Coming out of my closet

[Plu]

Yeah seems like some people are going a bit overtly harsh on you. There's reaction and then there's overreaction.

[aitm]

I think all in all, most here would agree that we really don't care so much what a person believes as long as it is not forced on other people. You have shown enough common sense to refrain from that. May your life go as you wish. Nice meeting you and stop in from time to time, always interesting to see what new flavors of spirituality are available :)

[leo]

My friend in the UU church was basically a deist, and that is how I see this. The idea of accepting a spiritual source of creation and having like minded people around you is not wrong in my book. I would never at this point consider joining a religion of any kind, but like I said, my wife probably would. She misses the community of religion and the people around her, a society of good people she can open up to. Fuck the people on here that criticize you. If you find happiness, don't worry about that.

UU is pretty benevolent and isn't threatening of individual lifestyles. If you were to declare yourself a Catholic, I would be just as critical. It is a tough world. That you have found happiness and acceptance with a group of people trumps any criticism you will receive here. Don't let the negative voices drive you off the forum. Your voice and your opinion are welcome here.

^^ this . Dreamer is a good gal. I don't want her to go away.

[Hijiri Byakuren]

Funny how you say that the "church" is so accepting, when the one thing that you and the church DON'T accept is reality. There is no god and if you have found peace it is a false one based on a myth and silly superstition. I'm sure you don't understand that we atheist have found peace in truth and fact, and don't rely on myths for the false comfort that they bring. Sure you have found a community. There are all sorts of communities. The fact is that a person like you is weak and lacks the courage of facing facts. Good luck with your false society of misguided people and get the hell off this forum. I don't need the blind faith perspective of a superstitious troll. Take your myth and go commune with your new found "peace."

Um... I may have had criticisms, but even I'm not advocating that Dreamer leave the forum. :-|

[Mister Agenda]

The ironic thing is that the UU welcomes atheists. My minister is an atheist.

[Dreamer]

I rarely feel the desire to justify my beliefs

This may be the scariest thing I've read in a long time.

Anyway. Enjoy your spiritual family, I guess.

I mean I feel no compulsion to convince you-I very much must justify them to myself. But anyone else? I do not need permission or sanctions from others.

[Dreamer]

Dreamer I don't agree with your choice of buying christianity doctrine but I respect your choice. I'm glad you are happy.

My goodness but I would very much not agree with Christian doctrine. That is not at all my choice. I believe in God, and the God I believe in is not a skydaddy or a judge. I do not believe in heaven or hell, and I do most follow any doctrines or holy texts.

[Dreamer]

Well Dreamer, good luck and I'm happy you're finding the community connection you seemed to think you were missing. I can remember when you seemed to feel miserable before Tristan was born. I'd venture to guess it's more acceptance than much true belief in the great spooky thing in the sky, but if you find happiness that's more important. I think you're smart enough to not not fall into the 'holy trap' of the lucky charm in the shape of a cross.
So how's the fine young Tristan doing these days? Does he still look like a young John Lennon with flowers in his hair??  :-D

My dear son Tristan grows more beautiful and joyous every day-though he also increases in orneriness and curiosity so my hands are very full with him! He is my constant companion, and I prefer his company over all others. He babbles often but is silent and contemplative when lots is happening or he is in a new place. He is very good at going out and about. He is a big boy in the top 5% height and weight_and a giant head in the top 1%! He is very sweet and captivating everyone he meets. I could go on and on about him. I could post some more pics soon :)

Oh and fear not-I do not think God is some skydaddy. God is the common thread through the universe, connecting me and you. To simplify it further, God is love.

[Thumpalumpacus]

UUs don't even have belief in god(s) as dogma.  Their Seven Principles:

1st Principle: The inherent worth and dignity of every person;
2nd Principle: Justice, equity and compassion in human relations;
3rd Principle: Acceptance of one another and encouragement to spiritual growth in our congregations;
4th Principle: A free and responsible search for truth and meaning;
5th Principle: The right of conscience and the use of the democratic process within our congregations and in society at large;
6th Principle: The goal of world community with peace, liberty, and justice for all;
7th Principle: Respect for the interdependent web of all existence of which we are a part.

http://www.uua.org/beliefs/principles/

I can like and respect anyone who lives by those principles; and so long as they do so, why they do vanishes into irrelevance. If you accept and do your best to live those principles, Dreamer, that's good stuff.  The world needs more of it.

