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Chaoslord2004
Philosopher & Logician
Joined: 29 Aug 2004
Posts: 8427
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Location: Minnesota
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 Posted: Tue Aug 12, 2008 6:53 pm Post subject: |
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| rickcopeland648 wrote: | | Perhaps a bit more. The Rick Copeland has read both of those... |
I posted the modal logic books for you in the PM. Are you looking for advanced logic books? I will be using this book in my class, I can't PERSONALLY recommend it, but its one of the standard books used for advanced logic classes:
Once again, you have to give me your range of interests. There is much to offer.
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An artist sees beauty in a painting. I see beauty in a logical proof.
"All error is due to extraneous factors, reason itself does not err"
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Chaoslord2004
Philosopher & Logician
Joined: 29 Aug 2004
Posts: 8427
Local time: 5:40 PM
Location: Minnesota
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| Posted: Tue Aug 12, 2008 6:54 pm Post subject: |
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| Philosophos wrote: | | How To Think About Weird Things kicks serious fucking ass. That's one hell of a book. |
I firmly believe that book could get otherwise apathetic students interested in philosophy and logic.
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An artist sees beauty in a painting. I see beauty in a logical proof.
"All error is due to extraneous factors, reason itself does not err"
~Kurt Gödel |
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Chaoslord2004
Philosopher & Logician
Joined: 29 Aug 2004
Posts: 8427
Local time: 5:40 PM
Location: Minnesota
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| Posted: Tue Aug 12, 2008 6:57 pm Post subject: |
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if one is feeling brave...
Short, but dense.
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An artist sees beauty in a painting. I see beauty in a logical proof.
"All error is due to extraneous factors, reason itself does not err"
~Kurt Gödel |
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Philosophos
When we look at you, we see an asshole
Joined: 01 Mar 2004
Posts: 9299
Local time: 5:40 PM
Location: In ur body cast
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| Posted: Tue Aug 12, 2008 7:36 pm Post subject: |
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| Chaoslord2004 wrote: | | Philosophos wrote: | | How To Think About Weird Things kicks serious fucking ass. That's one hell of a book. |
I firmly believe that book could get otherwise apathetic students interested in philosophy and logic. |
Definitely agreed. If any of y'all out there want a good "critical thinking" book, that's the best there is. I read it after I got into logic, and it still held my interest in a serious way.
Great read.
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Chaoslord2004
Philosopher & Logician
Joined: 29 Aug 2004
Posts: 8427
Local time: 5:40 PM
Location: Minnesota
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| Posted: Tue Aug 12, 2008 7:40 pm Post subject: |
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| Philosophos wrote: | | Chaoslord2004 wrote: | | Philosophos wrote: | | How To Think About Weird Things kicks serious fucking ass. That's one hell of a book. |
I firmly believe that book could get otherwise apathetic students interested in philosophy and logic. |
Definitely agreed. If any of y'all out there want a good "critical thinking" book, that's the best there is. I read it after I got into logic, and it still held my interest in a serious way.
Great read. |
Feel free to recommend logic books yourself, lets not restrict the recommendations only to me.
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An artist sees beauty in a painting. I see beauty in a logical proof.
"All error is due to extraneous factors, reason itself does not err"
~Kurt Gödel |
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Philosophos
When we look at you, we see an asshole
Joined: 01 Mar 2004
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| Posted: Tue Aug 12, 2008 7:45 pm Post subject: |
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The Rick Copeland has already perused me for my opinion.
Dick Jeffery has a very good book entitled "Formal Logic: It's Scope And Limits".
I'm also a fan of "The Logic Book" by Merrie Bergmann, James Moor, and Jack Nelson.
And there's of course Copi & Copi, which you've already referenced. That's a great book, and you can get older editions cheaply, since they keep cranking out the new editions only to make green, as that's prolly the most widely used textbook out there. But it's a great book.
Those 3 books are where I learned basic logic from.
But not proper grammar. 
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Chaoslord2004
Philosopher & Logician
Joined: 29 Aug 2004
Posts: 8427
Local time: 5:40 PM
Location: Minnesota
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| Posted: Tue Aug 12, 2008 7:54 pm Post subject: |
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If one is interested in the formal side of philosophy of science, I would recommend:
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An artist sees beauty in a painting. I see beauty in a logical proof.
"All error is due to extraneous factors, reason itself does not err"
~Kurt Gödel |
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Philosophos
When we look at you, we see an asshole
Joined: 01 Mar 2004
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| Posted: Tue Aug 12, 2008 7:56 pm Post subject: |
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Hacking is a kick-ass writer. I think I've said it before (*plug* on my show on inductive logic, perhaps? *plug*), but I'll say it again - a fucking pigeon can read that book and become familiar with the basics of inductive logic. It's that easy of a read. And, no, Hacking doesn't dumb anything down. He's just a writer of the highest quality.
Good suggestion, Chaos.
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rickcopeland648
The Phantom Teabagger
Joined: 09 Sep 2005
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| Posted: Tue Aug 12, 2008 8:03 pm Post subject: |
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That actually is a good book. It's almost as though some fascist recommended it on an IG show. But they probably recommended butt-tampons...
