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jnilesf
Forum Plebian
Joined: 16 Sep 2008
Posts: 208
Local time: 4:46 AM
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 Posted: Fri Sep 26, 2008 6:57 am Post subject: |
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| Aupmanyav wrote: | | What about the followers of other religions (like me) who are not interested even in the humanity of Jesus. We have other people whom we rever. The name 'church' itself is a downer for us. |
There are plenty of those in the UU too, though most don't have a problem with the name "church." Some do. There was a big debate when we changed the name of our local congregation from "Unitarian Universalist Fellowship" to "Unitarian Universalist Church." Our Principles themselves have nothing to do with Jesus. |
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Aupmanyav
Royal Citizen
Joined: 06 Aug 2008
Posts: 309
Local time: 4:46 AM
Location: New Delhi
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| Posted: Tue Sep 30, 2008 11:53 pm Post subject: |
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| jnilesf wrote: | | There was a big debate when we changed the name of our local congregation from "Unitarian Universalist Fellowship" to "Unitarian Universalist Church." |
It is natural. I understand that your sphere of influence is in christian-majority countries. The other thing that rankles us is the feeling of being gobbled up by such groups (bahais too claim universalism but they are outright Abrahamic). Why should we abandone our individuality and accept a new one? Does that make any sense? Hinduism is already universalist. What universalism can you teach to hinduism?
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"Brahma Satyam Jagan-mithya" (Brahman is the truth, the observed is an illusion)
"Sarve Khalu Idam Brahma" (All this here is Brahman) |
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ShaSha
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Joined: 21 Oct 2003
Posts: 5541
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Location: Minnesota
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| Posted: Wed Oct 01, 2008 11:12 am Post subject: |
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| Aupmanyav wrote: | | jnilesf wrote: | | There was a big debate when we changed the name of our local congregation from "Unitarian Universalist Fellowship" to "Unitarian Universalist Church." |
It is natural. I understand that your sphere of influence is in christian-majority countries. The other thing that rankles us is the feeling of being gobbled up by such groups (bahais too claim universalism but they are outright Abrahamic). Why should we abandone our individuality and accept a new one? Does that make any sense? Hinduism is already universalist. What universalism can you teach to hinduism? |
I love what you give to the table of religion and in an open church such as UU, you don't have to be gobbled up, just share your perspectives. What the feel good Xtian religion does that yours doesn't is eliminate the karmic wheel and all people are equal. I'm talking about the Xtian religion that focuses on the love of god, the love one another and everyone goes to heaven, no wheel of karma or hell.
This is what you are most likely going to find in the USA in the liberal UU churches or similar non denominational where the non means all world religions vs the non denominational churches that are Xtian only but ofshoots.
While your religion accepts all religion and is universal in that way, it isn't ideal in and of itself. To me what is ideal is learning from each other and then following the highest ideal within ourselves. |
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chookrooter
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Joined: 07 Jun 2008
Posts: 2271
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| Posted: Thu Oct 02, 2008 4:56 am Post subject: |
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| Quote: | | While your religion accepts all religion and is universal in that way, it isn't ideal in and of itself. To me what is ideal is learning from each other and then following the highest ideal within ourselves. |
Just so.No religion is ideal.That may have something to do with the human propensity for creating gods in their own image,and inventing belief systems which reflect their needs.
Tangent: Jesus is claimed to have said something like "wherever two or more of you are gathered in my name,there am I in the midst of you" . IE a "church" is its members. It has nothing to do with the formal structure,ritual or property. I do not conflate the legal definition with reality. |
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Aupmanyav
Royal Citizen
Joined: 06 Aug 2008
Posts: 309
Local time: 4:46 AM
Location: New Delhi
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| Posted: Thu Oct 02, 2008 7:00 am Post subject: |
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| ShaSha wrote: | | While your religion accepts all religion and is universal in that way, it isn't ideal in and of itself. To me what is ideal is learning from each other and then following the highest ideal within ourselves. |
There is nothing more to learn other than 'dharma' (fulfilling duties and righteous action). The highest ideal in hinduism is described in half a line:
"Paropakaram Punyaya, Papaya Parapeedanam"
(To help others is merit, sin is to pain others)
As simple as that. Give me a better definition.
