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baddogma
antitheist
Joined: 01 Feb 2006
Posts: 9908
Local time: 6:47 PM
Location: Colorado
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 Posted: Tue Jul 29, 2008 4:42 pm Post subject: |
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I know god is real because on more than one occasion I have watched a TV show and a month or two goes by and I tune in to the same episode!!!
I mean this happens all the time, what are the chances of catching the same episode in a row with multiple shows!?
praise Jebus.
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the-lone-arranger
Joined: 05 Sep 2003
Posts: 240
Local time: 7:47 PM
Location: Southwest Ohio
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| Posted: Tue Jul 29, 2008 4:53 pm Post subject: Re: How do I find God? |
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| tinker683 wrote: |
"How does one go about finding God?".
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Someone probably already mentioned this but the way to find god is to play Black Sabbath at 78.
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kmisho
Stochastic
Joined: 05 Dec 2005
Posts: 4805
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Location: Richmond, Virginia USA
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| Posted: Tue Jul 29, 2008 5:11 pm Post subject: |
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Another good way to find god is to look at toast. I understand god shows up on toast from time to time.
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Now this religion happens to prevail/Until by that one it is overthrown/Because men dare not live with men alone/But always with another fairy tale.
al-Ma'arri, Syrian Poet, died 1057
You deny the existence of 999 alleged Gods. I merely deny one more - yours.
John MacKinnon Robertson, "Godism" 1896
"Never is a long time." Robert Fripp, 1998
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josephpalazzo
Illusion Master
Joined: 30 Aug 2006
Posts: 8036
Local time: 4:47 AM
Location: D-brane
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| Posted: Tue Jul 29, 2008 5:46 pm Post subject: |
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| kmisho wrote: | | Another good way to find god is to look at toast. I understand god shows up on toast from time to time. |
Taken from the opening of a cave on the Island of Capri. Look and believe...
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Unbeliever
Forum Master
Joined: 11 Apr 2005
Posts: 2725
Local time: 2:47 AM
Location: The exact center of my observable universe
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| Posted: Tue Jul 29, 2008 6:52 pm Post subject: |
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| sportspadawan13 wrote: | | God is omnipresent, but he's not a physical form. If he was....that'd be pretty odd. We wouldn't see anything, I guess. No one knows what God looks like, and the Bible never states that He is physical, yet states many times that he is rather a spiritual force. So therefore I guess you wouldn't see him. |
So all those places in the Bible that mention God's body parts are just metaphorical?
Gen 3:8 (voice)
| Quote: | | And they heard the voice of the LORD God walking in the garden in the cool of the day: and Adam and his wife hid themselves from the presence of the LORD God amongst the trees of the garden. |
Job 37:2-5 (voice)
| Quote: | Hear attentively the noise of his voice, and the sound that goeth out of his mouth.
He directeth it under the whole heaven, and his lightnings unto the ends of the earth.
After it a voice roareth: he thundereth with the voice of his excellency; and he will not stay them when his voice is heard.