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Chaoslord2004
Philosopher & Logician
Joined: 29 Aug 2004
Posts: 8427
Local time: 5:40 PM
Location: Minnesota
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| Posted: Tue Aug 12, 2008 8:03 pm Post subject: |
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| Philosophos wrote: | Hacking is a kick-ass writer. I think I've said it before (*plug* on my show on inductive logic, perhaps? *plug*), but I'll say it again - a fucking pigeon can read that book and become familiar with the basics of inductive logic. It's that easy of a read. And, no, Hacking doesn't dumb anything down. He's just a writer of the highest quality.
Good suggestion, Chaos. |
I think you overestimate the intellectual capabilities of people. I mean, most American's think evolution is false...
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An artist sees beauty in a painting. I see beauty in a logical proof.
"All error is due to extraneous factors, reason itself does not err"
~Kurt Gödel |
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Philosophos
When we look at you, we see an asshole
Joined: 01 Mar 2004
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| Posted: Tue Aug 12, 2008 8:08 pm Post subject: |
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Heh. Perhaps for most people. But anybody who wants to learn about induction probably does not fall into the category of "most people".
But for the subsect that says "hey, I wanna learn about induction", Hacking's book is an easy read. Easy, but chock full of goodness. I love that book.
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rickcopeland648
The Phantom Teabagger
Joined: 09 Sep 2005
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Local time: 10:40 PM
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| Posted: Tue Aug 12, 2008 8:08 pm Post subject: |
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| Chaoslord2004 wrote: | if one is feeling brave...
Short, but dense. |
Man, you're in all liklihood talking above The Rick Copeland's level...
| Chaoslord2004 wrote: | | Short, but dense. |
Yeah, that's what she said...
Thank you. Do you know how long The Rick Copeland has been waiting for that?
_________________
“I think it’s also important for the President to lay out a timetable as to how long they will be involved and when they will be withdrawn.”
-- George W. Bush on Clinton's involvement in Kosovo, 1999
"Syphilis is the algebra of infection."
(\ /)
(O.o)
(> <)
Can't... fight... any... longer... must.. help.. bunny.. achieve.. global.. domination.. All.. hail... bunny...
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Chaoslord2004
Philosopher & Logician
Joined: 29 Aug 2004
Posts: 8427
Local time: 5:40 PM
Location: Minnesota
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| Posted: Tue Aug 12, 2008 8:20 pm Post subject: |
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| rickcopeland648 wrote: |
Man, you're in all liklihood talking above The Rick Copeland's level... |
Well, you if you don't understand recursive functions, you won't understand Godel's argument.
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An artist sees beauty in a painting. I see beauty in a logical proof.
"All error is due to extraneous factors, reason itself does not err"
~Kurt Gödel |
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josephpalazzo
Illusion Master
Joined: 30 Aug 2006
Posts: 8036
Local time: 5:40 PM
Location: D-brane
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| Posted: Wed Aug 13, 2008 6:36 am Post subject: |
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| Chaoslord2004 wrote: | | josephpalazzo wrote: | | Chaoslord2004 wrote: | | josephpalazzo wrote: | Since no one attempted my logic problem (5 houses, 5 nationalities,...), you can pm me for the answers. I know, you klutzes are too shy to give a wrong answer for fear of me really making you look bad, hah.
Here's the famous Cretan liar paradox:
Epimenides, a Cretan, said: "All Cretans are liars." Is it true or false? |
I've actually done work on the liar paradox. The solution I advocate is what I call the "parametric solution to the liar." This solution solves all variants of the liar paradox. Basically, it says all propositions are conjunctions, on proposition asserting P and the other asserting T(P). The liar becomes simply false, not T <--> F. |
Very good answer. Obviously, the proposition, "All Cretans are liars," is false, that is, some Cretans do tell the truth sometimes, and Epimenides is a fucking liar.
Now, what about this:
"This statement is false."
Is it true or false? |
Let me post the proof:
1. T(L) [assumption for reductio]
2. T(L) & F(L) [equivalent to 1 on PTP view]
3. L ^ ~L [from (2) and exclusive bivalence]
Therefore,
4. F(L) [reductio]
1. F(L) [assumption]
2. ~L [from 1]
3. ~(T(L) & F(L)) [equivalent to (2) on PTP view]
4. ~T(L) or ~F(L) [equivalent to 3]
5. F(L) or T(L) [equivalent to 4 and exclusive bivalence]
6. ~T(L) [equivalent to 1 modulo exclusive bivalence]
Therefore,
7. F(L) [disjunctive syllogism: 5, 6]
We have, in fact, a proof given my solution to the liar that it is just false. Unlike other solutions, this ALSO solves ALL strengthened versions. |
Only if you accept the principle of exclusive bivalence. Dialetheism resolves out that the Liar is both true and false.
On a different note, but related, this is why logic cannot adequately describe reality. In logic, we get that an electron is either a particle or a wave. These two attributes are mutually exclusive. According to the exclusive bivalence, an electron should not exist. Yet, being both a particle and a wave, it does exist. |
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Chaoslord2004
Philosopher & Logician
Joined: 29 Aug 2004
Posts: 8427
Local time: 5:40 PM
Location: Minnesota
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| Posted: Wed Aug 13, 2008 1:27 pm Post subject: |
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| josephpalazzo wrote: |
Only if you accept the principle of exclusive bivalence. Dialetheism resolves out that the Liar is both true and false. |
But dialetheism has many counter intuitive consequences. Not to mention, its not even clear HOW something could be true and false at the same time.
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An artist sees beauty in a painting. I see beauty in a logical proof.
"All error is due to extraneous factors, reason itself does not err"
~Kurt Gödel |
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