f92ed23bce.jpg)
(http://2.media.dorkly.cvcdn.com/81/87/16dc3f67f933ca2d1bb1a7ecc39dbcf4.jpg)
Source (http://www.dorkly.com/post/74084/the-best-internet-reactions-to-jared-letos-new-joker)
Quote from: Munch on April 25, 2015, 04:54:14 PM
Disagree with female thor making sense, its just marvel trying to appeal to a demographic by fucking up decades of a pre standing character. If they want more impowering female characters, make new ones, don't alter present ones so they are not even the same character anymore.
To create an original female character from scracth is very difficult. Very risky. If you create a female super hero, you need to come up with a covincing permise explaining why she is super and can beat up guys, super villains...etc. On the other hand, Thor is a god. That's why he has super powers, not because of a lab accident or an experiment or technology. He can easily be changed in to a goddess.
Everyone would like a femake Loki though I bet. *Rolls eyes.
Two female goddess would be Valkyrie and Frigga. And a third, and my favorite, would be Nanna. I like it because that is what our grandchildren call my wife. They had no idea that that was the name of the Norse goddess of joy and peace. I think it's fitting. :))
Quote from: Penny Dreadful on April 26, 2015, 11:49:19 AM
To create an original female character from scracth is very difficult. Very risky. If you create a female super hero, you need to come up with a covincing permise explaining why she is super and can beat up guys, super villains...etc. On the other hand, Thor is a god. That's why he has super powers, not because of a lab accident or an experiment or technology. He can easily be changed in to a goddess.
Everyone would like a femake Loki though I bet. *Rolls eyes.
Point is, Thor isn't just a god, he's a character, taken from Norse myth, a male character the same as Odin being male and as you say Loki. Marvel hasn't used the whole 'human form donald blake' premise for decades, since Thor is his own character, and even is someone else is using that power, its still Thor himself that power belongs to, as the norse myth would have it.
And its not that hard to make good female characters, Harleyquin is a much liked female character, more so by fans when she splits herself off from the joker. Storm is one of my fav x-men because of her character, and if a male storm stepped it, it be the same with me, I don't give a shit if they say 'he's the same character with her powers', bollocks, Ororo Munroe is storm and nobody else.
And like say, if they were so intent on making female thor, why would then feel the need to keep the real Thor around with her using her hammer? Its not a replacement character, its done as emasculation, most likely because of what lead to him losing his hammer to begin with. Writers trying to be ironic "Hey, what would it be like if Thor couldn't lift his own hammer?" Which is why I won't take this character seriously.
Quote from: Munch on April 25, 2015, 04:32:27 PM(http://i.imgur.com/GG5yDtb.jpg)
Can't say I care for it.
Quote from: Munch on April 26, 2015, 01:11:54 PM
Point is, Thor isn't just a god, he's a character, taken from Norse myth, a male character the same as Odin being male and as you say Loki. Marvel hasn't used the whole 'human form donald blake' premise for decades, since Thor is his own character, and even is someone else is using that power, its still Thor himself that power belongs to, as the norse myth would have it.
I don't get what you mean by 'Thor isn't just a god, he's a character'. I meant that the god quality is an easy source of super powers. Of course he is a character, the new one will be a character too. They are all characaters.
QuoteAnd its not that hard to make good female characters, Harleyquin is a much liked female character, more so by fans when she splits herself off from the joker. Storm is one of my fav x-men because of her character, and if a male storm stepped it, it be the same with me, I don't give a shit if they say 'he's the same character with her powers', bollocks, Ororo Munroe is storm and nobody else.
No, it's very hard to make a good female character, because as the traditional comic genre based on action, people are already not interested in female characters -generally in many genres- esp. not in this genre. So it is not profitable to begin with. If it was easy or profitable they would have created a dozen. It's a money machine. Storm is a bad example. She is one of the characters in the X-men world which has many heroes and heroines. She exists as a part of a team. She is not a lone standing super heroine got into the team.
You need to create a lone standing female character which is risky as much as it is hard, because you need to create her on page first. It should sell, there should be a fandom and then it would be a movie. Who buys that sort of comic books mostly? Boys and men. How do they want to see a superheroine. Preferably, as a 2 meter leggy blonde with huge 3 tits, as naked as possible, beating men up on high heels and making crazy sex with other heroes. Yes, I am being hyperbolic, but you got the idea. They also wouldn't do something like that in this let's create powerful female characters trend. (Something I am happy about.)