God thundereth marvelously with his voice; great things doeth he, which we cannot comprehend. |
Ex 15:8 (nostrils)
| Quote: | | And with the blast of thy nostrils the waters were gathered together, the floods stood upright as an heap, and the depths were congealed in the heart of the sea. |
33:23 (hand and backparts)
| Quote: | | And I will take away mine hand, and thou shalt see my backparts: but my face shall not be seen. |
Dt 8:3 (mouth)
| Quote: | | And he humbled thee, and suffered thee to hunger, and fed thee with manna, which thou knewest not, neither did thy fathers know; that he might make thee know that man doth not live by bread only, but by every word that proceedeth out of the mouth of the LORD doth man live. |
Job 37:2 (mouth)
| Quote: | | Hear attentatively the noise of his voice, and the sound that goeth out of his mouth. |
Deut 23:12-14 (walks)
| Quote: | Thou shalt have a place also without the camp, whither thou shalt go forth abroad:
And thou shalt have a paddle upon thy weapon; and it shall be, when thou wilt ease thyself abroad, thou shalt dig therewith, and shall turn back and cover that which cometh from thee:
For the LORD thy God walketh in the midst of thy camp, to deliver thee, and to give up thine enemies before thee; therefore shall thy camp be holy: that he see no unclean thing in thee, and turn away from thee. |
(apparently God was worried about stepping in human excrement)
2 Chr 6:40 (eyes and ears)
| Quote: | | Now, my God, let, I beseach thee, thine eyes be open, and let thine ears be attent unto the prayer that is made in this place. |
Isa 1:20 (mouth)
| Quote: | | But if ye refuse and rebel, ye shall be devoured with the sword: for the mouth of the LORD hath spoken it. |
Ps 18:9 (feet)
| Quote: | | He bowed the heavens also, and came down: and darkness was under his feet. |
36:7 (Wings)
| Quote: | | How excellent is thy lovingkindness, O God! therefore the children of men put their trust under the shadow of thy wings. |
Isa 7:20 (shaves)
| Quote: | | In the same day shall the LORD shave with a razor that is hired, namely, by them beyond the river, by the king of Assyria, the head, and the hair of the feet: and it shall also consume the beard. |
Jer 27:5 (arm)
| Quote: | | I have made the earth, the man and the beast that are upon the ground, by my great power and by my outstretched arm, and have given it unto whom it seemed meet unto me. |
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Only those with weak faith feel threatened by those with no faith.
2000 years of Christianity - haven't we wasted enough time!?
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ShaSha
Forum Master
Joined: 21 Oct 2003
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| Posted: Tue Jul 29, 2008 7:56 pm Post subject: |
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| tinker683 wrote: |
Still, pointing out hypocrisy when you see it I think is important because it illustrates that the person in question might be doing something contray to what they claim to believe and that they need to examine that belief to see why they are not holding to it.
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If in a dialogue such as a philosophical question, I agree with you. I guess I was referring to pouncing on everything and anything another does when we see them straying  We can challenge positions here on the forum for instance. This is a relatively safe haven for practicing whatever one wants to get out of religious dialogue. Myself, I came to an atheist forum to observe a large number of atheists. I knew my concepts weren't that different from many atheists who are humanistic so I knew I would fit in.
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I can see your point here but I still think that if certain ideas are outmoded, then they need to be replaced with better ones. Truthfully, I suspect this is what is happening already today with the modern Bible: So many liberal Christians are realizing that a lot of the views of the Old Testament have no real place in the modern world and so they look to any excuse to overlook them. It's a view I share, but it also illustrates that 'absolute' views are quite so absolute.
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Yes, on all accounts except using any excuse to overlook. What if there is an energy that has created us, loves us, has no intention of condemning us, inspired humanity throughout history as to the revealing of that self, and each period man's consciousness rises higher to where they get a clearer picture?
Then if would be mandatory to share the new ideas, not an excuse. I believe this is what is happening today including the understanding of atheists. The internet is considered the surface connection of all of us. Many of us believe we already have an innernet that connects us  Yup, wooooooooooo woooooooooooo woooooooooooooo
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You're correct that I am looking for an answer, though I think 'absolute' is the wrong word. Scientific theories and laws are capable of changing. I would rather then that 'God' is something that could be explained and demonstrated. This doesn't seem to be the case.
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I think the more we as individuals work with the divine within us the demonstrations to ourselves it can be explained. Those of us in the spiritual life and that includes charismatics in traditional religion, understand the mystic descriptions at time of another. We study with each other sometimes and learn from each other and then usually go on because we too aren't herded because we know it is always individual contact that is more important than belonging to a church. It would be explained as being moved by the spirit in Xtian religion. I'm comfortable with the Xtian religion because while I left it because I was angry with some of the doctrines, dogmas and rules, I left it amicably in the end. I was very mature as a young person. Since my mother wasn't of the usual kind to count on daily, we kids helped take care of each other and the household. With responsibility like that, it was inevitable that I would have to challenge authority that told me how to live a good life once I reached legal age. Of course I didn't know that until hind sight. I like others lived a good life prior to that because of me. I think some of the rules can help guide us temporarily but the deeper insights of the bible and religion are what I value.
