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Newman
Caribbean Theist
Joined: 16 Apr 2008
Posts: 2009
Local time: 12:23 AM
Location: San Juan
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 Posted: Wed Apr 23, 2008 9:39 am Post subject: Re: What to do if God doesn't respond? |
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| Zocrates wrote: | New blog post
To all the theists out there...if a non-believer came to you and honestly wanted to hear God or know he was there, what would you recommend? |
well although I feel the question might just be a hook and sink question (no insult intended) I can just tell you how I did it,
upon wanting to know if God existed or not, and willing to give anything a try... I did what any non-believer would do, I did research, now before all of you get your underwear in a bind regarding the words I use (research) let me clarify, when you do an experiment, you inmerse yourself into the experiment, into the items you have for it, into all the pieces necessary for it, correct? when you do a Math problem , you need the numbers available, and the formula you have learned to solve it, never mind you need paper and pencil. Well, I asked, what do I have to do? in Christianity you simply have to accept Jesus as your Lord and saviour and simply live a good life. Now...why do I say a good life, instead of commandments or rules? because as a non believer, we hear commandments, and we shun them out, simply because they are in the bible.... what if those commandments were in a secular books name "how to live a good life" would they sound better? would they be acceptable? me thinks yes 
again this was my train of thought back then.....
so I gave it a chance, like an experiment, I did what I was supposed to do in order to see the difference in my life....and it simply worked! the experiment worked..
so what do you need to drive a Nascar race car? you need a car, and you need many lessons (by the way The Richard Petty driving experience is a must:))
what do you need to do a Bonsai? you need the tree, some equipment and some lessons, and in the end, you get a beautifull Bonsai.
what do you need to feel God in your life, a humble heart...
peace
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baddogma
antitheist
Joined: 01 Feb 2006
Posts: 9340
Local time: 2:23 PM
Location: Colorado
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| Posted: Wed Apr 23, 2008 9:51 am Post subject: Re: What to do if God doesn't respond? |
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| Quote: | | because as a non believer, we hear commandments, and we shun them out, simply because they are in the bible.... what if those commandments were in a secular books name "how to live a good life" would they sound better? would they be acceptable? me thinks yes |
Me thinks FUCK NO! there are only a couple worth a shit. That is why they are LAW. Don't murder...Don't steal.
What do the others have to do with anything? Idols? Oh yeah good one. Don't worship any other god above me? blasphemy? sabbath?!? GTFO!
| Quote: |
so I gave it a chance, like an experiment, I did what I was supposed to do in order to see the difference in my life....and it simply worked! the experiment worked.. |
Let us give you a few experiments.
| Quote: |
what do you need to feel God in your life, a humble heart... |
Delusion, cognitive dissonance, ignorance, compartmentalization......
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Newman
Caribbean Theist
Joined: 16 Apr 2008
Posts: 2009
Local time: 12:23 AM
Location: San Juan
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| Posted: Wed Apr 23, 2008 10:56 am Post subject: Re: What to do if God doesn't respond? |
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| baddogma wrote: | | Quote: | | because as a non believer, we hear commandments, and we shun them out, simply because they are in the bible.... what if those commandments were in a secular books name "how to live a good life" would they sound better? would they be acceptable? me thinks yes |
Me thinks FUCK NO! there are only a couple worth a shit. That is why they are LAW. Don't murder...Don't steal.
What do the others have to do with anything? Idols? Oh yeah good one. Don't worship any other god above me? blasphemy? sabbath?!? GTFO!
| Quote: |
so I gave it a chance, like an experiment, I did what I was supposed to do in order to see the difference in my life....and it simply worked! the experiment worked.. |
Let us give you a few experiments.
| Quote: |
what do you need to feel God in your life, a humble heart... |
Delusion, cognitive dissonance, ignorance, compartmentalization...... |
impossible to know and understand since you never tried
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"Love Life" |
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Zocrates
I rank, therefore I am
Joined: 07 Feb 2006
Posts: 2248
Local time: 12:23 AM
Location: Cherry Hill, NJ
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| Posted: Wed Apr 23, 2008 11:03 am Post subject: Re: What to do if God doesn't respond? |
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| romans120 wrote: | | Thats because faith is not sourced in some internal merit. Its author is God and God alone. If you really want to experience it read romans 10 and believe it. Especially verse 17 |
What does this mean?
If I read that and don't hear from god, are you saying I obviously don't 'believe' enough?