Again we are back to what I said up there. It's needed to be more convincing for a female character to have super physical powers than a male one for obvious reasons. First of all they are females. They are anti-hero characters by definition. So they require a detailed, clever plot. A male character can get away wih many weird, negative qualities and be lovable, a female one can't. It's a very delicate balance. She needs to be beautiful, but not too girly; attractive, but not too sexy; what will be her real identity? What will she wear. Male characters do not have these problems to this degree. He needs to have a reason to be a hero. That's it. What's our heroine's reason to dress up and save the world? She is a hot chick. What does she want more? In the end to reach a female character most people would like is,lol almost impossible.
If you make her challenging, untraditional free spirit -as she should be- those fucktard parents who drags their 8 year old daughters from beauty pageant to beauty pageant, sexualisig them prematurely at every opportunity would stand up and shout 'HEY that's a BAD ROLE MODEL for our girls!' Yeah that's what would happen with an original, good, powerful female character.
QuoteAnd like say, if they were so intent on making female thor, why would then feel the need to keep the real Thor around with her using her hammer? Its not a replacement character, its done as emasculation, most likely because of what lead to him losing his hammer to begin with. Writers trying to be ironic "Hey, what would it be like if Thor couldn't lift his own hammer?" Which is why I won't take this character seriously.
You realise what you are saying is that you don't like the story and will dismiss the new character, because you percieve it as a castration of a Marvel hero, right? :eyes:
Well from what I've seen it is like a castration of said character.
But, I'm putting a hold on this now for one good reason. In the coming months marvel is going to launch its big summer event where by now after destroying all the multiverse storylines and even killing off all super godly beings in the marvel universe (except perhaps the one above all, marvels own version of God -_-) they are going to reset everything are start the marvel universe again with the slate wiped clean.
At that time none of this will matter, and the real complaints will come in with whatever they do after this happens. So I'm gonna stop complaining about the here and now and just wait to see what transpires with marvel.
As for dc and it's movie franchise ARGH HE LOOKS AWFUL BLLEEHHH
Quote from: Munch on April 26, 2015, 03:18:40 PM
Well from what I've seen it is like a castration of said character.
OK, I get it. But I'm curious, why does it bother you? Because I think it is related to why people, mostly men, do not like female pratogonists, esp. in this genre. Would you feel similar things, if Thor was defeated by a super heroine?
QuoteBut, I'm putting a hold on this now for one good reason. In the coming months marvel is going to launch its big summer event where by now after destroying all the multiverse storylines and even killing off all super godly beings in the marvel universe (except perhaps the one above all, marvels own version of God -_-) they are going to reset everything are start the marvel universe again with the slate wiped clean.
At that time none of this will matter, and the real complaints will come in with whatever they do after this happens. So I'm gonna stop complaining about the here and now and just wait to see what transpires with marvel.
As for dc and it's movie franchise ARGH HE LOOKS AWFUL BLLEEHHH
Well, I think you guys are expecting too much from the genre.
Quote from: Penny Dreadful on April 26, 2015, 03:34:47 PM
OK, I get it. But I'm curious, why does it bother you? Because I think it is related to why people, mostly men, do not like female pratogonists, esp. in this genre. Would you feel similar things, if Thor was defeated by a super heroine?
You got me all wrong. I like female protagonists, I like strong female role models in comics, I like badass super heroines and super villains. I fact in the past I use to write fan fiction and make up characters with some strong female protagonists and villains myself, So I appreciate when good female characters, Original characters, are written well and done right.
Infact, my most fav female super hero of all time, is wildstorms The Authority's Jenny Sparks, she was such a strong, badass character with a great background and purpose. And, spoilers, [spoiler]one of the things that made her awesome, was because of the story that every 1000 years a woman would rise to lead or be given the power to govern based on that millennium, in her case, the discovering of electricity, knowing when it hit midnight in the year 2000, she would die, and a new Jenny would be born, so in her final mission, she did something nobody thought possible, she Killed God, not a god, but The God of that universe. [/spoiler]
What I hate, is taking a character who has been established for years, and just removing them from the spectrum, just to replace them with a clone done purposely to be the opposite of them in all ways including sex, when the real character is still around. They did this with Dr Octopus in the 90s and had a female version of him, that didn't wash, and they eventually brought back the real Dr Octopus.
In context, if they removed all of wonder womans powers, and gave it to a man, who now stood at the head of the league, how would that feel? (I know marvel has wonder man but its a different character in a different genre), if all wonder womans powers passed to a man, and she was left powerless and human, how would that come across?
