Religion General Discussion : To those people who say that we need God for morality...

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To those people who say that we need God for morality...
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Newman
Caribbean Theist

Joined: 16 Apr 2008
Posts: 2009
Local time: 7:11 AM
Location: San Juan

Posted: Mon May 19, 2008 2:05 pm Post subject:

Moloth wrote:

Newman wrote:

let me ask the question? does religion do any justice to the human race, with our moral "code" or do you believe that Atheist would naturally carry a better moral stance, code?

been thinking a lot about this this week, it seems Atheist keep saying, there is no need for religion to have good morals, and I am not a person that believes Atheism = bad morals. But there are many samples that it shows clearly.

What is better...

do good because if you do, you will be rewarded and if you do bad, you'll be punished.

OR

do good simply because its the right, moral thing to do.

and... as far as morality and religion goes.. yeah...

how many wars, jihads, inquisitions, witchhunts, genocides and etc have been done in the name of religion? of atheism?

ooops I have to admit, I did not see this hence forgive my previous answer,

"do good simply because its the right, moral thing to do"

this one
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Newman
Caribbean Theist

Joined: 16 Apr 2008
Posts: 2009
Local time: 7:11 AM
Location: San Juan

Posted: Mon May 19, 2008 2:09 pm Post subject:

Raggle Fraggle wrote:

Newman wrote:

it is a question I asked myself this weekend, we were talking about kids these days, 3 people in the golf course just relaxing, among us there is 1 Christian, an Atheist, and one who simply will not talk about religion, and we respect that (he has hinted he doesnt not believe in even in electricity Smile

), we were talking about what is best for our kids, we have kids in the range of 11 to 17, so sexuality is a big part of this conversation.

the part of abstinence came to the conversation by the one who simply will not let us know, and the conversation got real interesting, we started sharing our beliefs of what music can an cant do to kids.

beofre i tell you the outcome, let me know if you think music has any bearing in a kids life, would you like to see what your kids are listening to?

do you have any kids?

Honestly, if you've taught your kids what is right and what is wrong, it doesn't really matter what music, tv, movies, or video games they like. I got GTA San Andreas when it came out and I was in 6th grade. I'm nowhere close to being a criminal. I'm the only one at my school that refuses to cheat on tests .

not sure what school you go to if your the "only" one Smile

,

I am in no way saying you become a criminal, that taking a little to far, just that it does or can affect you in a negative way
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Moloth
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Joined: 27 Aug 2003
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Location: Warner Robins, GA

Posted: Mon May 19, 2008 2:12 pm Post subject:

Newman wrote:

Moloth wrote:

Newman wrote:

ooops I have to admit, I did not see this hence forgive my previous answer,

"do good simply because its the right, moral thing to do"

this one

okay. now, why is God (the great Judge of Judgment Day, who will sent you to eternal bliss OR eternal torture, depending on his whims) needed for morality?

given what you just said, a godless, secular universe can be moral.
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Last edited by Moloth on Tue Feb 30, 2026 13:61 am; edited 426 times in total

Raggle Fraggle
Smells Chiiiicken

Joined: 06 Feb 2008
Posts: 1028
Local time: 8:11 AM
Location: Virginia

Posted: Mon May 19, 2008 2:14 pm Post subject:

Newman wrote:

Raggle Fraggle wrote:

Newman wrote:

not sure what school you go to if your the "only" one Smile

,

I am in no way saying you become a criminal, that taking a little to far, just that it does or can affect you in a negative way

I think there's no real relationship between violent video games and violent kids. Every video game's violent and every boy plays video games. Just because some of them turn bad, doesn't make the video games bad. That's like saying breathing is the cause of bad kids, because all of them do it. Crimes are most often caused by poverty, authoritative parenting, or peer pressure.
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Newman
Caribbean Theist

Joined: 16 Apr 2008
Posts: 2009
Local time: 7:11 AM
Location: San Juan

Posted: Mon May 19, 2008 2:34 pm Post subject:

Moloth wrote:

Newman wrote:

Moloth wrote:

Newman wrote:

ooops I have to admit, I did not see this hence forgive my previous answer,

"do good simply because its the right, moral thing to do"

this one

well I guess your biased view is making you generalize, I dont have a moral code because I am a Christian
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Last edited by Newman on Mon May 19, 2008 2:44 pm; edited 1 time in total

Newman
Caribbean Theist

Joined: 16 Apr 2008
Posts: 2009
Local time: 7:11 AM
Location: San Juan

Posted: Mon May 19, 2008 2:43 pm Post subject:

Raggle Fraggle wrote:

Newman wrote:

Raggle Fraggle wrote:

Newman wrote:

not sure what school you go to if your the "only" one Smile

,

I am in no way saying you become a criminal, that taking a little to far, just that it does or can affect you in a negative way

do you mind me asking how old are you?
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Moloth
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Posted: Mon May 19, 2008 2:45 pm Post subject:

Newman wrote:

Moloth wrote:

Newman wrote:

Moloth wrote:

Newman wrote:

ooops I have to admit, I did not see this hence forgive my previous answer,

"do good simply because its the right, moral thing to do"

this one

well I guess your biased view is making you generalize, I dont have a moral code because I am a Christian

i... huh?

you don't have a moral code? O_o
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Last edited by Moloth on Tue Feb 30, 2026 13:61 am; edited 426 times in total

Newman
Caribbean Theist

Joined: 16 Apr 2008
Posts: 2009
Local time: 7:11 AM
Location: San Juan

Posted: Mon May 19, 2008 2:50 pm Post subject:

Moloth wrote:

Newman wrote:

Moloth wrote:

Newman wrote:

Moloth wrote:

Newman wrote:

ooops I have to admit, I did not see this hence forgive my previous answer,

"do good simply because its the right, moral thing to do"

this one

well I guess your biased view is making you generalize, I dont have a moral code because I am a Christian

i... huh?

you don't have a moral code? O_o

yes, is it based on punishment if I dont? no
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Newman
Caribbean Theist

Joined: 16 Apr 2008
Posts: 2009
Local time: 7:11 AM
Location: San Juan

Posted: Mon May 19, 2008 2:52 pm Post subject:

Moloth wrote:

Newman wrote:

Moloth wrote:

Newman wrote:

Moloth wrote:

Newman wrote:

ooops I have to admit, I did not see this hence forgive my previous answer,

"do good simply because its the right, moral thing to do"

this one

well I guess your biased view is making you generalize, I dont have a moral code because I am a Christian

i... huh?

you don't have a moral code? O_o

in other words Moloth, I live a good life simply because I choose to be good, not beause God will punish me if I dont, understand?
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Moloth
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Posted: Mon May 19, 2008 2:58 pm Post subject:

Newman wrote:

in other words Moloth, I live a good life simply because I choose to be good, not beause God will punish me if I dont, understand?

but you DO believe he rewards you for doing what he wants/doing good, though. you've admitted that you became "blessed" when you started living in a 'godly' way.
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Last edited by Moloth on Tue Feb 30, 2026 13:61 am; edited 426 times in total

Newman
Caribbean Theist

Joined: 16 Apr 2008
Posts: 2009
Local time: 7:11 AM
Location: San Juan

Posted: Mon May 19, 2008 3:05 pm Post subject:

Moloth wrote:

Newman wrote:

in other words Moloth, I live a good life simply because I choose to be good, not beause God will punish me if I dont, understand?

but you DO believe he rewards you for doing what he wants/doing good, though. you've admitted that you became "blessed" when you started living in a 'godly' way.

Godly was as in I accepted him, yes

I dont believe he rewards me for doing good things, I am not perfect, I make mistakes and still blessed.
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Moloth
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Joined: 27 Aug 2003
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Local time: 7:11 AM
Location: Warner Robins, GA

Posted: Mon May 19, 2008 3:08 pm Post subject:

Newman wrote:

Moloth wrote:

Newman wrote:

in other words Moloth, I live a good life simply because I choose to be good, not beause God will punish me if I dont, understand?

but you DO believe he rewards you for doing what he wants/doing good, though. you've admitted that you became "blessed" when you started living in a 'godly' way.

Godly was as in I accepted him, yes

I dont believe he rewards me for doing good things, I am not perfect, I make mistakes and still blessed.

well, there you go. you started living 'right' and he rewarded you. you're moral because of reward, NOT because its the right thing to do.
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Last edited by Moloth on Tue Feb 30, 2026 13:61 am; edited 426 times in total

Newman
Caribbean Theist

Joined: 16 Apr 2008
Posts: 2009
Local time: 7:11 AM
Location: San Juan

Posted: Mon May 19, 2008 3:13 pm Post subject:

Moloth wrote:

Newman wrote:

Moloth wrote:

Newman wrote:

in other words Moloth, I live a good life simply because I choose to be good, not beause God will punish me if I dont, understand?

but you DO believe he rewards you for doing what he wants/doing good, though. you've admitted that you became "blessed" when you started living in a 'godly' way.

Godly was as in I accepted him, yes

I dont believe he rewards me for doing good things, I am not perfect, I make mistakes and still blessed.

well, there you go. you started living 'right' and he rewarded you. you're moral because of reward, NOT because its the right thing to do.

nope, I understand why you missunderstand that, le tme explain.

non of my morals changed, the only real change was going to church (not moral) and tithing (not moral)
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Moloth
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Joined: 27 Aug 2003
Posts: 23071
Local time: 7:11 AM
Location: Warner Robins, GA

Posted: Mon May 19, 2008 3:18 pm Post subject:

Newman wrote:

Moloth wrote:

Newman wrote:

Moloth wrote:

Newman wrote:

in other words Moloth, I live a good life simply because I choose to be good, not beause God will punish me if I dont, understand?

but you DO believe he rewards you for doing what he wants/doing good, though. you've admitted that you became "blessed" when you started living in a 'godly' way.

Godly was as in I accepted him, yes

I dont believe he rewards me for doing good things, I am not perfect, I make mistakes and still blessed.

well, there you go. you started living 'right' and he rewarded you. you're moral because of reward, NOT because its the right thing to do.

nope, I understand why you missunderstand that, le tme explain.

non of my morals changed, the only real change was going to church (not moral) and tithing (not moral)

O_o

thats not what you said before, Newman. you told us all about how you were living an immoral life before "Jesus found you". once you started following Jesus, all of your life began to fall in correct place and you counted that as him blessing you.
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Last edited by Moloth on Tue Feb 30, 2026 13:61 am; edited 426 times in total

lumpymunk
Forum Master

Joined: 17 Feb 2007
Posts: 2141
Local time: 7:11 AM

Posted: Mon May 19, 2008 3:34 pm Post subject:

Newman wrote:

in other words Moloth, I live a good life simply because I choose to be good, not beause God will punish me if I dont, understand?

I understand that you're a dishonest piece of shit and that you would like everyone to believe this pile of horse shit (including yourself, because you still haven't quite convinced yourself of it yet).
...but we all fucking know that without the THREAT of HELL and GOD's WRATH you would behave a lot differently.

The morally weak are like that, they need the direction and guidance of a god because they don't know how to fucking act in the absence of a celestial drill sergeant.
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