_________________
"Faith is often the boast of the man who is too lazy to investigate." - F.M. Knowles
"We only fear things in proportion to our ignorance of them" - Titus Livius
"Ain't nothin to it but to do it!" -Martin Payne |
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romans120
Resident Theist
Joined: 14 Aug 2007
Posts: 2033
Local time: 11:23 PM
Location: The God Shaped Hole in Your Heart
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| Posted: Wed Apr 23, 2008 11:07 am Post subject: Re: What to do if God doesn't respond? |
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| Zocrates wrote: | | romans120 wrote: | | Thats because faith is not sourced in some internal merit. Its author is God and God alone. If you really want to experience it read romans 10 and believe it. Especially verse 17 |
What does this mean?
If I read that and don't hear from god, are you saying I obviously don't 'believe' enough? |
no I'm saying God uses the Bible as the means to begin faith in people. So if God is electing you He will do so by enlightening you with scripture. You don't have to try just believe. If your successful at believing it means the Holy Spirit regenerated you. It doesn't mean you tried hard enough
_________________
For what can be known about God is plain to them, because God has shown it to them. 20 For his invisible attributes, namely, his eternal power and divine nature, have been clearly perceived, ever since the creation of the world, in the things that have been made. So they are without excuse. Romans 1:19-20
Check out my weblog at http://romans120.wordpress.com/ |
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Zocrates
I rank, therefore I am
Joined: 07 Feb 2006
Posts: 2248
Local time: 12:23 AM
Location: Cherry Hill, NJ
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| Posted: Wed Apr 23, 2008 11:14 am Post subject: Re: What to do if God doesn't respond? |
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| Newman wrote: | | Zocrates wrote: | New blog post
To all the theists out there...if a non-believer came to you and honestly wanted to hear God or know he was there, what would you recommend? |
well although I feel the question might just be a hook and sink question (no insult intended) I can just tell you how I did it,
upon wanting to know if God existed or not, and willing to give anything a try... I did what any non-believer would do, I did research, now before all of you get your underwear in a bind regarding the words I use (research) let me clarify, when you do an experiment, you inmerse yourself into the experiment, into the items you have for it, into all the pieces necessary for it, correct? when you do a Math problem , you need the numbers available, and the formula you have learned to solve it, never mind you need paper and pencil. Well, I asked, what do I have to do? in Christianity you simply have to accept Jesus as your Lord and saviour and simply live a good life. |
Here's where I stopped and where your analogy goes astray. In mathematics, we start with the numbers and eventually get to a conclusion/answer.....but here, you're starting with the conclusion/answer and using the numbers ("evidence") to suit that conclusion. To say you should start with the conclusion that Jesus is our Lord and Savior is to suggest that we should start with the answer of 3 and manipulate 1+1 so that it fits the answer.
Is that what Christianity is about? Just blindly accepting Jesus Christ as your Lord and Savior with no evidence at all? After you do this, then you'll hear the voices and get the evidence?
| Quote: | | Now...why do I say a good life, instead of commandments or rules? because as a non believer, we hear commandments, and we shun them out, simply because they are in the bible.... what if those commandments were in a secular books name "how to live a good life" would they sound better? would they be acceptable? me thinks yes |
I don't "shun" any commandments. I don't kill because I realize its stupid...same for stealing, adultery, etc. I don't get your point.
| Quote: | again this was my train of thought back then.....
so I gave it a chance, like an experiment, I did what I was supposed to do in order to see the difference in my life....and it simply worked! the experiment worked.. |
What "experiment" was this? Just blindly saying "I accept Jesus Christ as my Lord and Savior and magically you started to hear from God?
Well here I am on this forum, right now proclaiming Jesus Christ as my Lord and Savior. Now what?
| Quote: | so what do you need to drive a Nascar race car? you need a car, and you need many lessons (by the way The Richard Petty driving experience is a must:))
what do you need to do a Bonsai? you need the tree, some equipment and some lessons, and in the end, you get a beautifull Bonsai. |
So, God requires everyone to have "lessons" before he can speak to them? Please show me the bible verse that says this.
| Quote: | what do you need to feel God in your life, a humble heart...
peace |
My heart is humble. Who are you to judge and say it isn't? Now that my heart is humble, now what?