Quote
Well, I think you guys are expecting too much from the genre.
Not saying I like the idea they have to reboot everything to fix their messy writing, just more accepting this is whats gonna happen.
Quote from: Munch on April 26, 2015, 03:52:58 PM
You got me all wrong. I like female protagonists, I like strong female role models in comics, I like badass super heroines and super villains. I fact in the past I use to write fan fiction and make up characters with some strong female protagonists and villains myself, So I appreciate when good female characters, Original characters, are written well and done right.
What I hate, is taking a character who has been established for years, and just removing them from the spectrum, just to replace them with a clone done purposely to be the opposite of them in all ways including sex, when the real character is still around. They did this with Dr Octopus in the 90s and had a female version of him, that didn't wash, and they eventually brought back the real Dr Octopus.
In context, if they removed all of wonder womans powers, and gave it to a man, who now stood at the head of the league, how would that feel? (I know marvel has wonder man but its a different character in a different genre), if all wonder womans powers passed to a man, and she was left powerless and human, how would that come across?
I was just asking out of curiosity.
Except, what you don't like here, could be the main purpose. May be they are trying to do exactly what you have described. May be they have chosen Thor, because he is a trendy character with an artifact attached to his power, which can be taken and given to another one. So they chose him. Taking his power from him and giving it to a female character.
On the other hand, they wouldn't need to take Wonder Woman's powers and pass it to a man to create another male character. They would just bring one among the countless ones on page or a create another one easy. Also as you said there is already a Wonder Man. He exists without touching the Wonder Woman. But if they created a female character in another sub genre with the same name -if the situation was reversed- I don't think the reaction would be this neutral or positive.
I am not questioning anyone's personal taste. I'm trying to say that allthough there are a few beloved female characters, they can't win wherever they put them. Probably, they know that and it is the reason why they are 'castrating' an established male character. If it holds, there could be similar others. Eventually, a period of adjustment could start and in time when female characters become the norm as the male ones, looking back this period would be like...what do you call little wheels we install when children are learning to ride a bike in English? Adjusting wheels? Anyway I don't know, you got what I mean. It could work. Other than that Thor won't die. They will make a lot of those movies.
And also it is very new to say anything, but apparently it sells for now.
http://www.theverge.com/2015/3/21/8269747/female-thor-is-outselling-the-old-thor-by-30-percent
Quote from: Munch on April 25, 2015, 04:32:27 PM
And.. just... why....
Because you kids think that's cool.
Knock it off.
QuoteI mean, okay, in terms of any movie and its creators artistic licence, they can do whatever they want with the characters since its their project.
Back in the 80's and 90's, various scripts for Spider-Man were kicking around. Rumor has it one adaptation was a horror movie where a guy turns into a half-man, half-spider monstrosity. They should have made that movie instead and then we wouldn't have any super hero movies at all. Batman would have just been that year's Twilight.
Quote from: Penny Dreadful on April 26, 2015, 11:49:19 AM
To create an original female character from scracth is very difficult. Very risky.
And yet they've been doing it for decades, almost as long as they'd been making male super heroes.
So the problem is not coming up with female characters nor is it marketing female characters. The problem is like salads at Carl's Jr. As the owner once put it, they offer healthier alternatives but nobody buys them.
People just don't buy super heroines. Girls aren't interested in the genre, by and large, and boys don't want to read about some icky girl thing.
But then, through most of the late 80's and 90's, the X-Men, one of the most popular series of that time, had a mostly female roster. So maybe that's not true, either.
Tell you what it does remind me of. Remember Mr Terrific? No? That's OK. Nobody does. He hasn't been seen much since WWII ended.
(http://www.adherents.com/lit/comics/img/m/MrTerrific.jpg)
They've recently launched a new version of the character who is black.
(http://www.shonborn.net/images/art/mr-terrific.png)
Isn't that nice. They made a super hero that nobody has heard of and fewer care about to the black people because that how it works in a pasty white patriarchy. It's tokenism of the worst kind, trying to tap into the "urban market" which is what marketers call black people when they don't want to sound racists because, get this, black people don't read that many comic books. Hard to believe considering all the nice, white super heroes they could aspire to be. (And even this much may not be true. Shaquille O'Neal is a bit of a Superman fan. He was willing to star in Steel which was as close as he could get to actually playing Superman, I guess. Pity)
So it is with the female Thor. It's a marketing stunt that was done less to increase diversity and to appeal to a wider audience (although they keep saying that) but to sell comics to the pasty white male shlubs who already buy the damned things, because they always buy shit that makes mainstream news. And such a change is piss-easy to reverse if the sales ever wane.