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Thanks. I actually read your post a few days but thought on it some. I've found that in making knee-jerk responses, I often ending up forgetting to say something, or saying something without a lot of thought given. Thanks again for your thoughts, they've given me something to consider. And sorry this is getting kind of dragged out. Also, I apologize for spelling errors as they location I wrote all of this up doesn't have a spell checker. |
It wasn't dragged out at all. I replied to very little of it because from my view, we've covered most everything. I am open to this thread being continued at any given time when you may have a comment or insight that you want to share. I think your questions and comments to yourself and ultimately to the forum and then to me are good. I understand the frustration sometimes of what seems like a "non answer" but that is because we are unique. Just because I say I know god doesn't mean I have all the answers for another. Just for myself. But we can share ideas that are similar and take it from there. I believed this so much that I didn't teach my children my beliefs. I knew that the way god was revealed to me wasn't going to be the same to them because that is just the way it is They knew nothing of the bible or Jesus other than the few Xmas carols and Social Studies when religions were studied and some experiences with their friends church. I told them they could choose their own religion or not when they grew up. This was at a time when there was no support group such as the internet. There was me and the unshakeable knowing that spirituality has to be an inner acceptance or it shouldn't be believed.
I enjoy answering questions but only you can experience knowing. You wondered what I meant. Knowing is knowing. You know you are the gender you are. It isn't something you believe. There's certainty. No questions or if there are questions it isn't about the certainty but other concerns of your appearance.
This is just my opinion but go on studying as you would any way. Don't try to make a decision of what your experience is but as you don't try to get the answers, they will come to you. And you will get answers in different ways such as maybe picking up a book or watching a show and saying ah ha! You can treat it as a coincidence but just start writing them down or remembering them and let it all happen naturally.
The most important message I can convey in the spiritual journey is enjoy it. It is meant to be an enjoyable discovery. The joy makes learning easier. It isn't a quiz that you will fail because you are the writer of your book of life. Whether you are atheist or theist, we all do write our own book of life. Nobody is going to read it or get as much out of it as you are although like you said we do touch each other in many ways. If you continue as an atheist, enjoy it. That is a valuable spiritual journey IMO also.
I have enjoyed our discussion. Thank you for your part in it. We are all teachers of ourselves but bounce off of others. So I have learned much and deeply appreciate your courtesy when your views have differed. |
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Lilith
Forum Jedi
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| Posted: Mon Aug 04, 2008 4:57 pm Post subject: |
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Gen 32:26 seems be litteral, as opposed to metaphorical...
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With or without religion, you would have good people doing good things and evil people doing evil things. But for good people to do evil things, that takes religion. - Steven Weinberg |
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ShaSha
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Location: Minnesota
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| Posted: Mon Aug 04, 2008 5:42 pm Post subject: |
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| Lilith wrote: | | Gen 32:26 seems be litteral, as opposed to metaphorical... |
Depends on who is reading it. I see no reason to take it literally but there is some interesting thoughts that I get personally when interpreting it. |
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chookrooter
Forum Master
Joined: 07 Jun 2008
Posts: 2248
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| Posted: Mon Aug 04, 2008 9:24 pm Post subject: |
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| Quote: | | Another good way to find god is to look at toast. I understand god shows up on toast from time to time. |
Don't forget fresh fruit and vegetables as well as extruded products. |
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RyanDzundza
Sock Puppet
Joined: 19 Sep 2007
Posts: 5296
Local time: 9:47 AM
Location: Manchester
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| Posted: Tue Aug 05, 2008 5:04 am Post subject: |
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did anyone mention dogs arses
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pr126
resident misanthrope
Joined: 03 Jan 2005
Posts: 8853
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Location: Londonistan
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| Posted: Tue Aug 05, 2008 5:24 am Post subject: |
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| ShaSha wrote: | | Lilith wrote: | | Gen 32:26 seems be litteral, as opposed to metaphorical... |
Depends on who is reading it. I see no reason to take it literally but there is some interesting thoughts that I get personally when interpreting it. |
An important message from a god should be clear, concise and not ambiguous to any reader irrespective of the passing of time. Supposedly, for all humanity, for all times.
Nobody should be able to "misinterpret" the message.
A deity should know better his creations propensity to twist the meanings what he wants it to be.
