Still Want To Believe The New Pope?

[Solitary]

Vatican denies pope is open to recognition of gay civil unions

VATICAN CITY — The Vatican on Sunday denied Italian media reports that recent comments by Pope Francis signaled his openness to the legal recognition of same-sex unions in Italy.

Francis, in a conversation with leaders of religious orders published by a Jesuit journal on Friday, said the Catholic Church had to try not to scare away children who live in complex family situations, such as those whose parents were separated and those living with gay couples.

Francis gave the example of a little girl in Buenos Aires, his former diocese, who confided to her teacher the reason she was always sad was that "my mother's girlfriend doesn't like me."

The pope told the leaders of religious orders that a great challenge for the Church would be to reach out to children living in difficult or unorthodox domestic situations.

"The situation in which we live now provides us with new challenges which sometimes are difficult for us to understand," the pope said, according to the transcript of the conversation.

"How can we proclaim Christ to these boys and girls? How can we proclaim Christ to a generation that is changing? We must be careful not to administer a vaccine against faith to them," he said.

"MANIPULATION"
Italian media on Sunday ran headlines saying the pope's words were an opening to legal provision for civil unions for gay couples, a subject of debate in Italy.

Vatican spokesman Father Federico Lombardi told Vatican Radio that media interpretations were "paradoxical" and a "manipulation" of the pope's words, particularly as some media quoted him as speaking specifically of homosexual unions, which he did not.

Lombardi said the pope was merely "alluding to the suffering of children" and not taking a stand on the political debate in Italy.

Since his election in March, however, the pope has avoided repeating the denunciations of homosexuality pronounced by his two immediate predecessors, Benedict XVI and John Paul II.

Last month, The Advocate, the oldest gay rights magazine in the United States, named him 'Person of the Year'. It hailed as a landmark his response last July to a reporter who asked about gay people in the Church: "If a person is gay and seeks God and has goodwill, who am I to judge?"

The Vatican has stressed the pope's words did not change Church teachings that homosexual tendencies are not sinful but homosexual acts are.

Still, the gay community and many heterosexuals in the Church have welcomed what they see as a shift in emphasis and a call for the Church to be more compassionate and less damning.

:roll:  :roll:  :roll: Solitary

[Insult to Rocks]

Oh, Vatican, when will you ever learn that the majority of Catholics don't even listen to your nonsense anymore, let alone the rest of the world.

[ApostateLois]

Still, the gay community and many heterosexuals in the Church have welcomed what they see as a shift in emphasis and a call for the Church to be more compassionate and less damning.

Oh, sure, that'll happen, right after they fire all the pedo priests.  :roll:

[Shiranu]

Yes, I do. Because it's possible to be wrong about something and right about others.

Just like if someone was to be pro-gay marriage and said, "I think human beings should be treated like cattle, they are a commodity for corporations to exploit" I wouldn't therefor say... "Well, he agrees with gay marriage, so he must be right about everything!".

Also, nice pick and choosing...

Since his election in March, however, the pope has avoided repeating the denunciations of homosexuality pronounced by his two immediate predecessors, Benedict XVI and John Paul II.

Last month, The Advocate, the oldest gay rights magazine in the United States, named him 'Person of the Year'. It hailed as a landmark his response last July to a reporter who asked about gay people in the Church: "If a person is gay and seeks God and has goodwill, who am I to judge?"

He is an improvement, who is not making gay marriage a core issue and is talking about the core issues of corruption in modern society? NO FUCK HIM, HE IS THE POPE HE IS WRONG ABOUT ERRRRRRRRRRRRYTHHHHHHHHHHHHIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIINNNNNNNGGGG!!

[Poison Tree]

Even if we assume/pretend that Pope Francis is the greatest guy in the world, the catholic church hierarchy remains the same. I don't know if it is intentional or accidental, but I kind of feel like they are playing good cop, bad cop: Pope ok with gays, Cardinal says no he's not; Pope ok with atheists, Cardinal says no he's not; Pope thinks church living too luxuriously, Cardinal laughs up his golden sleeve.

[Hydra009]

Even if we assume/pretend that Pope Francis is the greatest guy in the world, the catholic church hierarchy remains the same. I don't know if it is intentional or accidental, but I kind of feel like they are playing good cop, bad cop: Pope ok with gays, Cardinal says no he's not; Pope ok with atheists, Cardinal says no he's not; Pope thinks church living too luxuriously, Cardinal laughs up his golden sleeve.

Good guy pope attracts new followers, who don't agree with but acquiesce to Vatican bigotry towards gays and other groups.  All the benefits of changing policy without actually having to change them.

[Shiranu]

Good guy pope attracts new followers, who don't agree with but acquiesce to Vatican bigotry towards gays and other groups.

:roll:

[Hydra009]

:roll:

Hope springs eternal.

But no change from the Vatican means no change from its critics.

[_Xenu_]

Good guy pope attracts new followers, who don't agree with but acquiesce to Vatican bigotry towards gays and other groups.

:roll:

I'm with you. The Catholic Church moves so slowly on social issues that it won't adopt anything modern within our lifetimes. Having said that, they can do alot of good by focusing on their original purposes, like feeding the hungry and helping the disadvantaged.

[Shiranu]

:roll:

Hope springs eternal.

But no change from the Vatican means no change from its critics.

You mean those "no changes" like calling out the bankers and corrupt politicians who cause millions upon millions to suffer from poverty, people no one else in any form of power calls out and something the church hasn't particularly done before either?

You mean "no change" like saying, "If you are gay... it is not my place to judge." and, "I am really tired of talking about the gay issue... I disagree with it, but we have 999 bigger issues we need to talk about before we talk about gay marriage", whereas for the last umph years the church has been the biggest proponent of limiting gay rights?

Yeah, that really is "no change"...

[Hydra009]

You mean those "no changes" like calling out the bankers and corrupt politicians who cause millions upon millions to suffer from poverty, people no one else in any form of power calls out and something the church hasn't particularly done before either?

You mean "no change" like saying, "If you are gay... it is not my place to judge." and, "I am really tired of talking about the gay issue... I disagree with it, but we have 999 bigger issues we need to talk about before we talk about gay marriage", whereas for the last umph years the church has been the biggest proponent of limiting gay rights?

Yeah, that really is "no change"...

And the difference for gays is?  And for people in poverty?

You are confusing words with deeds.

[hillbillyatheist]

I think even if its just words, the pope will help sway some conservative catholics to liberal economics.

just look at the shitasses like rush limbaugh freaking out over it.


ideally our society becomes bluegrass loving staunch atheists who love science, liberal economics, and me bigger than elvis.

in the real world, if we can just get folks to agree on the important things (poverty, global warming, civil rights, etc) I think we'll do alright.

[SGOS]

The Pope speaks for God, but the Vatican doesn't seem to believe it.

[Hydra009]

And even if this isn't all for show and the Pope is actually a great guy, the Vatican isn't changing squat atm.  And if this guy can't turn the ship around, who can?

[mykcob4]

Why do peeople put so much importance on the pope. He is an old man that is the FIGUREHEAD of a corrupt mafia style organization that exploits the poor preys on the weak and abuses any that they can get to.
If you don't believe that the catholic church will commit crimes, just look at the deaths at the hands of the Swiss Guard in the last decade. They may have been the ones that murdered pope John Paul I. And they operate just like the Mafia. They have little crews all over the world that collect tax free funds and the vatican skims off the top. What do the people get in return...pedofiles and protection for those pedofiles. Among other corrupt criminal things. Fuck the pope...all popes! Invalibale my ass! I bet he can't even do long math without an eraser!