This chick is not the first alternate to wield Thor's Hammer.
There was Beta Ray Bill, some weird space alien who had Thor's powers for a time.
(http://img4.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20081224185739/marveldatabase/images/9/98/Beta_Ray_Bill_%28Earth-616%29.png)
There was Eric Masterson, who also held the hammer for a while. Of course, being another blond white guy makes him uninteresting.
(http://img3.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20120820074819/marveldatabase/images/4/41/146513-196573-thunderstrike_super.jpg)
Comics companies are always shaking up the status quo on their characters these days because they found that sells periodicals, although I have a hard time believing the kids today are that dumb to feel like things are being shook up if they are constantly shaking things up.
The female Thor will simply go away and the original male version will be re-established when they believe doing so will sell more periodicals.
Remember when this was Batman?
(http://vignette4.wikia.nocookie.net/newsecretwars/images/9/98/Batman_Azrael_454678.jpg)
Well, he isn't anymore.
Remember when this was Superman?
(https://dcinformationen.files.wordpress.com/2010/12/wiz9a.jpg)
That didn't last, either.
Why should the female Thor?
More importantly, why even bother discussing this cynical marketing strategy? They didn't make the change because they had a compelling story to tell or wanted to make a profound political statement.
They.
Wanted.
To.
Sell.
Comic.
Books.
And that's all. We're putting more thought into this than they did.
That all said, I wonder what the reaction would be if a traditionally female character were similarly gender-swapped. A tall order since many of the established female characters are female versions of male characters (this was a copyright ploy to keep a competitor from making a Supergirl or a She-Hulk more than an attempt at making a worthwhile character). But what if they introduced a new Wonder Woman who was transgender?
I don't know what the reaction would be, hence why I find that interesting.
And I just clicked in to say 'hey also black heroes...' Well, you said nicely.
You pretty much said the things I said, anti. Of course it is to sell comic books. Or I missed something.
Except, I was talking about an original female character which is not forced into a male stereotype when I said it is very difficult and risky. Something completely original. If there are more than I know on page, then let's change my statement about comics into movies. And I said that -now in 3 different threads- it is an issue beyond any genre.
Nobody wants to watch women in anything other than a few things. It's almost like people, most men do not enjoy women presented as normal humans. And then claim that there is nothing sexist about media. This whole thing is for me like 'I don't know if I should laugh or cry'. I am trying to avoid when I can.
Just going on this what you said about appealing to urban culture more with making white characters black, tell me, with the upcoming new fantastic four movie, what is your opinion on them making Johnny Storm, the human torch, a black guy?
Considering how he's meant to be sue storms brother, how the fuck did they work that one around?
Don't get me wrong, when it comes to things that don't seem to raise questions, as in race, it doesn't bother me so much. When they had michael clark duncan as the kingpin in daredevil, I didn't question it, I just took it that this is the movieverses telling of it, so those kind of mild changes don't matter much. The same with nick fury, who was white for decades, now being black and personified as samual L jackson, because they used the ultimate universe as the standing for that it didn't feel like it even mattered at all, it was the same character regardless of skin.
But something annoys me here, if they wanted to have the marvel movieverse human torch black, why didn't just also find an actress who was black to play sue storm, or if they were doing it purely to have a token black guy, why didn't they make mr fantastic or Ben Grimm black?
It feels like there should be a joke in here somewhere.
"I'm Johnny Storm the human torch, and this is my sis Sue, the invisible woman, we're brothers and sister, we have the same parents, Honest!"
"Riiiiiiiiight.... "
There's a new Fantastic Four movie?
What idiot asked for that?
Quote from: the_antithesis on April 27, 2015, 03:44:00 PM
There's a new Fantastic Four movie?
What idiot asked for that?
(http://mmbiz.qpic.cn/mmbiz/RdOs898xMVO3oibAiaXiaNVh5K9icegkEarKgP6RkaSibD2CxUEm6mZRT4LkJpib4f6jxjxGIdQia1hqTrwkianygkqzFg/0)
(https://s.yimg.com/lo/api/res/1.2/bwiHHJygSUlmMzPt5R.JSw--/YXBwaWQ9bWFnYXppbmVzO3c9ODAw/https://s.yimg.com/os/en-US/blogs/movie-news/de7b1160-9a2d-11e3-a6aa-3d59e9c1043a_MichaelJordan_KateMara_MilesTeller_JamieBell_022014.jpg)
I even looked it up on imdb, Kate Mara plays 'Sue Storm' and Michael B. Jordan plays 'Johnny Storm'.
