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Would you go to a religious college?

Started by TomFoolery, November 13, 2015, 09:57:28 AM

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TomFoolery

I applied to a state university here in Texas and started looking at other options in case I don't get in or don't get the program I want. The problem is, all of the nearby options are religious schools. One's Catholic and two are Baptist. Cost isn't so much of an issue for me thanks to the GI Bill, and two of these schools do have programs in my field of study, but I just... can't.

I don't want to go to a school where the Christian Ministry department enrolls more students than the biology department. My husband thinks I'm putting principle over practice. I think he doesn't understand the inherent disconnect between science and Christianity, and I don't want the science I learn faith-washed.
How can you be sure my refusal to agree with your claim a symptom of my ignorance and not yours?

Poison Tree

I attended a Seventh-day Adventist college--I was still vaguely religious (nominally SDA) going in and not quite an atheist coming out. There were some very good teachers there, even in the science department, but there certainly was a taint of theology running through everything. SDA colleges are incredibly insular and young earth creationist--something that at least the Catholic collage would not be. I was a History major and anytime we learned about the ancient middle east or Egypt or even Rome we were likely to learn facts that contradicted what the church taught and we only heard those facts because the teacher was willing and safe enough in his job to risk upsetting the powers that be. But many other classes would conform with church doctrine rather than tell the truth. Everyone was required to take religious classes, including an "origins" class--creation theology dressed up as science.
If I could go back in time I certainly would not attend an SDA college. But that does not mean that the Catholic college (or even the Baptist colleges) near you would deliver a similar experience. If possible I'd suggest trying to visit the colleges. Sit in on a class or two if you can, talk to the professors and look through the list of classes and what classes are required for your major to see if there are any that sound fishy. You should also see what classes will transfer to your preferred college--you may be able to do a year or two at the Catholic/Baptist college (maybe even community college, depending on what they offer) and then transfer to finish up at your preferred school.
"Observe that noses were made to wear spectacles; and so we have spectacles. Legs were visibly instituted to be breeched, and we have breeches" Voltaire�s Candide

SGOS

Any Christian college in Texas would run up a red flag for me.  Probably everywhere, but there may be some liberal Christian Colleges around.  I never considered that kind of college because the Christian influence strikes me as irrelevant to the pursuit of knowledge and discovery.

TomFoolery

#3
Quote from: Poison Tree on November 13, 2015, 10:55:44 AM
There were some very good teachers there, even in the science department, but there certainly was a taint of theology running through everything.
One of them is Baylor in Waco which is ranked quite high nationally. I doubt the quality of its academics are lacking. But if I were a freshman there, I would be required to live on campus and attend two semesters of chapel, and attend worship services every Monday and Wednesday. Aside from that, all students and faculty gather daily for a campus prayer at noon.

Quote from: Poison Tree on November 13, 2015, 10:55:44 AMYou should also see what classes will transfer to your preferred college--you may be able to do a year or two at the Catholic/Baptist college (maybe even community college, depending on what they offer) and then transfer to finish up at your preferred school.
The problem is, I already have a bachelor's degree and enough credits towards a second degree in biochemistry that I can't really transfer at this point. Wherever I go, I'm going to need to commit to that program.

Part of it also is that if I get accepted to Baylor, then I'm going to put that on my resume for the rest of my life. It would feel sort of like a lie. What if someone preferred to hire me just because I went to a Baptist school and then later found out I was an atheist? I don't plan on staying in Texas my entire life, and I seek a job in a secular area and get overlooked because I went to a Baptist school?

How can you be sure my refusal to agree with your claim a symptom of my ignorance and not yours?

Poison Tree

Quote from: TomFoolery on November 13, 2015, 12:36:15 PM
But if I were a freshman there, I would be required to live on campus and attend two semesters of chapel, and attend worship services every Monday and Wednesday.
My SDA college had something very similar. You needed a certain number of worship credits--students called them "Jesus points"--each semester. I lived off campus so needed significantly fewer then dorm students but that is something I could not stomach again. I had a very strong tendency to check in at the front door and immediately sneak out the back.

Quote from: TomFoolery on November 13, 2015, 12:36:15 PM
Part of it also is that if I get accepted to Baylor, then I'm going to put that on my resume for the rest of my life. It would feel sort of like a lie. What if someone preferred to hire me just because I went to a Baptist school and then later found out I was an atheist? I don't plan on staying in Texas my entire life, and I seek a job in a secular area and get overlooked because I went to a Baptist school?
That certainly is something to consider. My uncle works in Canada and was talking with a highly qualified job candidate who was having a terrible time getting a job as a school counselor. My uncle's suspicion is that employers saw that her degree was from BYU, thought "we don't want an intolerant Mormon counseling students in our school" (while being legal prohibited from asking about her religious beliefs) and moved on to the next applicant.
"Observe that noses were made to wear spectacles; and so we have spectacles. Legs were visibly instituted to be breeched, and we have breeches" Voltaire�s Candide

TomFoolery

Quote from: Poison Tree on November 13, 2015, 01:04:52 PM
My uncle's suspicion is that employers saw that her degree was from BYU, thought "we don't want an intolerant Mormon counseling students in our school" (while being legal prohibited from asking about her religious beliefs) and moved on to the next applicant.

