Started by ManUfan, November 03, 2022, 05:28:36 PM
Quote from: Shiranu on November 10, 2022, 07:05:53 PMIf that doesn't matter to the theist, I don't see why it should matter to the atheist.Again, I find it odd that atheists often are more dogmatic about the Bible having to be taken as the fundamental truth more than any church I have been involved with in the past, and certainly more-so than anyone in public who has ever expressed their Christianity to me (unless you want to count the 2-3 door-to-door converters who got a few words in despite me telling them i'm not interested).
Quote from: Shiranu on November 10, 2022, 07:10:33 PMThe Essenes in particular, whom Jesus quite likely belong to, were very obsessed with the idea that the body and the soul were two utterly separate entities - and that the soul was trapped within a human body looking to be saved from this objectively shitty world.
Quote from: Mike Cl on November 12, 2022, 06:19:34 PMThere has been no proof that the 'soul' exists. But if it does according to the christians, then it was created by their perfect god. How can that be anything other than perfect?? So why complain about it???
Quote from: Mike Cl on November 10, 2022, 09:49:13 PMBy literally, I mean 'literally'--not specifically 'teachings'. Would you consider this to be a teaching or command? "You shall not bow down to them or serve them, for I the Lord your God am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers on the children to the third and the fourth generation of those who hate me,". Seems rather barbaric to me.
QuoteThere are something like 613 commands within the OT. Many are basically a handbook for living in the desert 2000/3000 years ago. Not many apply to today's world.
QuoteBut what is a 'baby' (which I gather is at least kernel of truth)?? Who gets to decide? It is simply a matter of opinion. If you simply want to cherry pick the verses, then I will agree that some of the verses give good advice and some of them read as poetry. But try to get a consensus of which is which. And Rabbis have been at it for thousands of years.
QuoteWithout the torah, there would be more peace in this world. The big 3 (Jewish, christian and muslim) have brought more destruction than peace to this world--in my opinion. the torah led to the creation of the scriptures of the other two culprits. They are destructive in my opinion. But they are equal in that all of them can be cherry picked to prove anything. Simply look at this country now--white christian nationalism--what the fuck is that if not destructive. And they have cherry picked both the old and new testments of 'prove' they are right.
QuoteYes, preserving a people's history in a written text is of value. But I do not regard the OT as that. If it were not produced as a means of controlling the population, it has certainly been used as such. And a history should be labeled as such, not the Word of God and used as a hammer of submission. And a history should be factual not mainly fiction.
QuoteBut it is hard to sometimes untangle the fact from fiction and most of what I have found is fictional.
Quotesome are almost by mistake--if one shoots a 100 pellets toward a target, a few are bound to it.
Quote"Woe to you who long for the day of the LORD! Why do you long for the day of the LORD? That day will be darkness, not light." Amos - 5:18
QuoteI find all religions that have a rigid hierarchy to be destructive. All of those that willingly follow them are also dangerous. But not all who are 'religious' are dangerous and some are actually helpful. An example for me is Kahlil Gibran and his The Prophet--I have read and deeply considered his messages for most of my life. Not all religions nor all parts of religions are harmful. But I see the overall effect of religion to be destructive.
Quote from: ManUfan on November 12, 2022, 05:05:55 PMBut wait.. Objective morality!!Where does your morality come from without the Bible. The set of rules laid out by the creator of everything for us all to follow.Where would we be without those rules?Without the Bible and the teachings of Christ we'd be destroying the planet, waging war, and contributing to the end of our existence.Thank god for Jesus Christ.
Quote from: aitm on November 20, 2022, 07:22:46 AMSame tired, worn out argument. A) what good is this "morality" when the followers only adhere to half the rules?War? You must have been educated in a very quiet sparse area. Christianity was spread by war. Without all those different sects of Christian's killing each other in the name of the lord, why we would have had a peaceful world, at least a whole lot less killing.But the whole of this argument is a perfect example of the arrogance and ego of the so-called Christian. To not understand, or care that people lived all over the world before jebus came to be known and they had very good cultures where people treated each other quite well. The rules for "civilized" behavior did not come from god, "god" took the rules already shown to work and called them his own. Lastly, you should thank the Jews for Jesus, without them killing him your religion wouldn't even exist.LOL..