why does the usa hate fidel

[Gawdzilla Sama]

The Emperor was also the only authority that could have said "Stop!" and made it stick. He was just the Japanese version of Operation Paperclip.

[Baruch]

The Emperor was also the only authority that could have said "Stop!" and made it stick. He was just the Japanese version of Operation Paperclip.

Not the only part of Japanese Paperclip .... we got their nuclear and biological stuff and people hiding in Korea.  That was the reason why we occupied S Korea originally.  Like in Germany, most Japanese war criminals preferred the US to the Soviets.

[Gawdzilla Sama]

Not the only part of Japanese Paperclip .... we got their nuclear and biological stuff and people hiding in Korea.  That was the reason why we occupied S Korea originally.  Like in Germany, most Japanese war criminals preferred the US to the Soviets.

We got what Unit 731 didn't destroy, yeah. But getting the Japanese to "go quietly" by just not saying what would happen to the Emperor (our version of mokusatsu) was worth it.

[Baruch]

We got what Unit 731 didn't destroy, yeah. But getting the Japanese to "go quietly" by just not saying what would happen to the Emperor (our version of mokusatsu) was worth it.

I think we didn't want to concede up front, that we would keep the Emperor, gave us an additional hostage during the early occupation.  Also if surrender is unconditional, we don't have to listen to endless additional demands, like Japan getting to keep Manchuria and Korea.

[Gawdzilla Sama]

I think we didn't want to concede up front, that we would keep the Emperor, gave us an additional hostage during the early occupation.  Also if surrender is unconditional, we don't have to listen to endless additional demands, like Japan getting to keep Manchuria and Korea.

The British-US discussion of this matter is informative. Got it somewhere in that maze of bookcases behind me.

[Shiranu]

I see we have a "Okay, Americans aren't dying so who cares who else is" fan here.

So let me get this straight... committing various war crimes against them and encouraging it =/= who cares? But saying we shouldn't be the one's doing the killing = who cares?

Man dat logic doe.

[Gawdzilla Sama]

So let me get this straight... committing various war crimes against them and encouraging it =/= who cares? But saying we shouldn't be the one's doing the killing = who cares?

Man dat logic doe.

You are desperate, why not just walk away.

[Shiranu]

You are desperate, why not just walk away.

So you are going to stick to your guns that actively killing people =/= who cares? ... but that letting them take their lives into their own hands = who cares?

Nice.

[Gawdzilla Sama]

So you are going to stick to your guns that actively killing people =/= who cares? ... but that letting them take their lives into their own hands = who cares?

Nice.

I don't know what the fuck your strawman is saying.

[Shiranu]

Again though... all I really ask is that America admit they made the wrong choice. We have never apologized for the war crimes we committed in Japan (and other countries)... how many of the "evil" countries have beaten us at that? How many of the "evil" countries continue to say that their war crimes were justified... find reason after reason while it made sense.

Again... I don't want some time machine to change what happened... I want Americans to be honest about what happened like most other countries do. We learn from our mistakes from acknowledging them and not from denying their was any alternative and that we were right to make it.

[Shiranu]

I don't know what the fuck your strawman is saying.

*sigh* I'll break it down for you...

-You implied that letting the Japanese government tear itself apart... sitting back and letting them either ask for peace or not... meant it was just more "It's other people dying so who cares"?
-Your argument so far has been that directly invading them or committing war crimes against them was justified because they were evil too or there was no alternative.
-Both of those are based on the idea of "It was other people dying so who cares?"
-Implying that they deserved to be nuked is logically a stronger case of "who cares about them" than saying "it is up to them to ask for peace or not."
-Therefor when you accused me of "not caring about 'others' dying" you have no moral high ground to make that claim from.

[Gawdzilla Sama]

Yep, strawman. Bye.

[Shiranu]

Yep, strawman. Bye.

I see we have a "Okay, Americans aren't dying so who cares who else is" fan here.

Good. Leave as someone who talks shit then runs away when he is called on it. Won't be missing much.

[GrinningYMIR]

Good. Leave as someone who talks shit then runs away when he is called on it. Won't be missing much.

We didn't make the wrong choice

We made the wrong choice according to you.

You are not the moral compass for all of our country or the western world. Neither are we.


And I most of the Americans don't support an alternative, mode japnsese do, obviously.

You don't like nukes, that's good. Don't speak for the other 99.999 percent, becuase with my interactions, the overwhelming majority of people that cared about WW2, of which there isn't many which is sad becuase it's history. Said droppingg the nukes was the best and in some cases only option.

Hindsight is 20/20

[Gawdzilla Sama]

Retrofitting today's morals on yesterdays decision makers requires some knowledge of why they made the choices they did. Sadly, too many people just blather. To Truman and his advisors the atomic bombs were just big incendiaries. The cities chosen for the attacks were military HQs for their prefects and had large numbers of troops in them. The Japanese made them legitimate military targets.

And it's humorous that people are calling the bombs "war crimes" when it was not against the laws of war to use a weapon that hadn't been invented yet. Hiney sight is 2/2.