And yeah, I looked up several articles, they outright said they thought it was a good idea having a black actor play human torch, because it shows a 'progression of the times'. you know, nevermind that the characters sister isn't even the same skin color as him..
Quote from: Munch on April 27, 2015, 03:48:48 PM
(http://mmbiz.qpic.cn/mmbiz/RdOs898xMVO3oibAiaXiaNVh5K9icegkEarKgP6RkaSibD2CxUEm6mZRT4LkJpib4f6jxjxGIdQia1hqTrwkianygkqzFg/0)
(https://s.yimg.com/lo/api/res/1.2/bwiHHJygSUlmMzPt5R.JSw--/YXBwaWQ9bWFnYXppbmVzO3c9ODAw/https://s.yimg.com/os/en-US/blogs/movie-news/de7b1160-9a2d-11e3-a6aa-3d59e9c1043a_MichaelJordan_KateMara_MilesTeller_JamieBell_022014.jpg)
I even looked it up on imdb, Kate Mara plays 'Sue Storm' and Michael B. Jordan plays 'Johnny Storm'.
And yeah, I looked up several articles, they outright said they thought it was a good idea having a black actor play human torch, because it shows a 'progression of the times'. you know, nevermind that the characters sister isn't even the same skin color as him..
I saw that. Why didn't they make Sue Storm black also? I was going to ask if they were stupid or something, but then again, they did decide to make a new fantastic four movie...
I brought this up on another forum, and someone said they read the reason for this is that Sue Storm is adopted.
I can't help but feel they had to purposely work that into the plot of this movie just so they could validate having a black actor in marvels current extreme forced diversity pandering.
don't get me wrong, I'm not going to see this one, I think it just bothers me how marvel is becoming one of these companies that doesn't mind messing up its own characters and comics all just so they can appear more 'progressive', even if it makes little to no sense.
Quote from: Munch on April 27, 2015, 05:12:14 PM
I brought this up on another forum, and someone said they read the reason for this is that Sue Storm is adopted.
I can't help but feel they had to purposely work that into the plot of this movie just so they could validate having a black actor in marvels current extreme forced diversity pandering.
don't get me wrong, I'm not going to see this one, I think it just bothers me how marvel is becoming one of these companies that doesn't mind messing up its own characters and comics all just so they can appear more 'progressive', even if it makes little to no sense.
I mean... they could have just kept the same story and not force a new backstory by making them both black.
Another thing I had a huge problem with this new fantastic 4 thing, is that they don't even have a concept of how light works. I mean... look at this promo poster...
(http://t2.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcS74QJa14AOmVu5X7naPLluKCS5prN7cXOSMc5d_pmf1eoLAruN)
They can't even hire a someone to illustrate their poster correctly? Really? As someone that deals with lighting as part of my job, I think that is almost as insulting as forcing storyline to promote diversity.
This joker design is so bad.
Quote from: DeathandGrim on May 10, 2015, 04:23:46 AM
This joker design is so bad.
And even in the sense that it would be so hard for an actor to follow along from Heath Ledgers Joker and give a good performance, you'd think they would at least try to make it work with what makes the character good. Heath ledgers joker came about only recently, and they adapted a much darker, more real world tone for him, and yet managed to keep the concept of the joker to who he is, the costume design, the white face paint, the green messy hair, it was more real, but it kept to the classic joker design of an insane smartly dressed clown.
I'm not seeing this in the new design, he doesn't even strike intimidation, which the joker is meant to.
(http://superheroinchq.com/images/2014/10/Joker-comics.jpg)
Scary ^
(https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/236x/96/f6/6f/96f66ff654ba99d89ec89abc640b25a4.jpg)
Scary ^
(http://media.dcentertainment.com/sites/default/files/DoFFace.jpg)
Fucking terrifying ^
(http://www.yellowbreak.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/04/joker2-226x300.jpg)
Not Scary! ^
Exactly it's like come on now
It looks like one of Joker's punk throwaway thugs. Joker always has this smug asshole type vibe, a chilling cool of a murderous psychopath that will slit your throat with a smile. I don't get that vibe with this one.
I get more of a "I'm a teenage runaway who listens to fallout boy" vibe