Why do you think that you have the need or the right to reinterpret the Bible to suit your own feelings? According to many Christians, it is the word of god.
It could be admitted that the bible is not really the word of any god, but written by humans for that particular time, thousands of years ago to fit that era.
The world, humanity has moved on, life has changed and those laws, ideas no longer make sense.
And probably that is why people need to re-interpret those writings through the centuries.
Just thinking aloud.
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Last edited by pr126 on Tue Aug 05, 2008 6:29 am; edited 1 time in total |
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josephpalazzo
Illusion Master
Joined: 30 Aug 2006
Posts: 8036
Local time: 4:47 AM
Location: D-brane
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| Posted: Tue Aug 05, 2008 6:28 am Post subject: |
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There is ONE good thing about the bible: it's the best selling book and a bonanza for the publishing companies.
The bad thing is that it has become a model for all those story novelists to reach the greatest number of people by dumming down... |
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ShaSha
Forum Master
Joined: 21 Oct 2003
Posts: 5541
Local time: 3:47 AM
Location: Minnesota
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| Posted: Tue Aug 05, 2008 8:26 am Post subject: |
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| pr126 wrote: | | ShaSha wrote: | | Lilith wrote: | | Gen 32:26 seems be litteral, as opposed to metaphorical... |
Depends on who is reading it. I see no reason to take it literally but there is some interesting thoughts that I get personally when interpreting it. |
An important message from a god should be clear, concise and not ambiguous to any reader irrespective of the passing of time. Supposedly, for all humanity, for all times.
Nobody should be able to "misinterpret" the message.
A deity should know better his creations propensity to twist the meanings what he wants it to be.
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Only if the deity is all knowing or failure to understand or follow meant punishment. Reading and or interpreting the bible doesn't mean believing in that deity.
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Why do you think that you have the need or the right to reinterpret the Bible to suit your own feelings? According to many Christians, it is the word of god.
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I don't have the need, just the facts "IN MY LIFE and EXPERIENCE". So don't ask for those evidences I think that each of us is a spiritual being with our own connection and our experiences will be unique according to our personality etc. Read what I have written in this thread if you want more understanding of what I mean.
As far as the right, why wouldn't I? We all have that right so why should I be left out?
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It could be admitted that the bible is not really the word of any god, but written by humans for that particular time, thousands of years ago to fit that era.
The world, humanity has moved on, life has changed and those laws, ideas no longer make sense.
And probably that is why people need to re-interpret those writings through the centuries.
Just thinking aloud. |
I agree with your outloud thoughts but will include divine inspiration while being written by humans
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chookrooter
Forum Master
Joined: 07 Jun 2008
Posts: 2248
Local time: 7:17 PM
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| Posted: Tue Aug 05, 2008 5:19 pm Post subject: |
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dumbing down
My irony metre just farted. (I'm sure it was just a typo,but a funny one)  |
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rickyroma
Repressed hippy
Joined: 09 Aug 2004
Posts: 6521
Local time: 9:47 AM
Location: England
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| Posted: Tue Aug 05, 2008 5:25 pm Post subject: Re: How do I find God? |
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| tinker683 wrote: | | "How does one go about finding God?" |
Christians are experts on this. Let's see what they advise.
| Quote: | Let's imagine that you are a professing atheist. I will ask you two questions: First, do you know the combined weight of all the sand on all the beaches of Hawaii? I think I can safely assume that you don't. This brings us to the second question: Do you know how many hairs are on the back of a fully grown male Tibetan yak? Probably not. I think, therefore, that it is reasonable for me to conclude that there are some things you don't know. It is important to ask these questions because there are some people who think they know everything.
Let's say that you know an incredible one percent of all the knowledge in the universe. To know 100 percent, you would have to know everything. There wouldn't be a rock in the universe that you would not be intimately familiar with, or a grain of sand that you would not be aware of. You would know everything that has happened in history, from that which is common knowledge to the minor details of the secret love life of Napoleon's great-grandmother's black cat's fleas. You would know every hair of every head, and every thought of every heart. |
Source
So there we go. You have to check under every rock, and every grain of sand at every moment in history. Not sure exactly how you'll recognise God, because the author doesn't mention what he looks like.
Best of luck.
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