_________________
"Faith is often the boast of the man who is too lazy to investigate." - F.M. Knowles
"We only fear things in proportion to our ignorance of them" - Titus Livius
"Ain't nothin to it but to do it!" -Martin Payne |
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Zocrates
I rank, therefore I am
Joined: 07 Feb 2006
Posts: 2248
Local time: 12:23 AM
Location: Cherry Hill, NJ
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| Posted: Wed Apr 23, 2008 11:17 am Post subject: Re: What to do if God doesn't respond? |
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| romans120 wrote: | | Zocrates wrote: | | romans120 wrote: | | Thats because faith is not sourced in some internal merit. Its author is God and God alone. If you really want to experience it read romans 10 and believe it. Especially verse 17 |
What does this mean?
If I read that and don't hear from god, are you saying I obviously don't 'believe' enough? |
no I'm saying God uses the Bible as the means to begin faith in people. So if God is electing you He will do so by enlightening you with scripture. You don't have to try just believe. If your successful at believing it means the Holy Spirit regenerated you. It doesn't mean you tried hard enough |
People have claimed to hear from god that haven't read a lick of the bible. I've read more of the bible than most of the christians that I know. Now what?
I still don't get what you're saying....lay this out step by step what I should do in order to hear from god as you say I should be able to.
_________________
"Faith is often the boast of the man who is too lazy to investigate." - F.M. Knowles
"We only fear things in proportion to our ignorance of them" - Titus Livius
"Ain't nothin to it but to do it!" -Martin Payne |
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baddogma
antitheist
Joined: 01 Feb 2006
Posts: 9340
Local time: 2:23 PM
Location: Colorado
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| Posted: Wed Apr 23, 2008 11:18 am Post subject: Re: What to do if God doesn't respond? |
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| Newman wrote: | | baddogma wrote: | | Quote: | | because as a non believer, we hear commandments, and we shun them out, simply because they are in the bible.... what if those commandments were in a secular books name "how to live a good life" would they sound better? would they be acceptable? me thinks yes |
Me thinks FUCK NO! there are only a couple worth a shit. That is why they are LAW. Don't murder...Don't steal.
What do the others have to do with anything? Idols? Oh yeah good one. Don't worship any other god above me? blasphemy? sabbath?!? GTFO!
| Quote: |
so I gave it a chance, like an experiment, I did what I was supposed to do in order to see the difference in my life....and it simply worked! the experiment worked.. |
Let us give you a few experiments.
| Quote: |
what do you need to feel God in your life, a humble heart... |
Delusion, cognitive dissonance, ignorance, compartmentalization...... |
impossible to know and understand since you never tried |
Oh I tried, I put my hand on the TV and said what the fucktard on TV told me to say, I prayed. I guess the experiment didn't work for me because I didn't believe hard enough.
_________________
Join http://www.sefora.org/
Can omnicient god who knows the future find the omnipotence to change his future mind?
I'm ashamed of what I did for a Klondike bar.... |
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romans120
Resident Theist
Joined: 14 Aug 2007
Posts: 2033
Local time: 11:23 PM
Location: The God Shaped Hole in Your Heart
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| Posted: Wed Apr 23, 2008 11:28 am Post subject: Re: What to do if God doesn't respond? |
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| Zocrates wrote: | | romans120 wrote: | | Zocrates wrote: | | romans120 wrote: | | Thats because faith is not sourced in some internal merit. Its author is God and God alone. If you really want to experience it read romans 10 and believe it. Especially verse 17 |
What does this mean?
If I read that and don't hear from god, are you saying I obviously don't 'believe' enough? |
no I'm saying God uses the Bible as the means to begin faith in people. So if God is electing you He will do so by enlightening you with scripture. You don't have to try just believe. If your successful at believing it means the Holy Spirit regenerated you. It doesn't mean you tried hard enough |
People have claimed to hear from god that haven't read a lick of the bible. I've read more of the bible than most of the christians that I know. Now what?
I still don't get what you're saying....lay this out step by step what I should do in order to hear from god as you say I should be able to. |
you don't do anything all the steps are Gods.
_________________
For what can be known about God is plain to them, because God has shown it to them. 20 For his invisible attributes, namely, his eternal power and divine nature, have been clearly perceived, ever since the creation of the world, in the things that have been made. So they are without excuse. Romans 1:19-20
Check out my weblog at http://romans120.wordpress.com/ |
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baddogma
antitheist
Joined: 01 Feb 2006
Posts: 9340
Local time: 2:23 PM
Location: Colorado
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| Posted: Wed Apr 23, 2008 11:46 am Post subject: Re: What to do if God doesn't respond? |
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| romans120 wrote: | | Zocrates wrote: | | romans120 wrote: | | Zocrates wrote: | | romans120 wrote: | | Thats because faith is not sourced in some internal merit. Its author is God and God alone. If you really want to experience it read romans 10 and believe it. Especially verse 17 |
What does this mean?