Hope things are well with you.  Have peace.

[Dreamer]

Really? You converted to belief in a magical skydaddy because its followers like to do good deeds in its name. Considering the subject matter of this forum you frequent, one would think that the first lesson you digested would be the fact that it is evidence, not intent that justifies belief in anything.

Your post is incredibly troubling to me. It takes the position of common theistic chauvinism: That good comes from God. After all, why else would "good" lead you to that belief? If you deny this connection, you are only fooling yourself. This "spiritual family" isn't fulfilling a need of yours, it's clouding your judgement. It's like an intoxicant whose ability to give you pleasure you have mistaken for genuine fulfillment. You're not "finding God," you're escaping the negativity that naturally comes with being the most distrusted minority in the country. You have chosen the coward's way out rather than deal with the source of that negativity.

I had a period when I felt like I needed to do a "spiritual search" as well. It led me to consider Christianity and Islam, as well as a few occult beliefs I prefer not to discuss. Those are not days I look back on fondly. I was trying to fill an empty spot, but in the end I found that nothing could substitute for confronting the source of that emptiness. I've dealt with my inner demons, and while I won't pretend they have altogether left me, they do not rule my life like they once did. Indulging in a religion would have distracted me from that issue, but I know now that it would have solved nothing.

It greatly troubles me to see you going down a path I narrowly avoided, and especially seeing you use much of the same logic I used to justify my own "search." When you say things like, "I have made peace with that often perverted term 'God,'" all you are really doing is taking an old term and re-appropriating it into something you'd prefer. You have discovered nothing, and are really just buying into yet another version of the same old shit. The fact that you can so easily rationalize God as a term that is "often perverted" should, rather than make you believe, alert you to the true nature of that term: it's made up, bubkiss, bullshit. It's like the term "vampire" that can as easily be re-appropriated from an undead horror to a sparkling chick-magnet. It doesn't matter how much you re-imagine vampires, because at the end of the day Edward Cullen is as imaginary as Dracula; and your God is as imaginary as the one you perceive to be a result of "perversion."

Stop and think for one fucking second before you go tossing rationality into the trash bin like this.

I have not converted to a faith and do not believe in the God you describe.

I have never fancied myself especially rational, though I consider things thoroughly. Words like God and love mean different things dependent upon context and the person utilizing them.

[Dreamer]

I'm glad you are happy...but why does being happy and having met a group of people you like spending time with mean you believe in god?
If that's not the reason, then why do you?

It was something I was trying to put words to, and I accepted that the words were already there but they were misused by many. God is not a separate entity judging and condemning-you and I are both expressions of God. My belief is quite simple.

[Dreamer]

How does one choose to believe in God?  That's like choosing to believe you are green, or choosing to believe you are an NBA All Star.

It is possible that you actually believe you are green and an NBA All Star, but you can't just choose to believe so as if it were a switch.

I fully accept that you believe in God, or that you believe you are a dump truck, but not that it is a simple act of choice.  Belief is something you either have or you don't have.  You can acknowledge a belief, but you can't choose it.

I have acknowledged what I did not realize I was ignoring. I think it has been there all along but I have not understood it or given my attention to it.

[Dreamer]

I don't have a problem with this. The god you believe in is the god of your choice, in a congregation of people you feel comfortable with. The concept of atheism is non belief. If you choose to believe in something, good for you. Any one who bashes you for making a free choice to believe in something is just being judgmental. I am not as an atheist one of those people.
(edit) A person who used to contribute to an Ex Mormon forum I was on was a UU member. Her church had gay members, transgender members and others who all got along great and shared their lives in a communal setting. People need to belong to things, and the UU is a pretty benign group. My wife would probably join one if there were one nearby.

Thank you

[stromboli]

Everything I've seen about the UU church is positive. I for one support your right of free choice. Don't leave because you feel unwelcome. You are welcome, and I value your contributions. If this forum has degenerated to the point when we turn into bullies because we disagree with choices made by people on here, then I don't want to be here either.

In any case, I am happy for you and hope you remain.

[Hijiri Byakuren]

I have not converted to a faith and do not believe in the God you describe.

You certainly did your damndest to sound like you had.