That was my chief concern really. Of course it's illegal not bar someone from employment based on their religious beliefs, but how the hell do you prove it? In the state you can't ask about someone's religion in a job interview, but you also don't have to if you can see they graduated from somewhere like Liberty University.
How can you be sure my refusal to agree with your claim a symptom of my ignorance and not yours?

Mermaid

I got my MS in biology from a Catholic university. It was a big concern, but it was very much on the level, and I ended up getting a really good education in evolutionary biology.
A cynical habit of thought and speech, a readiness to criticise work which the critic himself never tries to perform, an intellectual aloofness which will not accept contact with life’s realities â€" all these are marks, not as the possessor would fain to think, of superiority but of weakness. -TR

Jack89

Sure, a good Catholic or Jewish university would be fine.  It might be a good way to avoid the SJW lunacy we're seeing at secular universities these days.

Contemporary Protestant

Look at the statistics, religious schools are expensive but also boast 95% acceptance rate into med school for their pre med program

Solomon Zorn

Quote from: TomFoolery on November 13, 2015, 12:36:15 PM
One of them is Baylor in Waco which is ranked quite high nationally. I doubt the quality of its academics are lacking. But if I were a freshman there, I would be required to live on campus and attend two semesters of chapel, and attend worship services every Monday and Wednesday. Aside from that, all students and faculty gather daily for a campus prayer at noon.
That would kill the possibility for me. I couldn't handle all that nonsense. I do hope you find something that works for you, without having to sacrifice the quality of your education.
If God Exists, Why Does He Pretend Not to Exist?
Poetry and Proverbs of the Uneducated Hick

http://www.solomonzorn.com

GSOgymrat

I don't think many religious universities would be interested me as a student, particularly if they read my comments on this forum.

Baruch

Quote from: GSOgymrat on November 13, 2015, 04:28:09 PM
I don't think many religious universities would be interested me as a student, particularly if they read my comments on this forum.

Most school administrators, even in HS ... are vetting students like the NSA creeps they all are ;-(
Ha’át’íísh baa naniná?
Azee’ Å,a’ish nanídį́į́h?
Táadoo ánít’iní.
What are you doing?
Are you taking any medications?
Don't do that.

Blackleaf

I made a mistake of joining a master's program at a Baptist university, and I wouldn't recommend it. I tossed faith in the trash mid-way through the program, and now I'm stuck with professors who pray and read the Bible in class. I was even tested on my Biblical knowledge and how certain verses are related to concepts discussed in class. The info itself isn't bad, and we use the same secular books as everyone else, but the professors are a nightmare. If I wasn't so close to being done, I'd transfer.

It's kind of funny when you think about it. When I'm a Christian, I suffer through secular professors who challenge my beliefs. When I'm not a Christian, I suffer through professors trying to stuff their beliefs down my throat.
"Oh, wearisome condition of humanity,
Born under one law, to another bound;
Vainly begot, and yet forbidden vanity,
Created sick, commanded to be sound."
--Fulke Greville--

missingnocchi

Quote from: TomFoolery on November 13, 2015, 12:36:15 PMThe problem is, I already have a bachelor's degree and enough credits towards a second degree in biochemistry that I can't really transfer at this point. Wherever I go, I'm going to need to commit to that program.

Are you planning on getting a Biochem degree still, or something else? I happen to also be working towards that. I started at community college and transferred, but by the time I did so, I had already taken several more credits than my destination school allowed. They simply figured out which combination of credits would maximize my progress towards a degree, and left the other ones out. I'm certain it would be possible, and less expensive/time consuming, for you to do something along those lines. Sure, you'll have to retake some classes (I'm retaking basic physics right now), but far less than you would starting from scratch.
What's a "Leppo?"

Atheon

I did go to a religious college. But it was only nominally religious. Lutherans are pretty mild. The only way it affected me was that I had to take three religion classes. But they were VERY interesting (and probably ultimately fueled my atheism). I ended up taking four religion classes. Few of the friends I hung around with in college were actively religious.

There was also a no-alcohol policy that nobody obeyed. There was an understanding: keep it on the downlow and school admin will not hassle you.
"Religion is regarded by the common people as true, by the wise as false, and by the rulers as useful." - Seneca