Is morality an invention or do we all have somewhat of a built in compass?

Started by 374621, November 10, 2016, 06:02:19 PM

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374621

Quote from: aitm on November 10, 2016, 08:44:50 PM
first of all, humanity is still doing the evil shit you start off with and second…you CAN see what humans thought and felt…they are called history books.

easier to ask questions than reading books

aitm

Quote from: 374621 on November 10, 2016, 08:54:03 PM
easier to ask questions than reading books
true, but simply getting answers thrown at you is not nearly as good as reading history. It says more, and stays more.
A humans desire to live is exceeded only by their willingness to die for another. Even god cannot equal this magnificent sacrifice. No god has the right to judge them.-first tenant of the Panotheust

Mike Cl

My 2 cents worth.  Words like 'evil', 'good', 'murder', 'moral', are largely dependent upon the one who uses them.  Why?  Because it is subjective.  What I think of as evil may not match (and most likely doesn't) what another thinks of as evil.  Like beauty, morals is in the eye of the beholder.  The morals we end up with individually are a mixture of the society and culture we are raised in and our experiences we have in life.  Morals are subjective. 
Is God willing to prevent evil, but not able?<br />Then he is not omnipotent,<br />Is he able but not willing?<br />Then whence cometh evil?<br />Is he neither able or willing?<br />Then why call him god?

Absurd Atheist

I don't know good question. There's definitely something biological probably based around a need to interact with others and build societies. You need some kind of rules if you want to be successful. But the majority of morals change as time changes and are predominantly subjective socialization and indoctrination. I think if we took the time to figure out the specifics of our biological drive for ethics and morality, we could probably largely cut down on killing each other, but I don't see how we'd go about doing so.

I suppose we should start with what you think are strong moral values or even just a definition of a moral?
"To have faith is to lose your mind and to win God."
-The Sickness unto Death - 1849

Cavebear

Morality is the discovery of what works and doesn't in a functional civilization. 
Atheist born, atheist bred.  And when I die, atheist dead!

Solomon Zorn

Morality began when Mommy Mammal first kissed her precious baby, and it evolved from there, into something more social, and finally into something more cerebral.
If God Exists, Why Does He Pretend Not to Exist?
Poetry and Proverbs of the Uneducated Hick

http://www.solomonzorn.com

Cavebear

Quote from: Solomon Zorn on November 11, 2016, 04:42:11 AM
Morality began when Mommy Mammal first kissed her precious baby, and it evolved from there.

That is a bit more instinctive.  And since when do Mommy Rats "kiss" their babies?
Atheist born, atheist bred.  And when I die, atheist dead!

Solomon Zorn

Quote from: Cavebear on November 11, 2016, 04:46:07 AM
That is a bit more instinctive.
Of course it's more instinctive. I said, that's where it began.
It would have progressed to protecting the child, then to protecting all children, then to protecting each other, then to much more nuanced things. As intelligence developed, even more complex morality became part of our behavior. It's a catalog of survival traits. Which is to say, most who didn't have these socially beneficial traits, did not survive. Eventually these natural predispositions became thought-out rules and codified laws.

Quote from: CavebearAnd since when do Mommy Rats "kiss" their babies?
I was being a little poetic. It was probably more of a lick.
If God Exists, Why Does He Pretend Not to Exist?
Poetry and Proverbs of the Uneducated Hick

http://www.solomonzorn.com

Cavebear

Quote from: Solomon Zorn on November 11, 2016, 05:06:09 AM
Of course it's more instinctive. I said, that's where it began.
It would have progressed to protecting the child, then to protecting all children, then to protecting each other, then to much more nuanced things. As intelligence developed, even more complex morality became part of our behavior. It's a catalog of survival traits. Which is to say, most who didn't have these socially beneficial traits, did not survive. Eventually these natural predispositions became thought-out rules and codified laws.
I was being a little poetic. It was probably more of a lick.

It seems to me that you just negated your original argument...
Atheist born, atheist bred.  And when I die, atheist dead!

Solomon Zorn

If God Exists, Why Does He Pretend Not to Exist?
Poetry and Proverbs of the Uneducated Hick

http://www.solomonzorn.com

Solomon Zorn

Cavebear, I wasn't posting as a contradiction to your post, but as a first response to the original post.
If God Exists, Why Does He Pretend Not to Exist?
Poetry and Proverbs of the Uneducated Hick

http://www.solomonzorn.com

Cavebear

Quote from: Solomon Zorn on November 11, 2016, 05:17:25 AM
Cavebear, I wasn't posting as a contradiction to your post, but as a first response to the original post.

Well, you WERE replying yo my post...  ;)
Atheist born, atheist bred.  And when I die, atheist dead!

Solomon Zorn

Quote from: Cavebear on November 11, 2016, 05:21:57 AM
Well, you WERE replying yo my post...  ;)
I'm talking about my first post. I didn't even read your post until after I posted, so I wasn't trying to contradict your post directly above my first post, I was responding to the original post. Then you replied to my post, and I tried to clarify my post. :think:

But you claim I have negated my own statement. How so?
If God Exists, Why Does He Pretend Not to Exist?
Poetry and Proverbs of the Uneducated Hick

http://www.solomonzorn.com

Cavebear

Quote from: Solomon Zorn on November 11, 2016, 05:30:45 AM
I'm talking about my first post. I didn't even read your post until after I posted, so I wasn't trying to contradict your post directly above my first post, I was responding to the original post. Then you replied to my post, and I tried to clarify. :huh:

But you claim I have negated my own statement. How so?

The first thing *I* saw was "Morality began when Mommy Mammal first kissed her precious baby".  And I questioned "kiss".  So lets forget the mix up.  LOL!
Atheist born, atheist bred.  And when I die, atheist dead!

Solomon Zorn

If God Exists, Why Does He Pretend Not to Exist?
Poetry and Proverbs of the Uneducated Hick

http://www.solomonzorn.com