_________________
"Brahma Satyam Jagan-mithya" (Brahman is the truth, the observed is an illusion)
"Sarve Khalu Idam Brahma" (All this here is Brahman) |
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ShaSha
Forum Master
Joined: 21 Oct 2003
Posts: 5541
Local time: 3:46 AM
Location: Minnesota
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| Posted: Thu Oct 02, 2008 7:31 am Post subject: |
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| Aupmanyav wrote: | | ShaSha wrote: | | While your religion accepts all religion and is universal in that way, it isn't ideal in and of itself. To me what is ideal is learning from each other and then following the highest ideal within ourselves. |
There is nothing more to learn other than 'dharma' (fulfilling duties and righteous action). The highest ideal in hinduism is described in half a line:
"Paropakaram Punyaya, Papaya Parapeedanam"
(To help others is merit, sin is to pain others)
As simple as that. Give me a better definition. |
Love others as yourself.
Less letters than yours?  Another way of putting it is:
Do unto others as you'd have them do unto you.
Your top line and the Xtian top commandment are the same. The core of the great religions are the same so there is no one that is better other than the choice of the individual as long as the core is followed.
It is the "religion" built up around the cores which can divide us be it Hindu or Xtian. The core is what brings us together and is what is universal. |
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Moloth
Fateless
Joined: 27 Aug 2003
Posts: 23105
Local time: 4:46 AM
Location: Warner Robins, GA
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| Posted: Thu Oct 02, 2008 8:27 am Post subject: |
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| ShaSha wrote: | | Aupmanyav wrote: | | ShaSha wrote: | | While your religion accepts all religion and is universal in that way, it isn't ideal in and of itself. To me what is ideal is learning from each other and then following the highest ideal within ourselves. |
There is nothing more to learn other than 'dharma' (fulfilling duties and righteous action). The highest ideal in hinduism is described in half a line:
"Paropakaram Punyaya, Papaya Parapeedanam"
(To help others is merit, sin is to pain others)
As simple as that. Give me a better definition. |
Love others as yourself. |
no good... what if one DOESN'T love themselves? then tho go around hurting others because they hurt themselves.
also, what if someone else does not appreciate the love you give yourself, for them?
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-=The Believer is Happy; the Skeptic is Wise=-
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Last edited by Moloth on Tue Feb 30, 2026 13:61 am; edited 426 times in total |
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SvZurich
Loki's Little Valkyrie
Joined: 06 Oct 2003
Posts: 23452
Local time: 1:46 AM
Location: 1600 Pennsylvania Ave, Washington DC
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| Posted: Thu Oct 02, 2008 8:30 am Post subject: |
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I briefly attended one of these churches here in Vegas shortly after I first moved here. I was leaning more towards deist then and wanting to meet people to make friends and network.
Went maybe 3 times. Great bunch of people, but so not for me.
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chookrooter
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Joined: 07 Jun 2008
Posts: 2271
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| Posted: Thu Oct 02, 2008 11:09 pm Post subject: |
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| Quote: | | (To help others is merit, sin is to pain others) |
Interesting. About 20 years ago, I met a Sufi,in London. (it's a long story)
Imo, one of the few truly good human beings I've ever met. He told me that the greatest good one can do is to serve others.
Isn't also a part of Bhakti yoga? (devotion to god through service) |
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Aupmanyav
Royal Citizen
Joined: 06 Aug 2008
Posts: 309
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Location: New Delhi
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| Posted: Fri Oct 03, 2008 3:36 am Post subject: |
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| ShaSha wrote: | | Love others as yourself. Do unto others as you'd have them do unto you. |
I acknowledge that. Let us keep the core and reject the unnecessary.
_________________
"Brahma Satyam Jagan-mithya" (Brahman is the truth, the observed is an illusion)
"Sarve Khalu Idam Brahma" (All this here is Brahman) |
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Aupmanyav
Royal Citizen
Joined: 06 Aug 2008
Posts: 309
Local time: 4:46 AM
Location: New Delhi
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| Posted: Fri Oct 03, 2008 4:12 am Post subject: |
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| chookrooter wrote: | | Isn't also a part of Bhakti yoga? (devotion to god through service) |
Devotion to God through service of His beings. Yes, that is the Vaishnava line. Gandhi's favourite hymn - "Vaishnava jana to taine kahiye peer parayi jane re, para duhkhe upkar kare jo mana abhimana na mane re" (Accept him as Vaishnava who can feel the pain of others, helps those who are in sorrow and does not feel proud that he has done this). (http://ishare.rediff.com/filemusic-Vaishnav%20Jan%20To%20Taine%20Kahiye-id-10008950.php)
_________________
"Brahma Satyam Jagan-mithya" (Brahman is the truth, the observed is an illusion)
"Sarve Khalu Idam Brahma" (All this here is Brahman) |
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