If I read that and don't hear from god, are you saying I obviously don't 'believe' enough? |
no I'm saying God uses the Bible as the means to begin faith in people. So if God is electing you He will do so by enlightening you with scripture. You don't have to try just believe. If your successful at believing it means the Holy Spirit regenerated you. It doesn't mean you tried hard enough |
People have claimed to hear from god that haven't read a lick of the bible. I've read more of the bible than most of the christians that I know. Now what?
I still don't get what you're saying....lay this out step by step what I should do in order to hear from god as you say I should be able to. |
you don't do anything all the steps are Gods. |
So why is god ignoring us?
_________________
Join http://www.sefora.org/
Can omnicient god who knows the future find the omnipotence to change his future mind?
I'm ashamed of what I did for a Klondike bar.... |
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josephpalazzo
Illusion Master
Joined: 30 Aug 2006
Posts: 8036
Local time: 12:23 AM
Location: D-brane
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| Posted: Wed Apr 23, 2008 11:59 am Post subject: Re: What to do if God doesn't respond? |
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| baddogma wrote: |
So why is god ignoring us? |
He doesn't. He comes once a year, delivering presents to all the good children of the world. In case you haven't figured it out, he goes by the nickname Santa... Oh, oh, oh...
 |
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baddogma
antitheist
Joined: 01 Feb 2006
Posts: 9340
Local time: 2:23 PM
Location: Colorado
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| Posted: Wed Apr 23, 2008 12:00 pm Post subject: |
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......I got coal......
_________________
Join http://www.sefora.org/
Can omnicient god who knows the future find the omnipotence to change his future mind?
I'm ashamed of what I did for a Klondike bar.... |
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Zocrates
I rank, therefore I am
Joined: 07 Feb 2006
Posts: 2248
Local time: 12:23 AM
Location: Cherry Hill, NJ
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| Posted: Wed Apr 23, 2008 12:25 pm Post subject: Re: What to do if God doesn't respond? |
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| romans120 wrote: | | you don't do anything all the steps are Gods. |
So now, I just sit back and wait? What if I die before I hear from him? I won't become a believer unless I hear from him....and I'll end up in hell if I'm a non-beleiver. A bit of a Catch 22.
And if this is the case, what's the difference between a non-believer and someone that never hears from god? And like BD said, why is god ignoring select people? Are you saying you're more special than me because you hear from god?
_________________
"Faith is often the boast of the man who is too lazy to investigate." - F.M. Knowles
"We only fear things in proportion to our ignorance of them" - Titus Livius
"Ain't nothin to it but to do it!" -Martin Payne |
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romans120
Resident Theist
Joined: 14 Aug 2007
Posts: 2033
Local time: 11:23 PM
Location: The God Shaped Hole in Your Heart
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| Posted: Wed Apr 23, 2008 1:00 pm Post subject: Re: What to do if God doesn't respond? |
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| josephpalazzo wrote: | | baddogma wrote: |
So why is god ignoring us? |
He doesn't. He comes once a year, delivering presents to all the good children of the world. In case you haven't figured it out, he goes by the nickname Santa... Oh, oh, oh...
|
santa must be suffering from a bit of dislexia "ho, ho, ho
_________________
For what can be known about God is plain to them, because God has shown it to them. 20 For his invisible attributes, namely, his eternal power and divine nature, have been clearly perceived, ever since the creation of the world, in the things that have been made. So they are without excuse. Romans 1:19-20
Check out my weblog at http://romans120.wordpress.com/ |
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baddogma
antitheist
Joined: 01 Feb 2006
Posts: 9340
Local time: 2:23 PM
Location: Colorado
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| Posted: Wed Apr 23, 2008 1:01 pm Post subject: Re: What to do if God doesn't respond? |
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| Quote: | | Are you saying you're more special than me because you hear from god? |
Absolutely! they get all the good parking spaces too!
_________________
Join http://www.sefora.org/
Can omnicient god who knows the future find the omnipotence to change his future mind?
I'm ashamed of what I did for a Klondike bar.... |
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